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McIntosh Haters

kmp14

kmp14

Active Member
This is kind of the opposite of the "McIntosh Snobs" thread. I have a used MA6500 integrated, my first McIntosh. I have enjoyed it for over a year.

Recently I purchased a turntable shelf from a local guy off Craig's List. He had all kinds of vintage gear. Giant speakers with drivers that looked like satellite dishes, and a bunch of vintage tube gear. He demoed his stuff, and of course, it sounded great for the short demo I got.

I asked him what he thought of McIntosh, and said it was "good to sell", insinuating that it does not perform that well but commands good money, or at least he meant it does not perform as well as it costs. He oddly then asked if my integrated had tone controls, to which I replied that it does but that I leave them at the center position, to which he made a crack like "with McIntosh you should definitely use the tone controls!" He also rolled his eyes when I said my music of choice it rock music. Lol. He was actually a nice guy, but definitely an audio snob....

So what is the deal? Is McIntosh more style and marketing than performance? I know the question coming is "do you like yours?", and I do, but maybe it is out of ignorance since I have never had better.

He also said a vintage Dynaco ST-70 would likely "blow my McIntosh away". Next thing I know, I am looking at ST-70s on Ebay. Argh.

Those of you who are McIntosh fans and fans of other brands, how does McIntosh hold up? Is my MA6500 a good representation of at least decent McIntosh gear?
 
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Most if not all Dynas were 2% distortion amps around 40 hz on the low end and 7,000 Hz on the high end. If there tubes weren't up to snuff they could be much higher in distortion. 3 or 4% was the norm at 20 HZ and could easily reach over 10% at 20,000 HZ. They also could e a little unstable over shooting giving that edge some times people love and I detest. Personnaly I thought the MK111 60 watt wasn't a bad amp and at half power was pretty respectable. Mac amps easily had 1/10th to 1/100 the distortion of a Dyna. The signal to noise was greater, too normally by 10 db. Mac amps were smoother with less distortion and there fore some folks thought less revealing and to laid back not presenting the true dynamics of the speaker to which they were connected. Mac amps weren't forward like Marantz amps. And though now considered warm compared to citiation amps a little stark. Purists who degrade tone controls just don't get it. They think whats in the groove or on the disc is gospel. Well it far from it. You can find reissues of LP's remastered CD's and many versions of the original release that all sound different and who knows what is right. I have sent in numerous master tapes for mastering and duplication to either LP in the 60's and 70's and later to CD. And maybe 10% were right with the first swing of the bat. I was listening to some Peter Nero and Roger Williams recordings the other day, and though the piano sound was close the double bass and drums were all wrong. Where's my graphic EQ. resonances from big diaphragm condenser mics around 10 khz and bass below 70 hz was non existent. I was also listeing to some Command records, and although we all know how contrived they can sound there were glimpses of piano solos from a Steinway piano that were right on, that very few other labels from Deutche Gramophone to even Telarc can't get right. So hang in there. The issues is not your Mac electronics. I mean if you have listened to nothing but Bose, Cerwin Vega, speakers and never attended a live un-amplified concert you are going to have a very different out look on sound reproduction.
 
This classic piece is widely regarded the greatest advertisement of all time.

Although it was a 1915 Cadillac advertisement, it could as well apply to McIntosh.

1915-01-02%20Cadillac.jpg
 
The guy was jealous. Even if he just likes to flip them for big bucks, I'll bet he doesn't see than many.
 
The main thing I try and keep in mind is not to let other folks sway my opinion about something I like. It doesn't matter if it's audio gear or not. Be your own man and if it pleases you and doesn't harm another then forget what others may say. Go strictly by your own personal experience.
 
Mike Gibson said:
The main thing I try and keep in mind is not to let other folks sway my opinion about something I like. It doesn't matter if it's audio gear or not. Be your own man and if it pleases you and doesn't harm another then forget what others may say. Go strictly by your own personal experience.
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I hear ya. I realize there was some inherent weakness in my feelings about it which is why I wanted to spark a discussion to learn more. Confidence can come from knowledge and experience, which I lack in terms of high end audio gear, so i figured starting this thread might also provide some valuable info, which it already has.
 
McIntosh is among the longest running of successful companies producing specialty audio components, and that success combined with a substantial following has predictably caused a polarity among audio enthusiasts regarding their merit as high end components. For some people it may not reproduce music to sound the way they like, or its functions and appearance may seem outdated if the preference is for modern minimalist. Some might not have even properly heard McIntosh and are simply parroting the opinions of other enthusiasts with whom they trust. And yes, some people are just jealous of things that are beyond their means to obtain.

Yes I personally have heard the haters, as well as the numerous folks who truly understand our deep appreciation for the design, the engineering, and of course its superb musical reproduction. I've been into high end audio for 40 years and nothing else has fulfilled my preferences in design and musical reproduction as well as McIntosh. Certainly there may exist components that could please me more, but I've not yet heard any. No doubt I sound like a biased and loyal fan, but for me, McIntosh has earned it.
 
I'll give this guy the benefit of a doubt. He may actually believe the stuff he spews. It doesn't make him right. Most of us have owned and heard other stuff. We ended up here. My point is he may genuinely not like Mac and that shouldn't trouble you. There are 100s if not 1000s of brands. The only person you have to please is you. The other side , there are people who just can't say a nice thing about anything. Take it with a grain of salt.
 
I have both McIntosh and Bose in my house, so I totally understand what you are saying. I hear it all the time about Bose and a bit about McIntosh.

I've also had many brands and models of vintage gear go through my house, and I definitely think that McIntosh is excellent gear. I'm a computer hardware guy for 35 years, and I appreciate well built well engineered gear. McIntosh build quality is top notch. I open up everything that comes into my house to clean it out and inspect it. I also have a couple of Bose amps and a preamp in my critical listening room, and although it sounds excellent, the build quality isn't even close to McIntosh. I also just sold a pair of Bose 901 series 2 and just got a pair of 901 series 3 just two weeks ago. I had a guy over to check out an NAD CD player I had for sale and hooked it up to the 901s driven by a MAC1900 and he couldn't believe how well it all sounded together when playing some opera he brought on a test cd. No distortion at all that either of us could hear and he thought the imaging was bang on!

You hear Bose bashing all the time, but I will buy anything decent by Bose and know I can sell it quite easily for good money! I can sell McIntosh gear just as easily for more money. But I have trouble getting my price on excellent gear by other manufacturers. It even took me a while to get my price on a Kenwood Supreme 500 and 600 I once had for sale, but I eventually did.

So trust your ears and be happy! If you find yourself looking for other gear, try it out too! You might find you like it more, or maybe not, but you will have experienced more in the process and have better confidence in yourself. And don't worry about the snobs and the haters. There are always those.
 
Everybody is different, even within the McIntosh enthusiasts we like different things, some like mono-blocks, some like tube some like solid state....we all have different tastes...
There's one thing we all know and it simply cannot be disputed, McIntosh design and build some of the most incredible amplifiers, tuners, pre-amps, integrateds on the planet....the MC275 was revolutionary in design, build and audio reproduction....
Then they carried on from there, the company is still going and still producing some of the finest high end audio in the world....
If people don't like Mac, they don't like Mac.....Who cares, I like Mac, and I have invested a horrendous amount of money in my gear because I love the sound firstly, secondly I like the look, black glass, chrome, stainless steel, the green gothic font,the large blue meters.......very nice.... the quality, undeniable.....
I have some snobby tosser friends who think McIntosh is all blow and no go, overpriced and easily outperformed by much cheaper gear.....PFFT!! Water off a ducks back with me.....
 
I'll relate a story about what people hear. In 1971 I had saved and bought a C-26 and MC-2505. I loved the sound of them. I had a friend over and his comment was "I have an Airline console that sounds just like that". I was angry and insulted by his comment at first. I had heard his Airline console many times and to me it didn't sound like my Mac gear at all. Then I realized that he wasn't being mean or rude. He actually didn't hear a difference. So ever since then I put little value on what others say they hear. Not because they don't hear well, merely because they hear differently than I do. There is no right or wrong, just differences.
 
I have collected SS gear for 5 years. I buy, sell, upgrade, and thoroughly enjoy the hobby. I bought a Mac cdp for cheap a few years ago, and it has stayed. It is an MCD 7000, a real dinosaur. But, for some reason, it sounds fantastic. Trust me, i would have sold it for profit otherwise. I just recently grabbed my second piece of Mac gear, an MA 6100. I had heard from many SS collectors that the old Macs were for looks, and status. I now wholeheartedly disagree! I am also a tube fanatic. I love the warm, musical, 3d sound tubes give. I think the old Mcintosh gets as close to that sound as i have heard. With all controls flat, it sounds musical and lifelike. Some people like the big slam and surgical sound of big Modern ss amps. Maybe they would think me a fool, but everyone who hears my little Mac integrated on my Klipsch' really likes it. I will continue the hunt now. My friends can scoff all they want, until they find out what Mac gear is all about! Lol
 
I go along with most of the other comments made here in that you should not care about what others think. Just enjoy what you have and let it go at that. My kids and grandkids think my McIntosh setup is the best on the planet. They are the only ones who's opinions matter to me.
 
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