My AT95E Thoughts

[DonnieBoy]

After some research I settled on this best bang for your buck "budget" cartridge. I ordered the AT95E cartridge with stock AT stylus from Amazon last Friday.. $43 shipped! I mounted and aligned it right away using the VinylEngine Technics 1200 protractor on my Audio Technica ATPL120 (which is basically a 1200 knockoff table). I hooked the ATPL120 back up to my Sansui 7070 and put on my best sounding LP (to me I think) Boston's first album. I use this LP to test any new thing I get for my system. (In case you want to know the speakers are Klipsch KG 1.5's with a Polk RM1000 sub hooked up for when I want more low end.)

As soon as the stylus hit the lead in I didn't hear any surface noise, cracks or pops. As the first track faded in the guitar was clear, then the drums came in they were punchy and the low end was there. Once the vocals came in I settled back and proceeded to listen to side one of this great album. I hadn't had a smile on my face listening to an LP like that in a while. My neck still hurts from bobbing to the beat haha.

My first impressions of this cartridge is that is sounds very warm, not bright at all (like some reviews claimed), and very detailed. The attack of the rim shots on the snare drum at the beginning of "More Than A Feeling" for some reason just sounded so clear and stood out the most for me. As I sat back in the listening chair I finally felt what I hear some people refer to as "transparency". Help me out if that's the right term, but it felt as if there was no LP playing or gear pumping the tunes out.. like the band was playing right in the room.

I listen to ANYTHING but mainly 60's - 70's rock, 80's metal and current metal/rock.

There is one thing though that baffles me about the AT95E. It seems like the AT95E is holding back.. It's hard to explain because even though it is detailed and full sounding, it seems like I can really crank the volume knob and the music doesn't distort. Could this be due to the 3.5mV output?? The Shure SPS I was using had an output of 5mV and I couldn't crank that one without the music distorting. I don't mean to the point of my receiver clipping.. but just at a jamming volume when that right song comes on.

Another question I have is once this cart "breaks in".. what should I be listening for or will it be a no brainer that it will sound that much better? How long or how many hours is typical break in for the AT95E?

The only thing I have to compare the AT95E to are the following cartridges that I had before:
ATP2 - Came stock with the AT table and never really thought this one sounded good at all. I aligned it ever since day one but just never sounded good. The highs were distorted and the high tracking force just made me nervous. The recommended was 3-5 grams but I tried it anywhere from 1-5 and it always sounded crappy. By crappy I mean very flat and to me there was no detail to the music.. just meh.
Shure SPS-3 - I got this one from a friend and this was the daily driver until my latest purchase. It was a good cart and will serve as my backup and my test cartridge for used LP's on another turntable.

 

[muovimies]

Some manufacturers give break-in periods of up to 40 hours or so... it depends on the stylus suspension mostly. I think for most styli, the dramatic changes happen very fast, in the first few hours. I believe the AT95e belonging to that group, so after a few albums, I wouldn't expect any dramatic change either way but it might be gradually getting better for some time to come.

An example from a different maker - I just started using an Ortofon VMS30 stylus today, it's new old stock but don't know how old exactly. The first side I played with it it really sounded kind of 'stuffed' and not at all like it was up to the task, but gradually that effect wore off and after playing couple albums with it, it now sounds sublime.

 

[MacNoob]

Nice pics, thanks for the input!

 

[DonnieBoy]

Some manufacturers give break-in periods of up to 40 hours or so... it depends on the stylus suspension mostly. I think for most styli, the dramatic changes happen very fast, in the first few hours. I believe the AT95e belonging to that group, so after a few albums, I wouldn't expect any dramatic change either way but it might be gradually getting better for some time to come.

An example from a different maker - I just started using an Ortofon VMS30 stylus today, it's new old stock but don't know how old exactly. The first side I played with it it really sounded kind of 'stuffed' and not at all like it was up to the task, but gradually that effect wore off and after playing couple albums with it, it now sounds sublime.

Thanks for the info muovimies. That stuffed sound might be kind of what I was trying to explain.. it still sounds good just kind of "held back". I'll throw a few LPs on tonight and give a bit more critical listening to see if anything has changed.

 

[iLUVanalog]

Outstanding pictures!

The changes with break-in are generally subtle. Hard to describe, but it's almost like you start to hear details you didn't hear before or were a little distant or not as fleshed out. Very subtle things, but noticeable.

 

[kcblair]

AT recommends capacitance load 100-200pF. You might want to check that too.

 

[DonnieBoy]

AT recommends capacitance load 100-200pF. You might want to check that too.

Thanks kcblair.. I'm glad you brought this up! I remember reading a review about the AT95E where the reviewer was playing around with the capacitance load and that the cart sounded better with a certain value and can't remember what it was. I think they had a diy pre amp of some sort allowing them to change that value.

I couldn't find anything on how to measure the load capacitance or figure out where to go with this.. :/ I looked at my Sansui 7070's owner manual and service manual and couldn't find this value under the specs. Any idea how to check this? I have a Fluke multi meter if I have to check any values.

Could this be another issue?? My Sansui 7070's phono pre amp load impedance is 50k ohms, where the AT95E is 47k ohms. Am I understanding correctly that the higher resistance of the receiver (50k ohms) compared to the 47k recommended load of the cart would make it sound "quieter"??

Here's a shot right from the 7070 manual.

 

[muovimies]

50kOhm vs 47kOhm isn't really a meaningful difference in this case, and it has no relation to sound volume.

It seems the phono stage in your receiver is fairly sensitive, so you shouldn't have an issue with any modern MM cartridge. Both your carts should be fine with that phono stage, but the AT95e will be quieter because the lower output voltage, you just need to turn the volume up a bit higher to reach same level of loud.

I don't understand what's the issue here if any... you said

There is one thing though that baffles me about the AT95E. It seems like the AT95E is holding back.. It's hard to explain because even though it is detailed and full sounding, it seems like I can really crank the volume knob and the music doesn't distort.

but isn't that a good thing, why would you want the music to distort? Other than that, it might become a bit more open sounding after some more use, but I wouldn't count on it, just be happy and enjoy the music

 

[kcblair]

Measuring the capacitance of the tonearm and interconnects is easy, all you need is a Capacitance meter ($13 @ Newegg.com or other electronic supply houses)
1. Remove the cartridge and headshell as one unit.

2. Zero the Cap. meter and place the each of the leads on one of the RCA connectors at the end of the interconnect cable, where it plus into the amp/receiver .

3. One lead on the shield and one the male tip (+). Measure one cable at a time , left lead then right lead. The cap. of each will be displayed. They should be close.

4. Now the hard part, finding the cap. of the phono stage. From what I've read and been told on various forums, vintage receivers usually have 220pf phono stages.

I found the schematics of both my receivers and had an expert read them and 220pf it was. I also use a ART DJ PRE II that has 100/200pf settings, making this part easy, also.

Good luck.

 

[DonnieBoy]

50kOhm vs 47kOhm isn't really a meaningful difference in this case, and it has no relation to sound volume.

It seems the phono stage in your receiver is fairly sensitive, so you shouldn't have an issue with any modern MM cartridge. Both your carts should be fine with that phono stage, but the AT95e will be quieter because the lower output voltage, you just need to turn the volume up a bit higher to reach same level of loud.

I don't understand what's the issue here if any... you said


but isn't that a good thing, why would you want the music to distort? Other than that, it might become a bit more open sounding after some more use, but I wouldn't count on it, just be happy and enjoy the music

You're right muovimies.. there is no issue there.. I was just trying to understand why it was quieter but it is because of the lower output voltage. And I don't want the music to distort! LOL I just want to enjoy my records

Measuring the capacitance of the tonearm and interconnects is easy, all you need is a Capacitance meter ($13 @ Newegg.com or other electronic supply houses)
1. Remove the cartridge and headshell as one unit.

2. Zero the Cap. meter and place the each of the leads on one of the RCA connectors at the end of the interconnect cable, where it plus into the amp/receiver .

3. One lead on the shield and one the male tip (+). Measure one cable at a time , left lead then right lead. The cap. of each will be displayed. They should be close.

4. Now the hard part, finding the cap. of the phono stage. From what I've read and been told on various forums, vintage receivers usually have 220pf phono stages.

I found the schematics of both my receivers and had an expert read them and 220pf it was. I also use a ART DJ PRE II that has 100/200pf settings, making this part easy, also.

Good luck.

Thanks kcblair.. I have a Fluke multimeter that I'm pretty sure measures capacitance. I remember seeing the farad sign on it but It's been a while since I had to use it. I'll dig it out and follow your instructions. Seems pretty simple. I also have the schematic for my Sansui 7070.. maybe I'll have one of the electrical engineers at my job take a look at it tomorrow and see if they can find out the cap load of it.

Thanks guys for your help! I'll post my findings either later tonight or tomorrow.

 

[guest110]

Maybe I'm in the minority but I find that "cartridge break in " is folklore. If it were the case, vinyl break in would be more significant since it is a softer material ( more subject to wear influences). Complete BS. If you are unhappy with the 95, try the 120. It is amazing right out of the box and doesn't get any better, regardless of what dreamers say.

 

[muovimies]

Maybe I'm in the minority but I find that "cartridge break in " is folklore. If it were the case, vinyl break in would be more significant since it is a softer material ( more subject to wear influences). Complete BS. If you are unhappy with the 95, try the 120. It is amazing right out of the box and doesn't get any better, regardless of what dreamers say.

I think you have something misunderstood about the break in. I can tell you I've experienced break in periods with many different elastic / rubber materials and compounds in mechanical settings, whether related to audio or not. I don't see a reason why a stylus suspension would somehow be immune to this.

If you take a stylus and disassemble it, you'll notice the cantilever goes through 'rubber donut' type of thing inside the brass tube - different manufacturers do different types of thing, but this is very common to the point of almost universal. Some styli might even have small wires attached to the cantilever. This is a mechanical device and depending on the design and materials used, there will be break in that falls somewhere in the scale between none and significant

EDIT: That doesn't take into account the possibility of somekind of break in the cartridge wiring - I'm skeptical of that but I wouldn't rule it impossible.

 

[rocker91352]

I had break in on my audio technica ATH-M50's, I dont see how a break in for a cartridge would be impossible. Thank you for sharing your thoughts on the AT-95e. I ordered my orbit turntable with the AT-95e and I will see how it sounds soon!

 

[DonnieBoy]

I would have to agree with muovimies that a cartridge has to have some kind of "break-in" or "settling" with the stylus suspension. I mean it sits in the box until you install it and play it for the first time with the recommended tracking force. Until then there is no force on the stylus suspension so I would think that tracking force has some effect to the cartridge "settling" in.

But to address Vince1's point of view.. a stylus will wear over time. So is there a point between new and worn that it would sound best and be considered the "broken in" point?

 

[DonnieBoy]

I had break in on my audio technica ATH-M50's, I dont see how a break in for a cartridge would be impossible. Thank you for sharing your thoughts on the AT-95e. I ordered my orbit turntable with the AT-95e and I will see how it sounds soon!

Nice! I would like to hear what you think of the AT95E after you listen to it!

 

[iLUVanalog]

Maybe I'm in the minority but I find that "cartridge break in " is folklore. If it were the case, vinyl break in would be more significant since it is a softer material ( more subject to wear influences). Complete BS. If you are unhappy with the 95, try the 120. It is amazing right out of the box and doesn't get any better, regardless of what dreamers say.

Vince, it's ok to disagree with those who believe in break-in.

It's NOT ok to refer to them (myself included) as "dreamers"....just as it would not be ok for me to refer to you as a douche for making such a comment.

 

[melofelo]

About 10 hours run in seems to unlock most of the AT95E's potential...and it's a cartridge I've been using in my my turntable since 1988. The 3.5mv output is slightly lower than some cartridges..but still loud enough for most users. If anything it gives a bit more fine tuning of volume at lower listneing levels if you have a powerful amp or very efficient speakers.

I'm not sure if the tracking force range has changed much over the years..but somewhere between 1.8 - 1.9gm downforce has always seemed to bring out the best balance of high and low end detail in most medium mass arms I've tried it with. Go much above 2.0 gm and you loose a bit of sparkle go south of 1.8gm and you lose a bit of bass impact. But fine tune the downforce within your own arm using headphones first and then speakers after about 10 hours and you should find a good compromise.

This cartridge is still a great introduction to good quality vinyl replay for many on a tight budget...ad the upgrade uptions that have become available of the last few years makes it quite flexibile in terms of future upgrades. For me though...the basic model is plenty good enough

 

[Frank Sol]

Not unreasonable to think that physical moving parts 'break in' - which is what a cart is, a component made up of moving parts

I'm not sure why but many times the first side of the 1st LP played at the beginning of a listening session sounds less good than the 2nd side or later played LPs - I'm not opposed to marking this up to either 1. my brain warming up or 2. my cart warming up

 

[iLUVanalog]

About 10 hours run in seems to unlock most of the AT95E's potential...and it's a cartridge I've been using in my my turntable since 1988. The 3.5mv output is slightly lower than some cartridges..but still loud enough for most users. If anything it gives a bit more fine tuning of volume at lower listneing levels if you have a powerful amp or very efficient speakers.

I'm not sure if the tracking force range has changed much over the years..but somewhere between 1.8 - 1.9gm downforce has always seemed to bring out the best balance of high and low end detail in most medium mass arms I've tried it with. Go much above 2.0 gm and you loose a bit of sparkle go south of 1.8gm and you lose a bit of bass impact. But fine tune the downforce within your own arm using headphones first and then speakers after about 10 hours and you should find a good compromise.

This cartridge is still a great introduction to good quality vinyl replay for many on a tight budget...ad the upgrade uptions that have become available of the last few years makes it quite flexibile in terms of future upgrades. For me though...the basic model is plenty good enough

(I am neither agreeing or disagreeing with Melofelo).....The tracking force range for this cartridge is rather broad (1.5 to 2.5 grams), and AT recommends a tracking force of 2.0 grams. I routinely track mine at 2.2 grams, well within the max of 2.5.

My 95E is mounted on a medium mass SL1200 tonearm, and is never tracked below 2 grams. Additionally, tracking it at 2.2 grams I have not noticed any appreciable loss of "sparkle". If anything, to me the sound is more stable and balanced.

What tracking force is used will depend on the combined effective mass of arm and cartridge...although the 95 is better suited to a medium mass arm.

 

[melofelo]

the little suspension rubber on medium compliance cartridges probably become a bit more flexible after initial use...and budget stylus tend not be as finely polished to begin with anyway...so running in a new cartridge on well played non valuable vinyl for 10 hours or so certainly doesn't hurt it.
If you think 'break in' is a myth...you're probably never used an AT-110E ...the first 30 hours will drive you nuts with sheer treble detail...and not much else....50 hours in...you'll see why it's still one of my all time favorite budget cartridges...in addition to the AT-95E of course