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Jasmine LP-2.0MK II vs Lehmann Audio Black Cube SE

slippers-on said:
The Destiny 2 is a looker with that polished chrome face plate.... and from what I've read it has MOSFETS which I like. Have you ever considered one of these units? The Evolution 2 can be had for a price close to the Brio-R.
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Yes, there was an Evolution 2 sitting close to the Brio-R in the room where I first heard the Brio-R. Gavin could probably tell you as the dealer I bought my Brio-R from is one of his favs. Last I saw they had an Evolution 2 just inside the first sound room on the left, second shelf down on the rack. Very nice indeed. I prefer the overall sound of the Brio-R to Evolution 2 but I could live with it. The Destiny is in yet another league. Not more musical than the Brio-R but it has more resolution and power.
 
John Lee Hooker was next on up and against my expectations and of what I’d previously heard, the Jasmine was actually much happier with this kind of program material. On Backstabbers Robert Cray’s guitar seemed to stand a little further forward in the mix than I’m used to hearing but the effect was not unpleasant in fact it was the opposite. Cousins bass that underpins the track was nicely present and very agile and John Lee Hookers voice has a lot of reverb, the Jasmine gave some nice insight into either the space it was recorded in or the skill of the engineer. Either way it was a captivating performance and not at all where I was expecting the Jasmine to shine. Playing the same track again with the Black Cube in place though I felt I was missing none of the detail I’d heard on the Jasmine, bass notes were just as agile and definitely more solid and forceful. What I did appreciate was the better imaging the Lehmann, I was never in doubt as to where the musicians where supposed to be located in the virtual space before me, I had to concentrate just a little harder with the Jasmine. In terms of musicality there was actually not too much to choose between the two, where the Jasmine gave slightly more bite in the treble that made me sit up and listen the Lehmann seemed a to sound a lot more solid. This was a close one but I think the Black Cube shaded the Jasmine getting to the heart of the music a little better and capturing the atmosphere and feeling just a little more charimatically.

More to come.
 
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slippers-on said:
The Destiny 2 is a looker with that polished chrome face plate.... and from what I've read it has MOSFETS which I like. Have you ever considered one of these units? The Evolution 2 can be had for a price close to the Brio-R.
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The Destiny 2 is one of the sweetest amps I've heard with no hint of grain or transistor hardness but enough wallop to be pretty adept at most genres of music, its presentation is like a valve amp but with transistor punch. I feel like I lucked out with this one.
 
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Spektre said:
The Destiny 2 is one of the sweetest amps I've heard with no hint of grain or transistor hardness but enough wallop to be pretty adept at most genres of music, its presentation is like a valve amp but with transistor punch. I feel like I lucked out with this one.
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Like a valve amp with transistor punch= hybrid sound? Well MOSFETS transistors certainly give a warmer texture which some say reminds them of tubes.
 
Just posting to express my gratitude for this comparison: I was about to get the Jasmine. I had some suspicions from other reviews, but this one confirms it: that the Jasmine may undo some of the sonic character of my system that I've worked hard to get to. Thanx, Spek.
 
The MS Phonomena II has moved up the list for me.....I still am interested in the Jasmine. But reading many reviews the Phonomena II is very quiet and all the dip switch combinations are nice.
 
Actually the Jasmine for its price category is not a bad stage. Gavin certainly does not think it's bad from reading his review. while the Cube SE should be and is a better stage considering its price point and engineering, that's not a strike at the Jasmine but good marks for it considering how good it did things well. Considering ones gear list is certainly a factor in other components we buy. When I ran all Rotel Seperates, I used a Bel Canto DAC 2.5 that cost more than the Rotel amp and preamp which suggested the engineering was and should be well above the Rotel. Well it was apparent once I put in the DAC....the Rotel pre Dumbed down what the Bel Canto could do. I know this because I used it with another pre more in the class of the Bel Canto and it was a different story. I also discovered the Rotel gear was out classed by my Musical Fidelity X-RAY as well. Once I went to a more apples to apples comparison, detail was much more noticeable. I am not suggesting lesser priced gear can't pass detail in a system that is in a higher class...that would be foolish...but I am suggesting that sometimes we have to expect and do receive better engineering once we move up the chain. but we know that is not always true 100 percent of the time. From looking at Gavins turntable and arm' I would bet that it's getting every bit of detail out of the SE and could pass every bit of detail and engineering from a stage costing three times as much.
 
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Snoober said:
Just posting to express my gratitude for this comparison: I was about to get the Jasmine. I had some suspicions from other reviews, but this one confirms it: that the Jasmine may undo some of the sonic character of my system that I've worked hard to get to. Thanx, Spek.
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From my experience you are spot on it and you are also welcome.
 
Probably about 90% of my LP collection and 75% of my CD’s are classical. I used to attend a lot of concerts back in the UK (not so much since I’ve been stateside, the Eugene Symphony are no Vienna Phil) so I was eager to assess the timbre palette and dynamic capabilities of each of these pre-amps. I chose to listen to the first movement of the Sinfonia Antarctica by Vaughan Williams recorded by the LPO and directed by Bernard Haitink, it’s a beautifully constructed recording with great ambience, dynamics and a tremendous sense of depth. Starting with the Jasmine I was keen to hear if it could convey the startling dynamics in the introduction and deliver the two huge orchestral crescendos with the conviction I’m used to. This it certainly did but during the build up too this I noted that on a couple of occasions the violins became almost screechy, I had to remind myself I had a Shure M97 bolted into the SME. Also the soundstaging became a bit disorganized when things got busy so I tried to focus more on the overall presentation, in this respect it didn’t lack any drama. Replacing the Jasmine with the Black Cube order was restored and I could clearly delineate what each section of the orchestra was contributing, but I now started to have doubts as to whether the Lehmann could match the power of the Jasmine given its lower volume output. I wasn’t disappointed however, the Creek/ Lehmann combination not only delivered the full force of the orchestra there was more dynamic difference between fortepiano and fortissimo piano. I didn’t feel I needed to check my CD in order to confirm what I’d just heard but I did anyway, at no point did it sound like a recording by Supraphon or Melodiya I’d experienced via the Jasmine.

Final part and conclusion to follow.
 
Okay onto the final record I used in this shoot out, the second album (1984) from avant-garde composer and artist Laurie Anderson Mr Heartbreak, it’s a standout album in my opinion both for its strange poetic content and its superb production values, I selected Sharkey’s Day as my main test track. There are some very sharp and raspy guitar sounds throughout Sharkey’s Day and the Jasmine gave these a little extra edge, in some ways the unpolished treble of the Jasmine was really adding to the quirkiness of the whole thing and it seemed totally in character with the whole tone of the album. The other standout aspect of the Jasmine was the pace at which it was racing through, you couldn’t accuse it of sounding lethargic. Again I was stuck by the slight forwardness of Laurie Andersons vocals, the very same effect I’d noticed on Ray Of Light the Jasmine certainly enhances female vocals somewhat, but its not to its detriment. This was the Jasmines second best showing during the session. Back to the Black cube and the pattern that was emerging was that the Lehmann had a more detailed lower midrange, certainly better bass extension, solidity and outright thwack. Again there was no ambiguity with the organization and layering of the soundstage and the portrayal of depth much more convincing. The Lehmann is no slouch when it comes to pace either, only fractionally slower than the Jasmine on this track. Don’t make the mistake of thinking the Black Cube makes vinyl sound warm and cuddly, I could see a lot of people being uncomfortable with its forthright honesty.
 
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Its job is done, at least for now. Michell Orbe Se, SME V and Shure M97XE.

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slippers-on said:
May I ask why the shure cart with that table? Why not a nice wood body?
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Thats a good question, they are not an obvious match perhaps. Originally I'd bought it for a vintage Lenco I have downstairs, I then screwed up the head shell wiring trying to mount the Shure so I bolted it in the Michell just for laughs. Previously I've been using an AT95 with a replacement hyper elliptical stylus, its been a cheap stand in till my Delos arrives. Anyway I haven't bothered to refit the Audio Tech and the Shure is definitely a more sophisticated cart if a little dark in character.

The Orbe also has a fairly dark character, from all I've read about wood bodies it may just compound this but I'm willing to try anything once, a Koetsu perhaps? The Delos will be the subject of a future review by the way.
 
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In conclusion is the Jasmine LP-2.0 MK II good phono stage ? In certain areas such as detail, resolution and speed yes absolutely. Its also a more exciting sounding phono stage than the Project’s I’d used previously, one of them the highly praised and well received Tube Box SE II which I thought was very bland sounding. Does it fit my system well and is it better than the Black Cube SE ? A definite no, I feel it would be a couple of steps back and its performance is not as even or as correct as the Lehmann. I prefer its extra solidity, stability, better extended bass and sweeter midrange. Is it a giant killer ? As it comes out of the box a definite no, but I believe with some internal modification it does have potential. Do I need to tell you what I think of Norbert Lehmann’s Black Cube? I think not.
 
Art K. said:
Why a wood body? You are still running a 2M Black correct? My Blue is still doing a dandy job.
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Hi Art! I mentioned wood body as a reference point seeing they start at $350 and go up from there into 1K and above. The cart and table seems to be odd. Most with that caliber of hi end table and arm which cost $5k+, would not have a $70. cart. I do know that cart has a huge following, but most of those have vintage Technics or something similar. The 2M Black is doing just fine, and sometime early next year I will mate it with a better phono amp. I think I can do better than the Grado Phono 1...I believe the Grado stymies the 2M Black.

Edit: Speaking of the 2M Blue, how does it do with not cleaning your vinyl? I mention for 2 reasons.....its easy to go through carts faster than expected as well as ware on vinyl faster if they are dirty, and the Spin clean would solve the problem of ware on both. I am thinking of purchasing the replacement stylus for the Blue to put on the 2M Red when I get it back. I will run it on my second table. I loaned it out to Catcher10. It did not go well in his system. I believe it may be due to his phono amp, but he says thats not the problem...perhaps its just not compatible. The Red is brighter than all of the carts in the 2M series, but I had no problems with ear bleeds or fatigue with it in my system.
 
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Spektre said:
Thats a good question, they are not an obvious match perhaps. Originally I'd bought it for a vintage Lenco I have downstairs, I then screwed up the head shell wiring trying to mount the Shure so I bolted it in the Michell just for laughs. Previously I've been using an AT95 with a replacement hyper elliptical stylus, its been a cheap stand in till my Delos arrives. Anyway I haven't bothered to refit the Audio Tech and the Shure is definitely a more sophisticated cart if a little dark in character.

The Orbe also has a fairly dark character, from all I've read about wood bodies it may just compound this but I'm willing to try anything once, a Koetsu perhaps? The Delos will be the subject of a future review by the way.
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I believe you have the perfect fit with the Lyra. Dark nature table... wood may not be a good fit. You may even do well with an Ortofon Cadenza Bronze. After a while, with those high dollar carts and what they can do....you may be looking around to upgrade the Cube SE.
 
Spektre said:
In conclusion is the Jasmine LP-2.0 MK II good phono stage ? In certain areas such as detail, resolution and speed yes absolutely. Its also a more exciting sounding phono stage than the Project’s I’d used previously, one of them the highly praised and well received Tube Box SE II which I thought was very bland sounding. Does it fit my system well and is it better than the Black Cube SE ? A definite no, I feel it would be a couple of steps back and its performance is not as even or as correct as the Lehmann. I prefer its extra solidity, stability, better extended bass and sweeter midrange. Is it a giant killer ? As it comes out of the box a definite no, but I believe with some internal modification it does have potential. Do I need to tell you what I think of Norbert Lehmann’s Black Cube? I think not.
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Thanks...and such a splendid job with the shoot out.
 
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