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Last tracks are skipping

D

dubs79

New Member
I tried searching the forums for this but came up empty. I apologize in advance if this topic has been talked about before, I'm new on here and do not wish to anger anyone. I bought a Dual 1228 a few days ago. Couldn't use it until today when my pre-amp finally came in. I've listened to about 10 albums so far, and half of them start skipping on the last track. I bought this at the local record shop and the owner did test it for a few days and said it was solid and set up properly. I did however replace the rca cables. I had to remove the turntable from the base to do this. It came with the manual, which I read before doing this. Could I have possibly done something wrong that is causing my issue? I did use the stoppers to keep that platter from moving while I did this, and I didn't have to move it much and I thought I was being super careful. It sounds wonderful otherwise. Once again, apologies if this has been discussed.
 
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Is the turntable level? Don't bother setting the antiskating until after the turntable is level.

Which cartridge are you using, and what's the vertical tracking force?
 
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Is there a way to tell if it's level? It looks like it is to the eye. I do have it sitting on a solid level surface as well. The cartridge is a Shure M91ED. The tracking force is set just a hair under 1. The anti-skating was already set at zero. Thank you so much for responding.
 
You use a small level and check front to back and side to side for level... You know how to use a level right?
 
Ps your anti skate should generally be set the same as your cart tracking weight... Also under 1gram sounds a bit on the light side to me... I'd think around 1.25-1.5 would be better but check the specs if the cart to see what it's range is supposed to be.
 
Use a small bubble level to determine if it is truly level...this is very important. That cartridge should be tracking at around 1.25 grams. Did you balance the tonearm before setting the tracking force? If not, you need to do so...this will assure that the tracking force on the built-in gauge is giving you an accurate reading. And the anti-skate should be set at approximately the same reading as the tracking weight.

My initial suspicion is that you are tracking much too lightly. If you need a step-by-step turntable set-up guide, send me a PM with an email address.
 
No mention of whether this Dual has had any maintenance done to it. Two things to deal with in priority order:

- Check the trip pawl for old grease causing it to bind. This is the small lever that causes the auto-return cycle to start. Odds are it is not riding free. Find a blown up parts diagram, disassemble the TT and relube the points in the mechanism where the old grease has dried up.

- If the Shure M91ED's stylus can handle it, run it down to 1.5 to 2.0 grams. If the stylus collapses at that level, the surround is bad. Even with a replacement stylus, it will mistrack at 1.0 gram levels. This, added to item 1 above, will certainly cause mistracking and skipping on the inner grooves.

Cheers,

David
 
Yeah, I just didn't think it would be light enough to get an accurate reading. There is just a tiny bit of give between the turntable and the base due to the springs.
 
I fully second dshoaf's post regarding the auto-return mechanism. Start with getting the TT level, then making sure that your tracking weight gauge is accurate (by balancing the tonearm to zero), then set the tracking weight (and anti-skate) to 1.25 grams. If these steps don't solve the problem, the next most likely issue is the return mechanism not allowing free movement of the tonearm when it begins to engage near the end of the album.
 
As others have pointed out, it sounds like you have the tracking set too light, and you haven't levelled it.

1. Set it where it's going to be used, run the cables and so forth and then leave it in place. Don't move it.

2. Level it. If you don't have a bubble level, you can use a small (6-inch or so) level and level fore-and-aft, then side to side. You might fake a bubble level with a good, high-quality saucer set on the platter if its bottom clears the spindle, with a tablespoon of water in the middle of the saucer, but a real bubble level is better.

3. Balance the tonearm. It's probably covered in the manual that came with it. When it floats free and level, it's balanced, and you can set the VTF (vertical tracking force) scale to zero.

4. Set the VTF. I don't know what the VTF range is for your cartridge, but you can probably look it up. Set the VTF at about the middle of the allowable range.

5. Set the antiskating to the same number as the VTF.

If you relocate or move the turntable, check that it is still level. If it is no longer level, adjust it until it is level.

Everybody else, did I miss anything?
 
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Here is the Shure M91ED Spec Sheet

This spec sheet is for the stock stylus that came new on cartridge. Also checked the M91ED w/Hi-Track sheet, same tracking weight recommendation.

Agreed: 1.25g :thmbsp:
 

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I don't know guys. I kept checking to make sure it was level while adjusting the tonearm. It did look just the slightest bit too low when I started. It really looks nice and even now. I adjusted the force to 1.25 and the anti-skating as well. After this it didn't start skipping until about the last 20-30 seconds of the last track. I tested the last track of a few albums. I was reading deeper into the manual and decided to try adjusting the tonearm cueing height. I gave it two small turns clockwise and now everything seems to be working fine. It's working for the moment, but was that an okay thing to do?
 
If it's now working, I'd say that adjusting tonearm cueing height was a good thing to do. I suspect that it was just barely starting to "cue up" as it got to the inner grooves and was, in effect, making the VTF lower for those inner grooves, and that your adjustment corrected the problem.

Congratulations!
 
Thanks fips, you all are great. Very nice community here. I haven't had a turntable in about 10 years, and never a vintage one, so I am pretty new to this. I felt like a moron with my questions, but thanks for all the information. Hopefully I'll have some smooth sailing here. Thanks again.
 
Almost forgot to ask. If I decide to get adventurous and try to clean the insides and re-grease everything, what would you recommend?
 
Worked so good for a few plays and started up again. After looking at the manual some more I noticed the counterbalance was actually on backwards. I'm now going to redo setting the tonearm again. Could this have been part of the problem?
 
I'm so angry and so happy at the same time. I'm angry because the fellow I purchased this from runs a Dual in his shop and didn't notice the counter weight was on backwards on the one he sold me. I will leave it at that with him, he's still a cool guy and has an awesome store. I found a video on setting up a 1000 series, while not near what I have, it was like night and day. I couldn't figure out why my manual read like nonsense. Got the counter weight on the correct way and set the tonearm....magic. I'm learning anyway.
 
Not sure I would categorize him as a "cool guy". He told you that he tested it for several days, and that was clearly not the case.
 
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