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Looking for upgrade advice

E

Estes

New Member
Hello all!

Hoping to get some feedback on my current system, and suggestions on vinyl listening optimization tweaks

Sansui 5000x
Rega P3 with Elys 2
ADS L520's (restored/recapped)

The 5000x is sentimental for me as my dad brought it back from the war. I had it completely restored, and would like to keep that in the mix.

I was thinking about a stylus upgrade or perhaps a separate preamp, but not sure how limiting the Sansui or ADS speakers would be here. If I am limited by the receiver I can accept that, but hoping to hear if there are some items I can look at that this group would recommend. Not looking to spend crazy amounts of money, but a couple grand is possible all depending.

Thanks all
 
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Better cartridge might help but you can use get some nice speakers with that budget.

What don’t you like or are you missing? A couple grand can make that 5000x based system really sing.
 
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Whats the old saying? If you got the money, honey, I got the time. Well thats the way it is with any good hobby. Up to a point you reeive a lot of enjoyment for a modest sum of money, but if you really want to get serious about your hobby you have to have serious money. Boats and RV's for example.. They are true money pits. However, buying the right stereo equipment you can enjoy for years and the sell it a profit and upgrade. I do that all the time with my stereo electronics every 10 to 20 years or so. HT stuff is going to cost you. I will admit I can sell my 207 power amps for more today than when I bought them, but inflation or devaluation of the dollar means I will take a loss. I didn't buy my HT processor new, but even at the great savings I would loose about $500.00 if I sold it today. Having a 4 or 8 k processor is of no use to me as I don't have a 4k or 8K screen. So I will just keep it. Don't need a 4K player either. Will this Elite plasma ever die? Hope not.
 
Estes said:
Hello all!

Hoping to get some feedback on my current system, and suggestions on vinyl listening optimization tweaks

Sansui 5000x
Rega P3 with Elys 2
ADS L520's (restored/recapped)

The 5000x is sentimental for me as my dad brought it back from the war. I had it completely restored, and would like to keep that in the mix.

I was thinking about a stylus upgrade or perhaps a separate preamp, but not sure how limiting the Sansui or ADS speakers would be here. If I am limited by the receiver I can accept that, but hoping to hear if there are some items I can look at that this group would recommend. Not looking to spend crazy amounts of money, but a couple grand is possible all depending.

Thanks all
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A nice phono stage will wake up that vinyl rig. I can highly recommend the York from Six Acoustic, no middleman markup so you get a great phono pre at a great price.
IMG_20231219_230804809.jpg
 
Without more specifics, not sure how/wherein your sys could be letting you down.

Is it lack of detail, clairity in amplitude? Have you done any checking of specs on the receiver? Inspected the stylus?

That 5000x was great for its time period, but you might want to upgrade to a 7070, which means a cash outlay.

Check out first what you have, before you make your move.


Q
 
DeadRock said:
Made in Canada!!
Click to expand...

You know it eh.

When first becoming a country they realized it needed a name, so getting together for this one member jumped up saying to use his wife's name, another his dog's, and so on. The bickering went on for some time until someone asked for the group to offer up some letters to be used in the name.

One gentleman in the back of the room stood up and shouted C eh, N eh, D eh, and the rest is history.
 
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Estes said:
Hello all!

Hoping to get some feedback on my current system, and suggestions on vinyl listening optimization tweaks

Sansui 5000x
Rega P3 with Elys 2
ADS L520's (restored/recapped)

The 5000x is sentimental for me as my dad brought it back from the war. I had it completely restored, and would like to keep that in the mix.

I was thinking about a stylus upgrade or perhaps a separate preamp, but not sure how limiting the Sansui or ADS speakers would be here. If I am limited by the receiver I can accept that, but hoping to hear if there are some items I can look at that this group would recommend. Not looking to spend crazy amounts of money, but a couple grand is possible all depending.

Thanks all
Click to expand...
I think your biggest bottlenecks are the speakers and the phono stage in the receiver. The receiver is solid, and the turntable and cartridge are the standouts here. I had that setup, it can make magic. The speakers are fantastic for vintage, but if you want to move up the food chain, start there, with the phono stage soon after. If you have some attachment to the speakers, get the phono stage. It might get you to relegate the speakers elsewhere
 
Thanks for the replies everyone. Really appreciate it. I would say overall it's the lack of clarity and separation that is driving this investigation more than anything. Initially I thought about upgrading the stylus, but doing that and still maintaining the same phono stage or speakers might not help very much, hence turning to the experts here. The speakers are a nice set, but didn't think about that as the potential weak link.
 
Estes said:
Thanks for the replies everyone. Really appreciate it. I would say overall it's the lack of clarity and separation that is driving this investigation more than anything. Initially I thought about upgrading the stylus, but doing that and still maintaining the same phono stage or speakers might not help very much, hence turning to the experts here. The speakers are a nice set, but didn't think about that as the potential weak link.
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This is not an easy problem to solve but I would start with a different pair of speakers.

Do you have any options locally?
 
I'm fairly easy to please and have the same TT/cart. Maybe it's just my wife and I but that source sounds really good through a Rogue RP-1 preamp and our Paradigm towers, that only cost $2k 20 years ago.
 
I have two Rega Planar 3's... ditch that Elys cartridge and try something better- an Audio-Technica VM95ML sounds quite a bit better, and a VM540 ML or VM740ML are outstanding on the RB300 series arms... you will be surprised how much better your vinyl sounds.

If you have the cash, get the Rega NEO MKII PSU - it controls the speed of the Planar 3 almost perfectly. I have them on both of my tables and set them to play at exactly 33.33 rpm when playing an album. I used the RPM app on my cell phone and verified it with my sons cell phone - the variation averages from 33.30 to 33.40 - not bad for a belt drive.
 
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Estes said:
The 5000x is sentimental for me as my dad brought it back from the war. I had it completely restored, and would like to keep that in the mix.

I was thinking about a stylus upgrade or perhaps a separate preamp, but not sure how limiting the Sansui or ADS speakers would be here. If I am limited by the receiver I can accept that,
Click to expand...
I'm not sure of your meaning, here. Are you saying that you can accept the Sansui's limitations or that you are willing to replace it despite sentiment?
Estes said:
but hoping to hear if there are some items I can look at that this group would recommend. Not looking to spend crazy amounts of money, but a couple grand is possible all depending.
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Estes said:
Thanks for the replies everyone. Really appreciate it. I would say overall it's the lack of clarity and separation that is driving this investigation more than anything. Initially I thought about upgrading the stylus, but doing that and still maintaining the same phono stage or speakers might not help very much, hence turning to the experts here. The speakers are a nice set, but didn't think about that as the potential weak link.
Click to expand...
I love 8 inch, two-way speakers, and I've owned Bose 301, EPI 100, Linn Index, Linn Sara, and Vandersteen 1C. Of your L520's, ADS said:

"The L520 (L420 and L620) deliver tonal accuracy, wide frequency range, low distortion, high efficiency excellent stereo imaging, fast transient response and wide dynamic range which set new standards for two-way speaker performance. Their advanced design, lavish construction, uncompromising manufacture and extraordinary performance ensure untiring musical entertainment and uncommon long-term value."

I'm not sure how much you've experimented with speaker placement, but I've found Paul Klipsch's advice to place speakers (not just his own!) in the corners of the room and toed in 45 degrees to work best for me most often. He suggested using the long wall of the room; I've liked the short wall, too, but my rooms have been fairly squarish. When it comes to separation, it doesn't get any better than just putting the speakers in the corners, and Klipsch furthermore claimed "By placing speakers in corners you reduce distortion by three-fourths."

I would also be tempted to try an Ortofon OM20 cartridge. Ortofon does not sell that model anymore, but you could get an OM 5S and buy the Stylus 20 separately. A friend of mine uses this combination on his older Rega P1, and it sounds really good, excellent detail/resolution, and a Herbie's mat made the dynamics better than the Rega Bias 2 he had used previously. A possible advantage in your setup is that the OM body has a recommended capacitance range of 200-500 pF. I could not find capacitance values for either your Sansui receiver or your turntable, but it's possible that this higher and wider capacitance range would have advantages over the 100-200 pF range recommended for AT and some other moving magnet cartridges.

If a cartridge change and speaker placement experimentation don't give you what you're looking for, then I would think about a new phono stage or, if you're willing to use an amp other than your Sansui, a complete new amplifier (perhaps auditioning the Rega Brio). I have to admit, though, I would be loath to give up the Sansui unless compelled to by head-to-head comparison.
 
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jrtrent said:
I'm not sure of your meaning, here. Are you saying that you can accept the Sansui's limitations or that you are willing to replace it despite sentiment?


I love 8 inch, two-way speakers, and I've owned Bose 301, EPI 100, Linn Index, Linn Sara, and Vandersteen 1C. Of your L520's, ADS said:

"The L520 (L420 and L620) deliver tonal accuracy, wide frequency range, low distortion, high efficiency excellent stereo imaging, fast transient response and wide dynamic range which set new standards for two-way speaker performance. Their advanced design, lavish construction, uncompromising manufacture and extraordinary performance ensure untiring musical entertainment and uncommon long-term value."

I'm not sure how much you've experimented with speaker placement, but I've found Paul Klipsch's advice to place speakers (not just his own!) in the corners of the room and toed in 45 degrees to work best for me most often. He suggested using the long wall of the room; I've liked the short wall, too, but my rooms have been fairly squarish. When it comes to separation, it doesn't get any better than just putting the speakers in the corners, and Klipsch furthermore claimed "By placing speakers in corners you reduce distortion by three-fourths."

I would also be tempted to try an Ortofon OM20 cartridge. Ortofon does not sell that model anymore, but you could get an OM 5S and buy the Stylus 20 separately. A friend of mine uses this combination on his older Rega P1, and it sounds really good, excellent detail/resolution, and a Herbie's mat made the dynamics better than the Rega Bias 2 he had used previously. A possible advantage in your setup is that the OM body has a recommended capacitance range of 200-500 pF. I could not find capacitance values for either your Sansui receiver or your turntable, but it's possible that this higher and wider capacitance range would have advantages over the 100-200 pF range recommended for AT and some other moving magnet cartridges.

If a cartridge change and speaker placement experimentation don't give you what you're looking for, then I would think about a new phono stage or, if you're willing to use an amp other than your Sansui, a complete new amplifier (perhaps auditioning the Rega Brio). I have to admit, though, I would be loath to give up the Sansui unless compelled to by head-to-head comparison.
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Appreciate the response. Yes, I want to keep the Sansui for sure, but open to bypassing the phono stage with an upgrade.

Good call on speaker placement. I have the ADS speakers on stands and toed in, however, my room is not all that large where putting them in the corners is not really an option.
 
krautmaster said:
I have two Rega Planar 3's... ditch that Elys cartridge and try something better- an Audio-Technica VM95ML sounds quite a bit better, and a VM540 ML or VM740ML are outstanding on the RB300 series arms... you will be surprised how much better your vinyl sounds.

If you have the cash, get the Rega NEO MKII PSU - it controls the speed of the Planar 3 almost perfectly. I have them on both of my tables and set them to play at exactly 33.33 rpm when playing an album. I used the RPM app on my cell phone and verified it with my sons cell phone - the variation averages from 33.30 to 33.40 - not bad for a belt drive.
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Definitely worth exploring. Thank you!
 
The transducers i.e. speakers and cartridges generally introduce the most measurable variation in frequency response and the highest levels of distortion. So I would look at upgrades for both of those first. I really like the AT95xx series cartridge especially at the price points and that would be my first move (I have the AT95SH). Speakers are a can of worms but those ADS speakers are well respected.

I can't hear the difference in most electronics at reasonable db levels so I would change them out last, unless you want it loud.

I like to see specs on mechanical parts so for that reason I am not a Rega fan. But I also don't feel the TT introduces any sound of its own beyond w&f/r distortion. Many disagree and good for them. By that reasoning the Rega should be perfectly fine.
 
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