Marantz 22xx phono stage opinions

[Rowrbazzle]

Curious if anyone on the forum knows if the little Marantz 2215 phono stage is equivalent to the phono stages in the bigger models in the series.

I have a rebuilt 2240 and I've hooked up a TT with satisfactory results No obvious deficiencies. But I was just given a 2215 which I'm trying out as an office system and I wasn't crazy about the sound quality when I hooked it up to a good TT just now (Sony PS-X60 with an Empire EDR.9 cartridge). Mids and highs sometimes sounded unpleasantly shrill and harsh.

So I patched in a Rotel phono preamp that was gathering dust in a closet and it made a world of difference. Now I'm wondering if it is that much better than the 2215's phono stage -- or if I should get some work done on the 2215 phono stage to bring it up to spec. The 2215 was in beautiful shape when I got it but it needed new power supply caps. Other than that and some adjustments and cleaning, I did nothing further to it.

So is the 2215 phono stage inferior to the phono stage on the bigger models?. Or is it likely that the phono stage needs some new components?. Or...is it to be expected that a newer outboard phono preamp (the Rotel) would outperform the built-in Marantz phono stage in any event?

I'm not looking for a definitive answer. Just "informed" (or not) opinions.

 

[catrafter]

The 2215 is similar but not exactly the same as most the other 22XX series, such as your 2240, so it should sound pretty good.
When I restore these this is what I recommend:
Replace C901 and C902 with 1uF film type capacitors. For C905 and C906 use good quality 22uF electrolytic types with as close to the 6V rating as possible. Replace C909 and C910 with good quality 47uF 16V electrolytics. H905 and H906 are 2SC458 types which have a reputation for failing noisy, so I would change them too, KSC1845 (F gain code) are a good choice here. Replace C919 with a good quality 220uF 50V electrolytic type for improved local filtering. BTW, the service manual lists C917 and C918 as a 47uF film types when they are in fact, .47 film types.

Tom

 

[rcs16]

So is the 2215 phono stage inferior to the phono stage on the bigger models?. Or is it likely that the phono stage needs some new components?. Or...is it to be expected that a newer outboard phono preamp (the Rotel) would outperform the built-in Marantz phono stage in any event?

If you look at the schematic & parts used you can see the differences, if you understand EE. How much that they make a diff is very subjective. It is design and there is more than one way to do it, every EE has there ways. You can make measurements but that is only one test, so is listening. Everyone has there own impressions. This is the beauty of it.
There are design improvement and then there are improvements in components. There is a balance between the two.
Some say no cap in the signal path is the best, so some high end phono-amps use direct coupled ckts and have servo's control DC offset, so no coupling cap is used, it adds costs to the ckt. Sansui A-919 has this, I do not know of any Marantz that do this extra step.
Some say jfets are preferred to bjts for MM phono inputs. The only Marantz that I see using a jfet first stage in a phono-eq is the 3650, the very high end only.
Bottom line, upgrade a phono-eq with new comps, semi's and ecaps as a first stage, evaluate. Leave film caps/resistors alone at the first stage of a re-build, then go from there if you feel that it is necessary.

Enjoy
Rick

 

[CohibaJoe]

Here is a Recap thread for 2220:
http://mail.audiokarma.net/forums/showthread.php?t=497856

I have a 2230 that I used Elna Silmic II.

 

[Rowrbazzle]

Thanks for the excellent and very specific advice, everyone. I replaced the power supply caps (they were bulging and pretty obviously bad), but I think I'll turn the 2215 phono stage over to my tech. He did a nice job with the 2240. But I'll pass along the recommendations and observations here. i know that he has mentioned film caps.