Old instrument amp help

[starrcrow13]

I have two old tube amps that need repair. One is an Ampeg Gemini I, the other is a Sano 300R-12. I'm trying to figure out if I should get them refurbished and then try to sell them, or look for a buyer who would take them as is. Both turn on, but neither currently passes audio. Both are physically in very good shape and both have their covers. I've been given an estimate of $300-$400 per amp to replace all the bad components and bring them back to life. Does anyone have an idea what these are worth the way they are compared to after being fixed?

 

[gadget73]

Can't really answer the value question, but generally you don't get back the money it costs to refurb things. Your $400 turns into a faster sale but you're probably not getting all of that cash value back. Personally I'd probably clean them up and try to sell as-is.

Guitar amps are also somewhat odd in that the unrestored ones can be worth more. People want all those vintage bad parts for "the tone".

 

[Joe Roberts]

Sell them as-is. Professional refurb cost would approach the total value of the amps. Let somebody else take care of that if your intention is to flip.

i rebuilt a couple Ampegs of that era. Not fun and quite time consuming... BUT the Gemini I especially is a superb amp if you play and worth getting fixed for yourself..

 

[starrcrow13]

Can't really answer the value question, but generally you don't get back the money it costs to refurb things. Your $400 turns into a faster sale but you're probably not getting all of that cash value back. Personally I'd probably clean them up and try to sell as-is.

Guitar amps are also somewhat odd in that the unrestored ones can be worth more. People want all those vintage bad parts for "the tone".

I agree that the vintage parts are what creates the value, but if those parts are dead and there is no "tone" don't they need to be replaced?

 

[starrcrow13]

Sell them as-is. Professional refurb cost would approach the total value of the amps. Let somebody else take care of that if your intention is to flip.

i rebuilt a couple Ampegs of that era. Not fun and quite time consuming... BUT the Gemini I especially is a superb amp if you play and worth getting fixed for yourself..

Actually, the Ampeg is mine and I would most likely keep it after getting it running. So are there folks out there who are looking for things like a Sano to rebuild?

 

[tubeampking]

Actually, the Ampeg is mine and I would most likely keep it after getting it running. So are there folks out there who are looking for things like a Sano to rebuild?

Sano amps are close relatives of the Ampeg. You could definitely find a buyer on an auction site.

 

[jmela]

I agree that the vintage parts are what creates the value, but if those parts are dead and there is no "tone" don't they need to be replaced?

The line of thinking is replace only misbehaving parts and not everything under the hood because it's old.

 

[valvenator]

I don't know if Sano was one of them but Ampeg did build amps for other brands.
If you got the amp refurbed I don't think you'd make the difference in cost back. MY 2cents: Fix the one you're going to keep but leave the other as is, unless it's a relatively cheap fix.
If the shop does free estimates maybe they could tell you what's wrong with the amp you want to sell and include that in your description.
That would at least give the buyer some confidence in what they're getting. A lot of DIY types would jump at the chance to save a few bucks over a working one.

 

[Joe Roberts]

The problem with keeping all the functional old parts in Ampegs is that the caps they used are mostly dubious at best. Depending on the luck of the draw, you can get a mix of molded caps ALL of which are prone to leakage (CD "greenies" least problematic of the possible cap selections.). I think they were using random surplus parts picked up cheap. My experience with five or six Ampegs of the mid 60s era suggests going with a full recap, because when I skimped some other caps eventually went leaky.

Did you check the speakers? The stock speakers (Jensen P12Rs?) were somewhat underrated for these amps and could very well be blown. That could be your main problem right there.

After that check the tubes. Then make sure you have a B+ voltage. Seen a few blown diodes in Geminis.

Worst case scenario is a blown transformer, unfortunately nor unknown in Ampegs of this era.

But when you get them working properly, they are super amps for sure. Worth the trouble and/or expense.

 

[byoungman1]

I have a mid-60s Sano with (1) 15" speaker and (2) 8". It runs a pair of 8417 power tubes for ~ 50 watts. One of my favorite guitar amps, and I have a lot of them.
Better reverb & tremolo than any Fender amp. That one would definitely be the one I'd keep.

 

[Joe Roberts]

Some Sanos are totally clean to the top of the volume control, which may or may not appeal depending on style.
Good reverb and tremolo are par for the course for accordion amps. My kid stole my dang early Ampeg Reverberocket cause he loves that reverb.

 

[starrcrow13]

Thank you all for your input!

 

[valvenator]

Some Sanos are totally clean to the top of the volume control, which may or may not appeal depending on style..

Funny, I think it was Everett Hull of Ampeg that hated Rock-n-Roll and wanted his amps as distortion free as possible.
That's why their older amps are easier to overdrive. The Jets started out with 12AX7's and 6V6's, both great R&R tubes and quickly moved to more Hi-Fi tubes later in production.

 

[arts]

You are absolutely right Valvenator,and his refusal to ''get with the times'' almost destroyed the company. As a product of the big-band and jazz era,he hated loud,and he hated distortion. But,as a musician himself (upright bass,and a damned good player too!) he understood that above all else,what musicians require from their equipment is absolute consistency and reliability,and that is what Ampeg delivered.Through the 50's,60's and 1970's,Ampeg employed some of the most gifted engineers/designers/techs
the music industry has ever seen. And while their manufacturing levels never even came close to those of Fender or Marshall,the quantity of old Ampegs still in service today is truly astounding. And there would be a lot more if I stopped hoarding them