• The move to the new server is done. There are some software and database maintenance updates in process. This has us passing the hat around to help out. We appreciate any donations. Seriously, even a dollar helps. The payment page may be found here - https://www.audiokarma.org/support.html

Observations about the Turntable forum

Azimuth

Azimuth

Well-Known Member
I have been here since the early 2000s, but I started with a different moniker. These days I have noticed quite a change in this forum. 25 years ago there was an older generation, who were quite knowledgeable, posting regularly. They responded frequently and in detail to a variety of issues. The overall discussions on most topics seemed to attract long discussions and many comments. Now I notice that even the “hotter” topics of that time receive little attention. Many posts get less than 10 replies. One reason may be that there are fewer people here. Another that all that can be said about certain topics, especially vintage, has been said. A third that many now going into vinyl just buy a new turntable without wanting to delve any deeper, or that the topics that used to interest enthusiasts (almost like antique cars,) just aren’t current or of interest. Another possibility is that there are endless Facebook groups or YouTube videos covering these issues now and there are a lot of options. I could be wrong. I do appreciate those who do take the time to respond here.
 
Register to hide this ad
Well, for us older people, vinyl was all there was for a long time. Not that many bought pre-recorded tapes. We understood mechanical devices and even though there are some subtleties to turntables, the basic thing is fairly simple and understandable. IMO, not as many people today are into mechanical things. As you say, there's a lot of info on FB YT and other places and I suspect many people just want an appliance with the smell of analog.
 
I for one have delved deeply into the older threads to get educated. I find them highly valuable.

I do agree that knowledge sharing and transfer has many other avenues now like YouTube especially.

Speaking of Forums, still bummed out I can't register to VinylEngine and HifiEngine. There's gold in them hills and the doors are locked shut.
 
decreed_it said:
I for one have delved deeply into the older threads to get educated. I find them highly valuable.
Click to expand...
Yep, the search feature here is outstanding, and I got a wealth of information from older threads when looking at new turntable options recently.
decreed_it said:
Speaking of Forums, still bummed out I can't register to VinylEngine and HifiEngine. There's gold in them hills and the doors are locked shut.
Click to expand...
I'm registered, but Vinyl Engine switched from a password system to using a code sent to your e-mail address. That worked fine for me for a while, but now it only returns the error message "SMTP Error: Could not authenticate." Sad, but at least I can still read their various forums.
 
I've noticed a slowdown, some of it is seasonal. I know my bench time also decreases massively in the summer.

It may also be that a lot has been fleshed out over the years, and preferred models have been pretty well established. At least in the context of this forum. There's not much discussion of new arms and tables, but that can be found elsewhere.

The third point is that we've watched the evolution of the second hand market for tables eat thru many closets and attics. The covid clean out also purged many. I see far fewer in the wild, and that random discovery is often what it takes to spur discussion.
 
Azimuth said:
I have been here since the early 2000s, but I started with a different moniker. These days I have noticed quite a change in this forum. 25 years ago there was an older generation, who were quite knowledgeable, posting regularly. They responded frequently and in detail to a variety of issues. The overall discussions on most topics seemed to attract long discussions and many comments. Now I notice that even the “hotter” topics of that time receive little attention. Many posts get less than 10 replies. One reason may be that there are fewer people here. Another that all that can be said about certain topics, especially vintage, has been said. A third that many now going into vinyl just buy a new turntable without wanting to delve any deeper, or that the topics that used to interest enthusiasts (almost like antique cars,) just aren’t current or of interest. Another possibility is that there are endless Facebook groups or YouTube videos covering these issues now and there are a lot of options. I could be wrong. I do appreciate those who do take the time to respond here.
Click to expand...
All aspects that you mention contribute to what you (rightly) observe. I do think that TT enthousiasts inevitably find forums, Facebook and other media/social formats don't dig deep enough in term of knowledge and discussion about the particulars and mechanical science & -practicalities of setting up and running a TT.
Lencoheaven is (still) a good place for turntable enthousiasts too.
 
jrtrent said:
I'm registered, but Vinyl Engine switched from a password system to using a code sent to your e-mail address. That worked fine for me for a while, but now it only returns the error message "SMTP Error: Could not authenticate." Sad, but at least I can still read their various forums.
Click to expand...
I read somewhere that gmail is less troublesome for hifiengine
 
Last edited:
Azimuth said:
I have been here since the early 2000s, but I started with a different moniker. These days I have noticed quite a change in this forum. 25 years ago there was an older generation, who were quite knowledgeable, posting regularly. They responded frequently and in detail to a variety of issues. The overall discussions on most topics seemed to attract long discussions and many comments. Now I notice that even the “hotter” topics of that time receive little attention. Many posts get less than 10 replies. One reason may be that there are fewer people here. Another that all that can be said about certain topics, especially vintage, has been said. A third that many now going into vinyl just buy a new turntable without wanting to delve any deeper, or that the topics that used to interest enthusiasts (almost like antique cars,) just aren’t current or of interest. Another possibility is that there are endless Facebook groups or YouTube videos covering these issues now and there are a lot of options. I could be wrong. I do appreciate those who do take the time to respond here.
Click to expand...
actually I don't agree with pretty much any of this.
I think the turntable forum is still mainly occupied by old timers, at least I think the average age is still well above 50.
Also I think the average knowledge about turntable playback has gone up significantly the last decade. Lots more measurements and ways to measure aspects of setups, more blind listening tests etc (more abstract knowledge focussed forums like ASR for sure contributed to that) etc. Certainly imho not a case that all has been said. There are a lot of aspects discovered, properly reported and verified compared to what generally happened in the 00's

Sure there are more newbies now, but the newbies from now are the experts in 10 years.
I agree that most younger vinyl enthousiasts (say under 30) are less focussed on hardware and the technical side of things and are more focussed on the music/records themselves but I think that is something you see across all of audio. (compared to the boomers, genXers and early millenials)
Gearheads are a bit of a dying race maybe? Or it's a financial thing and 30 year olds just don't have the money to spend (new house, young kids etc) to be a gearhead but will be when they'll approach 50? Basic cost of living is way more expensive than it used to be.

The resurgeance of vinyl records that started around 2010 had a lot of negative and positive sides. On the negative side is that used records are very expensive now (in the early 00's you could get a DSOTM copy for 25ct in pretty much any thrift store, now theyre $15-25...), and very nice vintage decks right out of the attic/garage clearance could be had (often still in very good nick) for only a fraction of what is asked now. The diamonds in the rough (proverbial big ass micro seiko with dust from the attic for $150) doesn't exist anymore.
On the other hand: lots of new vinyl now, new turntable manufacturers start to appear (sometimes with very low quality, sometimes very high), new test records, new test equipment etc.
 
Last edited:
mr_petit said:
actually I don't agree with pretty much any of this.
I think the turntable forum is still mainly occupied by old timers, at least I think the average age is still well above 50.
Also I think the average knowledge about turntable playback has gone up significantly the last decade. Lots more measurements and ways to measure aspects of setups, more blind listening tests etc (more abstract knowledge focussed forums like ASR for sure contributed to that) etc. Certainly imho not a case that all has been said. There are a lot of aspects discovered, properly reported and verified compared to what generally happened in the 00's

Sure there are more newbies now, but the newbies from now are the experts in 10 years.
I agree that most younger vinyl enthousiasts (say under 30) are less focussed on hardware and the technical side of things and are more focussed on the music/records themselves but I think that is something you see across all of audio. (compared to the boomers, genXers and early millenials)
Gearheads are a bit of a dying race maybe? Or it's a financial thing and 30 year olds just don't have the money to spend (new house, young kids etc) to be a gearhead but will be when they'll approach 50? Basic cost of living is way more expensive than it used to be.

The resurgeance of vinyl records that started around 2010 had a lot of negative and positive sides. On the negative side is that used records are very expensive now (in the early 00's you could get a DSOTM copy for 25ct in pretty much any thrift store, now theyre $15-25...), and very nice vintage decks right out of the attic/garage clearance could be had (often still in very good nick) for only a fraction of what is asked now. The diamonds in the rough (proverbial big ass micro seiko with dust from the attic for $150) doesn't exist anymore.
On the other hand: lots of new vinyl now, new turntable manufacturers start to appear (sometimes with very low quality, sometimes very high), new test records, new test equipment etc.
Click to expand...
On the issue of the age group here, there is no doubt that it is mostly on the older side. That’s expected. I was about 50 when I first joined and that is over 25 years ago-and I’m still here. I grew up with vinyl, but still had a lot to learn and I was grateful for the knowledge and experience of those who were then older and wiser than I was. The thing about the passing of time and aging is that you become the older generation. What I miss about the older people of 25 years ago is that they had been able to afford and live with classic vintage equipment when it was brand new at a time when I was too young and poor to experience it.
 
Last edited:
When the good vintage stuff was new, I certainly couldn't have afforded it! I find the topic of mechanical understanding interesting. Back in the day, car ads would talk about horsepower and displacement and 0-60 times. Today you might have to work just to find out what engine something has. Owner's manuals told you how to change the oil. Today the owner's manual tells you not to drink it!

As for gmail, it may work for hifiengine but I find it nothing but trouble for communicating with people. My email is a dot com and gmail tends to ditch my emails entirely or strip out my attachments. I've had to tell some people I just couldn't help them if they continued to use gmail.
 
Azimuth said:
What I miss about the older people of 25 years ago is that they had been able to afford and live with classic vintage equipment when it was brand new at a time when I was too young and poor to experience it.
Click to expand...
Amen, amigo....."we all become forefathers by and by......" (Dan Fogelberg) and now it's our turn to "become older and wiser" and share what we know with others. That's kinda the way it works......can't remember how many times I've really, really wanted to ask my Dad about things but can't since he's passed. He was always good for an answer, but the good news is we all have each other here and I feel blessed and am thankful......amen, amigos......carry on
 
Back in those slower days on AK, I remember less than 20,000 members.
The membership is now 389,353. Sometimes 2,500+ online at any time.

Times have drastically changed, especially how we access and share information.
AK's database is now full of info, communications and distractions.
Plus know you can find almost everything on Youtube or online.

You have to be engaging to keep conversation going,
especially with the newer generation with short attention span.
 
onepixel said:
Plus know you can find almost everything on Youtube or online.
Click to expand...
Actually a lot also gets lost online.
Typical sites with unique information put there by people who gathered that back in the day often just disappear.
Because someone dies, or just stops with the site.
I often use waybackmachine to try and gather the information that is left, but of course a lot is missing.
Obviously a massive amount of new information gets online but seldom the information that was lost.
 
mr_petit said:
Actually a lot also gets lost online.
Typical sites with unique information put there by people who gathered that back in the day often just disappear.
Because someone dies, or just stops with the site.
I often use waybackmachine to try and gather the information that is left, but of course a lot is missing.
Obviously a massive amount of new information gets online but seldom the information that was lost.
Click to expand...

That's true, but most of it gets recycled and shows up somewhere else.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom