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Minor surgery on the MAC-4100...

mrz80

I guess it's in my blood
So while I'm waiting for the last batch of caps for the 1700 power supply overhaul http://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/mac-1700-goes-under-the-knife.699390/
I decided to pull the 4100 out of the family room and go ahead and attend to some of the things that I was going to deal with after I finished the 1700 - intermittent FM stereo (this cropped up once before - pull the IF/MPX module and clean the card edge and chassis connector) , scratchy controls, and some or all of the indicator LEDs just not indicating anything. The wife was starting to complain, even going so far as to threaten to buy a new receiver if things didn't improve, so let's dig in...

Got the unit apart, and did the usual suspects - clean the pots with F5, and all the switches and PC board cable connectors on with D5, blew out all the dust and cat hair, got some smudges off the glass, that sort of thing. BTW, an old toothbrush and some dish soap worked great for getting all the finger schmutz out of the serrations on the knobs.
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After a good deal of studying of the schematic I thought I had a handle on what might have been going on, but a couple hours of chasing voltages around led me to the conclusion that something was very wrong with the input switching; control voltages that were supposed to be turning LEDs on and off and muting unselected inputs on the preamp board were just not there; NONE of the LEDs were lit and ALL of the inputs were active! (That led me to notice that, according to the schematic and contrary to the sales lit, the inputs are, in fact, physically switched on one deck of the input switch, which explains why I don't hear all the inputs at the same time!)

The high (well, low) point of the evening came when I figured out how to pull the indicator board from behind the front panel without disassembling the panel. Unfortunately, I managed to unhook the spring on the tuning-cap to knob string. ARGH! I found a couple questionable solder joints on the indicator board, but even after fixing them and putting the board back in (and getting that infernal dial cord sorted out!), still no joy. ARGH again! Then, in the middle of another round of "poke everything with a voltmeter and marvel at the unchanging control voltages no matter how the input switch was set", lo and behold everything Just Starts Working Again. All the indicator lights followed the input switch, the appropriate dial pointer LEDs lit for AM and FM, and the AFL lock and Stereo lights lit up on FM! WHAT THE HEY?!?!! Turned the 4100 off and on several times, even banged it against the workbench a time or two, and it all still worked. SO weird. And as an added bonus, I found a couple of 1847 bulbs in a drawer in the garage, so I got the meters lit up again too. No telling what of the combination of poking and prodding, diassembly, cleaning, and reassembly actually got it all going again, but I'll take it any way I can get it. Game set and MATCH! :D
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I put it all back together and stuffed it back in the stereo cabinet, and reveled in the return of rock steady, noise and intermittent cutout free FM stereo. With a twinlead dipole thumbtacked to the wall I was getting stations all over Florida. VERY nice. Then, about 5 minutes into my stereophonic bliss, there was a loud *crack*, the right channel output meter spiked, and with a muted *click* I lost all output. AAAAAAAAA! What was THAT?!?!!? *sigh* I knew it was all too good to be true...

With the receiver opened up on the workbench once more, the Mark One Schnozola was brought into play, and by homing in on the burnt smell I quickly localized the issue to the right channel driver board area. Ah, THERE was the problem: a grey wire (ground, by convention, in this receiver) had been resting on the connector pin feeding 48V to the driver board; looks like it just chose last night to wear through the last of the insulation and arc over, shorting the +48V rail to ground. Nothing but that one wire seemed damaged, so I just wrapped the bare spot in electrical tape, rerouted the wire away from the driver board connectors, and powered it up again. Phew! +48V, -48V, +18V, all measured fine. Back into the stereo cabinet it went, with a HUGE sigh of relief as the receiver lit up and still sounded fine. Let's hear it for protection circuits!
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Well, now, a couple of symptoms have put in an appearance... :( First off, the indicator LED for FM, and the FM-side LED on the pointer, don't light up any more, but all the others still do. Annoying but minor. Probably still some dirt on a switch contact or somesuch. The big issue is that, after a few minutes (the time varies) of glorious stereophonic sound, I get a noise like a burst of static from the right speaker, and the speaker relay trips out. Power the unit down for a good long while and everything's back to normal. Lather, rinse, repeat. I'm going to put it up on the bench with a dummy load and start poking with a voltmeter again, but where to start? Bad relay? Flaky thermal cutout? Power supply SNAFU?
 
As long as you're back in there, perhaps consider blue LEDs for the dial and meters? I've seen it done to a few MAC4100s and it looks great.

Hope you get the rest sorted. Always something...:rolleyes:

BTW- you still running it with Roger's XR250s?
 
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I never had one, but always thought the 4100 was the coolest looking mac receiver.
Intermittents can be so frustrating.
Not just finding. You almost never know whether your repair finally solved it or it just chose to work after the most recent change.
It usually find it rears its ugly head right after you're convinced you got it licked, closed it up , put it back in place and rehooked everything up and you sit down:eek:.
Only to have the contented smile of happiness sucked off your face:yikes:
 
As long as you're back in there, perhaps consider blue LEDs for the dial and meters? I've seen it done to a few MAC4100s and it looks great.
I thought about it, but I kind of like the rich golden glow I've got now. :D

Hope you get the rest sorted. Always something...:rolleyes:
Yeah. I'm already planning on dropping another big order on Mouser before the end of the week - 15,000μF cans, and new electrolytics for the power supply board (and maybe some others, I've already done the preamp board), and likely a speaker relay just on general principles. I also need to replace some or all of the RCA jacks on the back panel, as the ceramic insulators are crumbling and some of the center-pin sockets are getting loose. And and and :)

Oh, and I made a sweet discovery when I was rummaging around in the garage for new tuner tubes for the 1700 - an unused pair of NOS Gold Lion KT88s! YEAH! Now I (hopefully) won't have to buy tubes when I get around to fixing the 275 (which ate one of its finals rather spectacularly)! Like you said, always something more to do :D

BTW- you still running it with Roger's XR250s?
Yup, still have the 250s. They're my "use 'til you die and leave 'em for your heirs to fight over but never EVER get rid of 'em" speakers. :)
 
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WOW. I'm pretty sure it's not supposed to do THAT! Trying to track down the speaker relay tripping out problem, when *FLASH*BANG* one of the caps on the power supply board exploded. THAT was entertaining! :eek:
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I also note a scorched area on the backside of the board.
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So, recap the board, and just as a precaution I'll probably replace the regulator transistors on the heatsink as well.
 
Just happen to have a schematic at hand, and that cap is on the +18 supply which has a sub part function for the LED turn on delay. Since you were having LED issues prior to this extreme failure tread carefully.......

Do not make any assumptions, a 5.6 AC supply is referenced off this supply rail.......
 
Just happen to have a schematic at hand, and that cap is on the +18 supply which has a sub part function for the LED turn on delay. Since you were having LED issues prior to this extreme failure tread carefully.......

Do not make any assumptions, a 5.6 AC supply is referenced off this supply rail.......

The 5.6 AC was rock-steady the whole time I've been troubleshooting. The 5.6 also supplies juice to the panel and meter lights, which have been working (well, after I replaced the blown meter light bulbs at any rate).
 
There are two (2) 5.6 volt supplies....one for LED delay and another for the lamps, you will need to follow the appropriate schematic for your serial number....I believe there are 3 different schematics.
 
:rolleyes:
Your troubleshooting is more exciting than mine. If that cap spit E paste you have some serious cleaning to do before you replace it.
 
The Mouser order showed up. Got the monster filter cans swapped, then started replacing the electrolytics on the power supply board.
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I stopped halfway; I'm getting a little to sleepy to weild a soldering iron. :D New regulator transistors and about half the caps replaced.
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HELP! Ok, so I've replaced all the electrolytics on the power supply board (along with the monster cans on the chassis), both regulator transistors, and a .1 disc that snapped off when I was fiddling with one of the transistors. I put it all back together and powered it all up...

All the input indicators are working now, and the dial pointer switches from bottom to top when I go from AM to FM. That's cool, as that was at best intermittent before (which is what *started* me on this whole adventure in the first place). The +/- 48V supply is just jim-dandy (+49.2, -49.1). What's NOT so jim-dandy is the volume-invariant (not very loud, but doesn't change when the volume control is adjusted) 60Hz hum in the headphones, and the output LED graphs pegged as soon as I turn on the unit. I've pulled the power supply board back out and triple checked everything I did under a magnifier - no shorts, no misplaced or backwards components - but am concerned about how to proceed. I'm... nervous... about troubleshooting with the power on, afraid something else is gonna get cooked somewhere. Any advice on how to proceed (other than "pack it up and send it to Terry :D")?
 
Uneducated guess
Something got pushed , pulled, during surgery.
(Broken lead?)
Something is loose, open, cold solder joint. Bad ground connection, solder bridge, maybe a cut lead fell someplace it shouldn't?
I think a good thorough visual inspection is in order with light and magnification.
Careful attention in areas in and near where you were working.
Hopefully something simple and easy will show itself. Otherwise you're going to have to methodically troubleshoot
 
Uneducated guess
Something got pushed , pulled, during surgery.
(Broken lead?)
Something is loose, open, cold solder joint. Bad ground connection, solder bridge, maybe a cut lead fell someplace it shouldn't?
I think a good thorough visual inspection is in order with light and magnification.
That much I've done, pretty thoroughly. I can't find anything visual - no bad solder joints, broken leads, broken traces, misconnected plugs, backwards caps, anything like that.
I'll need to grit my teeth and light the thing up again (briefly) and check all the voltages around the PS board. I'm wondering if maybe I thermal'ed one or both transistors when I installed 'em. I've got some clip-on-the-lead heatsinks but couldn't lay hands on them at the time. I thought I'd worked quickly enough not to damage the transistors but maybe I didn't. I'll post what I find after I do some voltage checks.
 
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