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Need help on a setup

Blueberries

New Member
I'm getting an audio technica lp120. I'm actually gonna have this set up in a pretty big room so I want the sound to be heard from the front of the room all the way to the back. Most people are telling me to get two pairs of speakers. Two in the front and two in the back. Is this possible? I was first interested in the Yamaha natural sound rs-201 receiver, along with audioengine hd6 powered speakers and the audioengine subwoofer. Would I need a receiver with more channels? I honestly know nothing about receivers and set ups. It's all complicated and confusing to me lol. I don't have a price limit, if you think I need to upgrade anything else let me know what you're thinking!
 
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Why would you need a receiver if you've settled on powered speakers? Conversely, if you've decided on the receiver, there's no need to use powered speakers..regular bookshelf speakers would suffice.

Are you set on the Audio Technica?

What is your budget for everything? This would help with suggestions.

What are the dimensions of the room?

Do you have the opportunity to go to an audio store that has the Yamaha in stock and listen to it?
 
Why would you need a receiver if you've settled on powered speakers? Conversely, if you've decided on the receiver, there's no need to use powered speakers..regular bookshelf speakers would suffice.

Are you set on the Audio Technica?

What is your budget for everything? This would help with suggestions.

What are the dimensions of the room?

Do you have the opportunity to go to an audio store that has the Yamaha in stock and listen to it?

I was told I would need a receiver, no matter which turntable or speakers I would buy.
Also, I was told audio technica is the best choice because of the built in preamp, but nothing is set in stone yet. Like I said I don't know much about this stuff so I'm going on what I've been previously told.

There is honestly no budget, if it's worth the cost then I'm okay with spending the money. I'm not against selling a bunch of stuff to afford the perfect set up lol.
I don't know the dimensions but it's very big, and it's full of furniture and other stuff, no echo.
I could definitely go to a store that has the Yamaha and check it out.
 
That's a big room. I wouldn't even consider the audio engines, they're far too small. You need large floor standers, or failing that, around 4 devialet phantoms chained together. Maybe the big JBLs or Klipsch would be good, too.
 
I can't comment on the equipment because I have no experience with any of it. (That said, I did note during a quick Google search that the Onkyo TX-8020 looks like a better sonic performer, but with half the watts. Remember, tho, watts aren't everything.)

The real question I think you should ask yourself is, What am I going to do with the system? Will you sit down and do critical listening, in which case you'll be worrying about things like soundstage, instrument placement, true harmonic tuning, those sorts of things. Will you have the system mostly for parties, hanging out with the family, working in the kitchen? In this case, maybe your talking about power, ability to play LPs while others are walking around the room, etc. Will you mostly use the system as background music to your life's daily movements? In this case, maybe your more worried about the size of the system, it's ability to fill the room with reasonable sound but blowing the windows out isn't really anything you care about.

Most likely, you'll want a mixture of all three (probably more options 2 and 3 given what your talking about above).

There is no right or wrong answer here. Just make sure you know the things you need to achieve your goals.

Next, I think you have been sold some horse malarchy.

First, any turntable can work for you. However, the Yamaha you mention above does not have a phono stage, so you'll need a preamp. Further, it is unclear to me that the 201 has many inputs at all, as I can't seem to find a list of them, other than it has 40 presets for FM. (Does any market have 40 stations?)

I'd move right on past the Yamaha 201 receiver. It won't meet your requirements bease it does nto hAve a phono stage. In your price range, the Onkyo mentioned above does have a phono stage. The job of a phono stage is, very simply, to take the very low output from a turntable and boost it so the preamp can handle the signal. It is a phono preamp, basically.

Next, it is quite possible to run 4 speakers and a subwoofer. I'm just not sure you need to because I don't know what you want your system to do. If you only want it to play music, don't worry about having 4 speakers in one room. Get two better speakers that, maybe, don't need a subwoofer.

In audio, there is a general rule every beginner should know:

Used equipment is your friend. I have purchase at least 50 used, vintage pieces of stereo equipment. I have had problems with two pieces, the cost of which were both refunded. (One piece was broken in transit. One was misrepresented.) When it comes to refunds, eBay is also your friend. From some place like craigslist, you are your friend. You'll get to go check out the equipment. Make sure you know how to check it out, but don't worry, there are hundreds of websites to tell you what to do, including this one.​

There is another rule in most audio equipment, and this rule is sort of counter intuitive.

All things being equal (both pieces of equipment work as they should), vintage equipment will kick the hell out of new equipment just about every time. For example, I bought a very low end Kenwood integrated amp from 1978 for $50 on Craigs list. It's a beautiful little silver piece rated at about 30 watts per channel. I use it to drive a pair of bookshelf Polk Monitor 4s, which are 4 ohms. I use a sloppy Techniques turntable ($30 off craigslist) with a good cartridge (it came with ghe turntable) and stylus ( its a Shure M91ED with a $50 aftermarket stylus from LP Gear), and the system blows away my best friend's $1000 Denon system from 2009 with a $400 Pro-ject turntable. My best friend will tell you the same. And for the relatively low cost of what I just described ( $130 + cables and cheap speaker wire -- $25?) I can afford to give this system to my best friend, and he can sell his over priced system on eBay to someone like himself.​

Of course, at the time the vintage equipment was sold, the late 1970s and early 1980s, it would probably cost well over $1,000 in today's dollar. That's something to think about before you spend $500 for today's system over buying vintage. And I haven't told you the half of it!

Another worry many people have about vintage audio equipment is, if it breaks, it will cost huge bucks to get it fixed. Again, not true. For example, remember the piece of equipment I said was misrepresented on eBay? I had it repaired by an Audiokarma member who also lives here in Denver (Dr Dan, whowever does grear work). He would only use like components to rebuild the piece (I think he order them from around the world), and I think I spent less than $200 on a complete recap of the integrated amp that I then used 2 years exclusively. I still love that amp. It has been moved to my office where it drives a pair of B&W DM202s ($200) aND a Luxman turntable ($175) i learned to tuneup aND has a blast doing it!

Last - don't get into vinyl because of the cool factor. Oh, LPs are defiantly cool - don't get me wrong. They are also a pain in the ass, however, and can easily become all consuming. They are expensive. LPs are tough to take care of: they accumulate stuff in their grooves, attract static, are heat and moisture sensitive, and no matter what you do, degrade with each playing. You have to deal with addressing all of these issues.

Then there is the turntable... As you may have figured out, you'll need new stili for sure, but that's the least of it. You have to figure out how to isolate the TT from undo vibrations. You'll want a good cartridge on tour tonearm. That new cartridge (or new to you) may need a stylus right out of the box. You have to make time consuming adjustments to the tonearm and cartridge everytime you change a cartridge (maybe not that often, unless you become a cartridge whore). You have to make sure the platter on you table rotates at the correct speed. You'll probably need to learn how to replace a TT belt. If you get too deep into this stuff, you'll need to learn how to take a table apart and lubricate it. You may even decide to learn how to mount a new tonearm on your table(s).

But you know what? Nothing will likely sound as good as a well taken care of turntable, but you have to love that girl to get her to sing.

One piece of advise: don't tell the people here you want the absolute best system and you'll sell you stuff to get it. If that is the case, I know several $100,000+ turntable's you could buy, plus $50,000 cartridges, and amps that will run you $250,000. Just tell us a budget. It will make your life much easier!

I hope any of this helps. I've included an couple of articles below. Both are great for helping you understand what you are about to undertake - your first stereo adventure. Remember, do your own research. Salesmen are in it for themselves. Audiokarma is a great place to ask questions, as are several other websites. (You'll learn those.)

BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY, HAVE FUN! Don't be afraid to experiment. It's all worth it, though.

Cheers!

http://stereos.about.com/od/buyingastereo/ht/buyingastereo.htm

http://pitchfork.com/features/artic...and-stereo-system-for-your-record-collection/
 
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Wait - 10,000 Sq ft? Have you considered a P.A. system? Is there any way you could carve a listening space out of that loft? I didn't mention listening spaces above, but clearly we are on to that discussion...
 
The AT already has a built-in phono preamp, so the receiver isn't required to have one. You're also not required to become a turntable mechanic, 99% of people aren't. What you do need, however, is advice on that room. Most receivers/amplifiers won't run two pairs of speakers, so be careful. Also, watts are everything, so get the max you can afford. Speakers can be difficult loads, so too much is always better than too little.
 
Blueberries please confirm the size of the room, length/width/height in feet and where you are located, city/town/state/province/country. If the room is as large as your indicating any of the equipment you have mentioned so far including the turntable isn't going to make a dent, as mentioned you may be bordering on a professional sound system as used in night clubs. JBL both in the past and today mfgs very large speakers for the home/consumer market, they arn't cheap, along with those large speakers you will need equally high quality amplifier and preamp, a turntable on the same level of quality isn't going to be a $200 AT LP-120. I'd estimate a budget of at least $10,000 for excellent condition preowned equipment that will fill the room.
 
Watts are everything? What manufacturer's wattage rating do you trust, Grottyash? Yamaha? Onkyo? Denon?

I know some standard has been put in place for measuring amplifier watts, which no doubt gives consumers some false sense of confidence related to assessment and reporting, but I don't believe any of it. As a developer of standards and regulations, I'll tell you 20 ways to get around any standard or regulation.

Blueberries, let your ears tell you what's right. They are, after all, the final judge. Reported measurements are only as good as the equipment used to take the measurement and the honesty of the manufacturer and marketing department.

Grottyash is correct in one regard, sort of. You cannot drive two sets of speakers with different levels of resistance, expressed as ohms. For example, my B&W speakers are 8 ohms. My Polk speakers are 4 ohms. Playing both at the same time on the same amp will cook the damn thing quick. However, playing two sets of speakers with the same electrical resistance rating is just fine. I played mt Infinity monitors and crappy Cerwin Vegas together at every college party I had. After all, louder was better, and my Marantz 2222b, at 20 watts, could drive both speacker, and my neighbors, to hell and back.

Here's were Grottyash might jump in and tell you resistance measurements for speakers aren't reliable, which is true, but they are reliable enough, generally, for you to feel comfortable playing two sets of speakers with the same reported resistance measurement. You do, however, take a risk doing so, but every THX manufacturer takes the same risk when it sells someone a 7-channel system. [Do these have some electrical mechanism to handle differences in speaker resistence?]

So why isn't this true for watts? Because people will pay more for a 150-watt amp than for a 100-watt amp. The wattage rating really influences buying decissions - who doesn't want a 300-watt amp? - at least when compared to the resistance of speakers. Again, a thousand arguments can be made one way or another about this, but my statement is generally accurate.
 
Hi,

You don't need two pairs of speakers, just one good (loud) pair.

Beyond the critical distance (where direct sound = reflected sound)
the perceived volume in the room will be moreorless the same.
That is it will carry pretty well to everywhere, the actual general
volume perceived will depend on the acoustics of the room.

rgds, sreten.
 
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