New OLD Chrysler CE-509 Loudspeakers

[drbiggles]

Next time you talk to the Bozak guy, ask him when the 302's were made. There's a date code on the sticker, on the backs. I believe it's post 1962 that have the aluminum cone tweeters and mids. Otherwise they're going to have the paper versions and that's not what you're looking for. I suggest pestering him and get those, put your time and effort into something that you could very well be buried with. Bozak's B209B midrange is still considered to be a world class driver, and the B199 12" woofer is absolutely divine. The detail and precision stands up to today's music without skipping a beat. I can go from 1950's Cuban Jazz to Justin Timberlake, easy peasy. You're looking for the Tobin 104T Schematic for the updated crossover, and it's necessary to bring the drivers to their best. It incorporates a Zobel network for the tweeters, flattens their response so you don't get any spikes. It crosses the woofer over at 400Hz vs 800Hz, lightens its load. And it changes the crossover for the mid from 2500Hz down to 1250Hz. That sounds really odd, but the B209B's impedance rises as the frequency goes up and it gets really bright. The crossovers are fairly simple to build, just take your time and you'll have it down in no time. Here's a pair I built for a customer, quite a bit of fun.

Biggles

 

[richartistic]

Thanks for the information on the Bozaks. I will check with him to see precisely what he has. Very nice work on those crossovers. You just made my day, putting together a wooden circuit board like that, and here I was thinking I would have to find a breadboard and all. There is an OEM company here in town and so I should be able to find those terminal attachments. Do you mind me asking where you find your audio grade components such as the inductors and the caps? I guess I should check out Simply Speaker or Parts Express, but maybe my local electronics outlet has decent ones. Your crossovers look very professional! I really like the work.

 

[drbiggles]

Thank you sir! Those B302A's, and others, all have the Bozak N10102 3-way crossover. All you need off those are the 4 inductors, 2 for the midrange and 2 for the woofer. Each inductor is actually 2 rolled into one package. This means you can either roll the woofer off at 400Hz, or 800Hz. And you can have your midrange crossed over at 1250, or 2500Hz. It all depends on what taps you use off each inductor. Everything else on my crossovers are new. Most simply rebuild the original N10102 crossovers. But they're a bit smaller, I wanted more room to spread things out a bit. That and using new 2 to 3 lug terminal strips really appeals to me. 50+ year old wiring and terminal strips is a recipe for failures.

For these Bozak rigs, I buy the 10watt resistors and Dayton 5% poly caps from Parts Express. Enough of both to do a pair of crossovers is about 54 dollars delivered. Sure, you can try other caps to change the flavor. But finding an 8.2uf cap can be more difficult that one might think. Dayton caps deliver tons of great performance very affordably. You can also buy Dayton 1% caps, I think you'll spend about 40 dollars more for the opportunity. There is no audible performance increase vs the 5%. People buy them for the cache, or to make themselves feel good about spending more money.

A friend came up with a mod that you may want to consider. Bozak mounted their tweeters over the B199 woofer, this puts the tweeters lower on the baffle. It's a long story, but the Bozak B200Y tweeters are 9 decibels hotter than their predecessor. So, there's an attenuation network in Pat Tobin's 104T tweeter leg. This attenuation, combined with the tweeters being low, can make them dull and difficult to hear. So, what myself and others have been doing is to remove the 7.5ohm attenuating resistor out of the tweeter leg of the crossover. To that, we connect an 8ohm L-Pad instead. Connect it to the 8ohm variable side of the L-pad. Essentially what you end up with is an adjustable resistor. This way you can adjust the tweeters to your liking, I find this mod necessary.

Another way of handling this is to mount the tweeters in a small cabinet and set it on top of the B302A cabinets. This gets the tweeters up high, improves dispersion and is the way to go. But for some, doing the woodwork and wiring is more than they can deal with. I've done it both ways, great results either way.

Biggles

 

[richartistic]

Thanks Biggles for the info. The more I play my Chryslers, the better I like them. I cleaned out the control pots in the back for the highs and lows with Deoxit, and although these speakers don't have super complex crossovers they really do work well to change the entire tone of the boxes. I can go from very bass sound to very high response. I've played a few different genres of music through these and they really sound great with the jazz that I like (Fourplay, Rippingtons) and they do well on more rock and country sounding tunes.

I really want to purchase some Bozak crossovers and the Bozaks that the person who sold me the Sansui has in his arsenal. I think I may try to push him to let them go soon. He is looking for some nice speaker cabinetry and so I might try to work out a cabinetry trade/money to get them in my possession. The seller is a super guy, very honest and so hopefully we can both work out a deal. I looked at the full range Utahs I have and I'm going to make some sort of unusual cabinet to house them, maybe a large console with built in speakers on either side. It will definitely have to be Mid Modern to fit all my 1960s/ '70s equipment

I wish that I had all my contract work finished as now, I'm jazzed to complete my newly designed living room area. Hopefully by the end of summer I'll at least have that portion of my house project finished and enjoying my equipment. The next posting I make will be the Sansui 890. It is a nice receiver and one of the prettiest I've come across. It will be a permanent member of my equipment line up. Look back this evening if you are interested in photos of the 890.

 

[wolfman23]

I love my 509's and would stand them up to any vintage speaker and most of todays. I've got them sitting next to a pair of NHT and they make the NHT sound like a 6x9 in an empty 5 gal bucket. Had them for a few years now.

 

[Ron O.]

I put Nobsound isolators under my Crysler ce509’s and they sound amazing. Better than my Rola Ditton 66’s, Altec Lansings’ VOTT’s or my Grayson Stadlers. I used 4 each of the springs for each Nobsound isolator because of the weight of the Chrysler’s, but after some fiddling around, wound up using all 7 springs for each isolator. Driving them with Denon gear at 45 wpc. I have some Kinetgetics Research amps but not sure yet they need that kind of power.richartistic, post: 10447396, member: 254470"]Hi,
I'm back. Sorry it took so long, but I just finished putting in place, one of my Chrysler CE 509 speakers. I promised to post before and after photos of the job and so here they are. The speaker looks pretty decent. I shot it with 3 coats of Precatalyzed Lacquer and here are the results:
BTW, I added something to the bottom of this speaker, a flat plat w/ beveled edges trimmed in solid walnut veneer. The reason I did this was because these speakers are individually so heavy, I couldn't move them easily across my carpet and they are too big and bulky to pick up. They must weigh about 65 lbs each. With the new added plate it is easy as pie to slide around on the carpet. Anyway here are the shots:[/QUOTE]
Ok

 

[goodolpg]

I don't see any images.

 

[Ron O.]

I don't see any images.

Someone removed the original bottom pedestals and painted them black. I have the skillset and materials to completely refinish or resurface the pair, but that’s very low on my priority list. The Nobsound isolation feet have made a dramatic improvement in my listening space.

 

[goodolpg]

Thanks for posting the images, I'm not sure I've ever seen those.
Maybe once before.

 

[Ron O.]

Thanks for posting the images, I'm not sure I've ever seen those.
Maybe once before.

As I am lead to believe, the original spelling was Chrysler, but the Japanese company was persuaded?? to change the spelling to Crysler. I’ve seen only one other pair and they are a beautiful walnut with gold metal grill surround and grill cloth. I have to say, hands down the best speakers (for their size) I have ever heard. Purely subjective I know, but still to me, stunning performance.
Lows are clean and tight. Bass response falls off around 35 I would guess, but powerful resonance all the way down. Crossover to mids is unnoticed. Mids are smooth and transient. Highs are not very “bright”, but clean and crisp, which suits my older ears just fine.
I can’t tell you how disappointed I was when I finally hooked up my Altec Lansing VOTT’s and the Cryslers (side by side, same amp, gear etc..) and the Cryslers handed the Altecs their ass in every respect except sheer volume.
I have a ton of money and effort into the VOTT, and next to nothing in the Cryslers. If I find another set of Crysler CE509’s I would sure be interested in buying them.

 

[Nautiker]

Those CE-509s are really nice-looking speakers...

 

[JRB2009]

I bought my pair of "Crysler CE-509" speakers in January, 1969, while serving in Vietnam. (Note: the small badge on the top front of each speaker is labeled "Crysler Electric Co LTD"). A good buddy was going to Japan on R&R to visit an orphanage he supported and I gave him about $1,600 to buy a quantity of stereo gear to ship back to the US. (A receiver (JVC?), Teac 6010 and 4010 tape decks, and another set of smaller speakers besides the CE-509s). From late 1969 to about 1971, as a civilian again, I played the heck out of this gear.. but after getting married and moving, the stereo items (excluding the receiver and the smaller set of speakers) sat in an unused room for decades. Now that I have just moved again (late fall 2020), I have decided to incorporate them into a new home theater set-up in my new residence-- assuming they will work with a new Sony STR-DN1080 AV receiver now on order. The CE-509s are very heavy and since the exterior surfaces have been banged up over the years, I will most likely insert them into the ends of a built-in 13 foot long cabinet for the media and home theater equipment. I was doing research on the possibilities of using my vintage gear with new technology when I chanced across this thread. Good to see that I am not the only one with a set of CE-509s.

 

[bluehost]

Beautiful !

I have ben looking for some good, but not overly expensive, columns for my 1979 vintage Kenwood amp. Today on fb marketplace I found an ad for a pair of very nice looking Chrysler speakers, and have a deal to buy them tomorrow. Based on your posting here, I will take a trailer and two-wheeler. Thanks for the great info.