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Number of owners. Does it really matter to you?

techguy0192

techguy0192

Listen to the whistle of the evenin' train
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I see the question of number of owners come up a lot. Either posted in for sale ads, or asked by potential buyers. Heck, I've routinely asked the question. Thinking about some of the McIntosh gear I own and have owned that was purchased from Audio Classics - I have no idea how many previous owners there were. In that particular instance, it sort of doesn't matter to me. So, how much does this matter to you all. I typically play in the area of current or very recent model equipment from the likes of McIntosh and Bryston. Not cheap stuff, so I can understand the question. Because of high percentage of this site is into vintage equipment, I'm curious to learn that perspective. I guess it's sort of like a car. It could have 4 owners and be in top condition or be a 1 owner that was totally ragged out by a 16 year old.
 
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To me, the number of times it's changed hands is an indication of how desirable it is to keep once a particular owner discovers it's performance. The law of averages obviously comes inti play here.

It would be interesting to find out how many Brystons and Macs are kept by original owners. I can't imagine more Brystons being bought new than everything else combined almost. There's always an awful lot of them for sale. Personally, I don't like them.
 
For a used unit out in the wild, I like original owners if they took care of the unit. As Conrad said, condition is the answer and you bought your stuff from one of the reconditioners so it should be nice gear. If one is going to recondition, you still want to start with an excellent condition unit. I just spend about 18 hours making a Pioneer SX-828 like new again, only cosmetically and deoxit-wise, not much in parts replacement unless there was an issue (noisy phono and pop with low filter, 6 transistors and a dozen caps, since I was there. But the unit looks great and works well, just might not sound as good as possible, yet.

As far as a car, I have an 85, original owner in very nice shape because I have maintained it. When someone is going to let a car leave the family they neglect maintenance and the next owner needs to pick it up...but by the 4th owner the car could have worn out interior, exterior and need all kinds of mechanical repairs. I would think is somewhat the same with gear. When it has a problem, they let it go, sometimes unceremoniously which ultimately hurts the unit and if parts, cosmetics and such are not available, the unit isn't going to come back as nice as a well-maintained one owner model
 
Superampman said:
To me, the number of times it's changed hands is an indication of how desirable it is to keep once a particular owner discovers it's performance. The law of averages obviously comes inti play here.

It would be interesting to find out how many Brystons and Macs are kept by original owners. I can't imagine more Brystons being bought new than everything else combined almost. There's always an awful lot of them for sale. Personally, I don't like them.
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Here's my take. The stuff on the upper end of the spectrum, Mac, ARC, etc. changes hands more because the buyers can afford to take the hit. It's sort of similar to the high end or exotic car market. I've owned new Mac and Bryston gear and find I have kept each one about the same about of time. That's not saying much, because for me, buying and trying new things is part of the hobby. You see a lot of Bryston components because they are built like a tank, come with a 20 warranty, and simply don't die.
 
If you're familiar with what you're buying (that is, you've heard that piece and you feel it'll do whatever it is you expected it to) I don't worry much about # of owners.
I think at that point (at least for me). It comes down to cosmetics and (me preferring) it not being touched (unless I know who serviced .
Its not so much I think there's magic mojo in the original pieces and I'm not a collector who feels its,more valuable stock.
I've just run across some real hack jobs so untouched and possibly needing service is better than serviced "by my tech"
 
Comes from the old saying, bought it from an old lady that only drove it to church on Sunday. Use and abuse comes in many forms and the more a unit changes hands, the more inflicted damage happens to a unit especially if they have children. So much vintage equipment was destroyed by knuckle heads and you can only hope that what you bought is not on its last leg.

But irregardless, all vintage equipment is at least thirty-eight years old. The condition of the alloyed metal used in the internal components in the circuitry has lost its technical integrity due to the heating up and cooling down process of powering up and shutting down the stereo unit. Then technology has improved in transistor and capacitor design since 1980 and since all vintage equipment needs rebuilding there are high tech replacement parts made in Germany and Japan.

Then like Chech and Chong’s movie....up in smoke, so too will all vintage equipment if not rebuilt. You can rebuild it as it was new with the same original parts or you can bring the stereo unit into the modern era by using new high tech parts within the same technical values but with increased sonics. But if you just continually fix it just to keep it working, you will spend more money than rebuilding it right.

But we’re talking specific vintage TOTL units...
 
I really only consider condition. When I bought my Sansui AU-X711 I had no idea how many people owned it before the guy selling it. Could have been 100. No way to know, so why care.
It looks great. Works great too.

Now, I must say that I do have three receivers that I bought from the original owners, and they are pristine.

Rob
 
techguy0192 said:
Here's my take. The stuff on the upper end of the spectrum, Mac, ARC, etc. changes hands more because the buyers can afford to take the hit. It's sort of similar to the high end or exotic car market. I've owned new Mac and Bryston gear and find I have kept each one about the same about of time. That's not saying much, because for me, buying and trying new things is part of the hobby. You see a lot of Bryston components because they are built like a tank, come with a 20 warranty, and simply don't die.
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Do you really think most of the people who buy gear are comprised of the type you meet here?

Ooops, I suppose it stands to reason most who post ads in the various audio sites are in fact just like US.:)

In any case, I'm still interested in the stats.
 
I sell a lot of gear, like seriously, a lot of stuff. If someone ever messaged me asking how many owners a unit had they would get ignored and i'd likely save them as 'timewaster' so I know to ignore any future attempts to message me. It's a stupid question that has absolutely no bearing on anything, if the unit i'm selling is working then all that matters is the cosmetic condition, I don't care for picky customers AT ALL.
 
Dazaa said:
I sell a lot of gear, like seriously, a lot of stuff. If someone ever messaged me asking how many owners a unit had they would get ignored and i'd likely save them as 'timewaster' so I know to ignore any future attempts to message me. It's a stupid question that has absolutely no bearing on anything, if the unit i'm selling is working then all that matters is the cosmetic condition, I don't care for picky customers AT ALL.
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I don't suppose those NRGs are gonna come up for sale anytime soon.

I could give you a fair unbiased assessment:)
 
Yeah, absent of context, # of owners doesn't really mean much. Sort of cool if you are talking to the original owner directly so you literally know the entire history of the unit.

Seems like something that shouldn't matter anyway as long as you can inspect it yourself before buying.
 
Dazaa said:
I sell a lot of gear, like seriously, a lot of stuff. If someone ever messaged me asking how many owners a unit had they would get ignored and i'd likely save them as 'timewaster' so I know to ignore any future attempts to message me. It's a stupid question that has absolutely no bearing on anything, if the unit i'm selling is working then all that matters is the cosmetic condition, I don't care for picky customers AT ALL.
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As a buyer burned way too many times, I'd ignore a seller who won't answer questions. The questioner is seeking some reassurance that the component is actually in the condition claimed - obviously, that is the reason for the question. If that is being picky, then we can agree I'm not your customer. The answer I'd like to see would include, "I honestly don't know how many former owners there may have been but since everything works properly, sounds great and cosmetics so good then my best guess is one or two."
 
techguy0192 said:
I see the question of number of owners come up a lot. Either posted in for sale ads, or asked by potential buyers. Heck, I've routinely asked the question. Thinking about some of the McIntosh gear I own and have owned that was purchased from Audio Classics - I have no idea how many previous owners there were. In that particular instance, it sort of doesn't matter to me. So, how much does this matter to you all. I typically play in the area of current or very recent model equipment from the likes of McIntosh and Bryston. Not cheap stuff, so I can understand the question. Because of high percentage of this site is into vintage equipment, I'm curious to learn that perspective. I guess it's sort of like a car. It could have 4 owners and be in top condition or be a 1 owner that was totally ragged out by a 16 year old.
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Its learning the history of the gear in question. At times it matters, and can help if you are planning on letting an item go. Its a poke and a pull.
 
As much as I hate the term, It Is What It Is, and how many times it's changed hands doesn't matter to me. What I worry about is what those previous hands may have had on them. And I'm scared to buy a "...original owner, recently deceased" because of possible haunting issues. Who needs that?
 
Dazaa said:
Doesn't look like they will be working anytime soon unfortunately, it's been a 4 year (and running) quest for help.
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Huh? I thought you had them up and running. So you can't find anyone over there capable of working on them? That's just odd. What about going on a little adventure to a neighboring EU member? You could enquire over at DIY AUDIO. Susan Parker even comes to mind over there in England. She's a member there, done some fabulous things.
 
Todd Dodds said:
As much as I hate the term, It Is What It Is, and how many times it's changed hands doesn't matter to me. What I worry about is what those previous hands may have had on them. And I'm scared to buy a "...original owner, recently deceased" because of possible haunting issues. Who needs that?
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Well, I'm a Black Sabbath fan, so the haunting would be plus, I'll even pay extra for it. I want to see that dude come floating out of the heat sink vent right at the peak of Iommi's solo in Children of The Grave......
 
Superampman said:
Huh? I thought you had them up and running. So you can't find anyone over there capable of working on them? That's just odd. What about going on a little adventure to a neighboring EU member? You could enquire over at DIY AUDIO. Susan Parker even comes to mind over there in England. She's a member there, done some fabulous things.
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No, my tech is very very slow and generally doesn't seem to care much. I have to really bug him to get any kind of progress, currently they power on with 60v on the terminals.
 
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