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New Apogee XLM EMIM Diaphragms (2024!)

Ervikingo

Active Member
Happy days!

As I posted before, I sent Graz 4 EMIMs to have them restored and modified/updated with the latest version of his diaphragms. He calls them XLM.

They were delivered over the weekend and have been playing non stop since Sunday evening. I plan to share my impressions now and as they "relax".

They replaced the original EMIMs on my IRS Beta. For reference the crossovers have been recapped and the woofers were restored by Watkins. My Servo Control woofers were replaced with originals sourced and tuned by a dear friend and contributor to AK from the old continent that shall remain nameless but THANKS MUCH "A". They are connected to Threshold SA 12e on bass, and Manley Snappers on mid/high. Preamp is an Allnic 6500.

Back to the XLMs; quoting Graz: "Run them in gently, they are VERY tight from new, and need to relax into the role, around 70-80 hours real music (no tones or "burn-in" cd). Over this time there is a little bit of an electrical adjustment, but mostly mechanical relaxation. Once they have completed the 80 hours they will be at peak performance, and should give a good long service"
I gave them an initial listening and have a very long Qobuz playlist running at mid/low volumes except I gave them a listen again this morning with some of my "reference tracks".

Initial impressions:

- Service and communications from Graz: A+ all questions asked, craftsmanship is superb as was packing and shipping

- Cosmetically they look different (up close) but they look right in place with the speakers. Quoting my significant other: "they look very cool now". The circuit looks totally different than the original Infinity

- Sound:
  • a markedly wider soundstage I guess related to being able to reproduce frequencies that the originals could not reach or had stopped reaching after all these years
  • vocals are very clear and lifelike with no sibilance whatsoever (there was a bit of that before on a particular recording)
  • violins, violas etc are silky and reed instruments are in the room with you. You clearly "feel" the bow rasping the strings and the reeds vibrating
  • guitars are lifelike, the depth of the sound is all there (I am partial to guitar and I am a frustrated player). The picking is all there.
  • pianos are present, clear and deep
  • I can hear details I had not heard before on recordings I am very familiar with (classical, jazz and hard rock
  • even congas sound more lifelike
They measure (ohms) the same as the original ones but I feel they are perhaps more efficient. I will consider this and might adjust the lpads accordingly once they are settled in.

I want to ask Graz about the radiation pattern and if he thinks it varies much from the original diaphragms. I use very little toe in on mine and will test different toe settings to fine tune.

I know that Graz has an account here ( @Apogee-Graz ) hopefully he can chip in some additional info.

I have joked that soon I will call my Beta "Beta Evo". I plan on updating the LEMIMs and one of my Servo Controllers is on its way to Bob S for service/updating (no known issues with it but it has been making beautiful music for almost 4 decades).

We know its not possible to properly experience our systems via video but here is a video for your enjoyment (recorded on iPhone):
Infinity IRS Beta with Apogee Acoustics XLM EMIM

1733854869300.jpeg1733854897869.jpeg (i have to improve on the routing of the positive lead)1733854929456.jpeg
 
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Congratulations. I've been running 6 Graz EMIMs in my RSIIb's since he first came out with them. They still sound spectacular and show zero signs of deterioration in 15 years of hard use!
Electrostatic clarity plus the ability to play LOUD without sounding strained is hard to beat...
 

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Such a cool story.

I love Graz. I have his ribbons in my Studio Grands.

The A[ogee Forums seem dead, does he have a new forum?
 
Congratulations. I've been running 6 Graz EMIMs in my RSIIb's since he first came out with them. They still sound spectacular and show zero signs of deterioration in 15 years of hard use!
Electrostatic clarity plus the ability to play LOUD without sounding strained is hard to beat...
Things of beauty! Thanks for your feedback. Looking forward to years of enjoyment!
 
Absolutely gorgeous set up in the video!

Does Graz still produce these new emim diaphragms? If so, where/how did you order these?

Also, has anyone compared GRAZ to AVA EMIM diaphrams? I've always been intrigued by both and deeply appreciate them for keeping our speakers alive!
 
Absolutely gorgeous set up in the video!

Does Graz still produce these new emim diaphragms? If so, where/how did you order these?

Also, has anyone compared GRAZ to AVA EMIM diaphrams? I've always been intrigued by both and deeply appreciate them for keeping our speakers alive!
Many thanks! I consider myself lucky that I get to enjoy my favorite speakers after growing up, listening to some of the best of their time (my late father’s AR3a, Dahlquist DQ10, DCMTime Windows, …)

You can get them from @Apogee-Graz. I have his latest and greatest, the XLM. Not sure how he has setup his ordering for the new panels at www.apogeeacoustics.com

You can reach him at info@apogeeacoustics.com

Another week in and they sound even better. I’m happy!

PS, I do own AVA’s diaphragms (not only for the EMIM) which I bought as spares and to support Bob since he supports our speakers.
 
Absolutely gorgeous set up in the video!

Does Graz still produce these new emim diaphragms? If so, where/how did you order these?

Also, has anyone compared GRAZ to AVA EMIM diaphrams? I've always been intrigued by both and deeply appreciate them for keeping our speakers alive!
The Graz units are a ribbon upgrade (only attached at the ends) to the stock planars (attached around the entire perimeter); the AVA are replacement planars. Big difference.
Honestly the Graz units are an order of magnitude better sounding than stock, far more detailed and can easily handle anything you throw at them without excessive distortion.
 
Many thanks! I consider myself lucky that I get to enjoy my favorite speakers after growing up, listening to some of the best of their time (my late father’s AR3a, Dahlquist DQ10, DCMTime Windows, …)

You can get them from @Apogee-Graz. I have his latest and greatest, the XLM. Not sure how he has setup his ordering for the new panels at www.apogeeacoustics.com

You can reach him at info@apogeeacoustics.com

Another week in and they sound even better. I’m happy!

PS, I do own AVA’s diaphragms (not only for the EMIM) which I bought as spares and to support Bob since he supports our speakers.

This is great info, thank you. So gald to hear you are enjoying them so much!

The Graz units are a ribbon upgrade (only attached at the ends) to the stock planars (attached around the entire perimeter); the AVA are replacement planars. Big difference.
Honestly the Graz units are an order of magnitude better sounding than stock, far more detailed and can easily handle anything you throw at them without excessive distortion.

I am so glad to hear this. I REALLY do love what AVA has done for this community... so much appreciation! I had a feeling the graz ones were going to be a significant upgrade. I will have to check his website out for myself!
 
Question, does Graz send these new emim ribbon replacements to your house or do you send him your EMIM's to have them upgraded/replaced?

If he sends you the new ribbon, does he provide installation instructions or a video of how to replace them?
 
Such a cool story.

I love Graz. I have his ribbons in my Studio Grands.

The A[ogee Forums seem dead, does he have a new forum?
To be honest social media is a disappointment all round, though there is a genuine manufacturer Apogee Acoustics chat on fb.
 
Hey Graz, thanks for the comment! Great to see you are still on this website! :)

Moderator edit: removed question about pricing as that would violate AK rules.
 
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Moderator's warning:

As good AK members, we all should remember that the AK rules preclude vendors from advertising their products outside the vendor area. They are welcome to answer questions, but they may not offer to sell or anything close to that.

This thread is stepping over the line and we need to reel it back in, because it does have great value for us Infinity owners, but stepping over that line will result in the thread being closed.

So, all of us should avoid anything resembling "here's what I have to offer" or "hey, how much does this or that cost". Conduct those lines in private messages or directly to each other.
 
An update and some additional information

I have not kept a precise tracking of how many hours they have been playing but I can say they get even better. Graz had told me to expect that as the panels move (should I say loosen or stretch).

I have tried different toe settings and found no need to change it (in my application) from where I had them. All pots are at the same setting as before (the manual suggests setting them at 100% but I keep them at 75%) but I will experiment with the EMIM levels a bit perhaps with REW.

---

Some other Infinity friends asked me for further details of the different panels. Following I summarize the info based on my direct exchanges with Apogee and on Graz’s posts on the Vintage Infinity page on Facebook

For those of us with LEMIM drivers, they have very advanced (I understand complete) design ready but they are testing/sourcing a suitable “felt” material. I have 4 spare LEMIM ready to be sent for update as soon as they are ready!

Regarding the EMIM, they have 2 versions of the diaphragms, XLM and KLM with different specifications/range according to the needs of our speakers:

The ones I have are the XLM which reach and perform better at the higher frequencies dictated by the crossovers on the Beta, Gamma, Delta and for the higher frequency EMIM (#3 I think; based on the xover schematic) on the RS1 (using KLM on the other 6 EMIM positions).

The KLM are better suited for the crossover settings used on the 6 lower EMIM positions of the RS1 and on all positions on IRS Vs.

On the Vintage Infinity page on Facebook Graz has been sharing additional details and recommendations to improve the performance of the EMIM. He suggests adding damping, trap and spacers.

I had mine serviced at Apogee so they have the full treatment including replacing or restoring issues with the magnets. My request to them was “do everything you think they need”.

As @dlucy says, pricing questions etc. should be addressed directly with Apogee or via private messaging.
 
Hmmm...maybe I need an XLM on the center EMIM of my RSIIb's, the high midrange one.
Too bad Christmas is already here. Maybe for Valentine's day...
 
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