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phono preamp vs vintage receiver

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petrol100

New Member
Ok, so this is a general question. Should I buy a phono preamp or consider purchase of a vintage receiver with built in phono input?

I currently have a modern Onkyo 5.1 receiver, it sounds nice but doesn't have phono input. Assuming my budget for this is $100, should I purchase a phono preamp or find a vintage receiver? In general, which will provide better sound?

If you suggest phono preamp, recommend one within my budget. Otherwise, I have a lead on a couple of nice looking vintage Nikko receivers that falls within my budget. Example: Nikko STA-8080

Thanks guys!
 
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I have an Advent 300 and I think it had an awesome phono pre. The Amp, however, leaves a lot to be desired. Might be a round about way to do things, but you could get a 300 and use it to drive your Onkyo for phono duty.
 
petrol100 said:
I currently have a modern Onkyo 5.1 receiver, it sounds nice but doesn't have phono input.
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Are you satisfied by the sound of the Onkyo regarding the other inputs? If so, it would be more reasonable for you to look for a phono preamp. If you buy a vintage receiver you will change the sound of the entire system, and there is chance that it would sound worst for the other sources. The ideal situation would be to buy a vintage receiver with the possibility of returning it back in case you find its sound less satisfactory than the one provided by the Onkyo.
 
I'd take the phomo preamp path.
I was in a similar position using a Yamaha preamp that is without a phono preamp.
Since I am already happy with the setup rather than risking the change to the system sound, I DIYed a phono preamp (VSPS) and there were no regrets.
 
I would opt for vintage 2 ch receiver only IF you are intending to go with dedicated speakers. If you want to use the speakers you have in your 5.1 setup (the mains or all of them) then you are better off with a phono-pre I think.

If you can solder are up for a little DYI this little project http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=334875 which is available from Boozhoundlabs sounds VERY nice. (ps. noticed the BHL site has lost some content but the kits are still available.)

Edit: p.s again. Just reread the original post. If in good shape that Nikko is no slouch. If you are wanting to add another system or listening option you could do far worse with vintage receivers. I seem to recall the phono section in it is pretty decent. There were two phono outs but I don't recall if both were MM.
 
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Also, my onkyo receiver would remain where it is for my home theater use. I am not suggesting replacing my Onkyo.

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I do not have a huge amount of experience comparing phono preamps in vintage receivers to stand alone units, but my latest project, a Pioneer SX-980 has failed to impress me with its phono preamp when compared to any of my MM external preamps (Modified Cambridge 640p, ESP P06 and VSPS). I have also used a few mid grade Sansui's and a vintage Kenwood 8100 that I found to sound pretty awesome...

If you can, use your ears to make you decision!

KC
 
FWIW, my Bugle Pro stand-alone phono preamp outperforms any phono section in the various vintage receivers/amps I own.
 
petrol100 said:
Also, my onkyo receiver would remain where it is for my home theater use. I am not suggesting replacing my Onkyo.

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Click to expand...

In that case I definitely vote vintage receiver. I have a 5.1 system and a stereo system and am very glad to have both.
 
Pardon my ignorance: I assume MM stands for Moving Magnet. Yes? Do you mean not all phono preamps will work with MM, weather standalone or built into a vintage receiver?

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petrol100 said:
Pardon my ignorance: I assume MM stands for Moving Magnet. Yes? Do you mean not all phono preamps will work with MM, weather standalone or built into a vintage receiver?

Sent from my SCH-I510 using Tapatalk
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There are MM and MC (moving coil) carts. Pre-amps don't necessarily support both types.
 
MM is indeed moving magnet. Most phono stages in vintage receivers are designed for MM. Many moving coil (MC) cartridges are designed for these same phono stages. External phono preamps are sometimes designed for only MM, occasionally for only MC, fairly often both.
 
cactuscowboy said:
FWIW, my Bugle Pro stand-alone phono preamp outperforms any phono section in the various vintage receivers/amps I own.
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+1, and then some.

A modern, stand alone pre-amp will outperform just about any internal pre-amp in a vintage receiver/integrated amp. Why? The technology in the op-amps has come so far they just outstrip vintage circuits. I love my Bugle and other DIY pre-amps. :thmbsp:
 
I would find it very hard to believe that a $100 vintage receiver's phono section could keep up with the Cambridge 640/540p. I had one of the adcom pre's with the desired phono stage and the CA slaughtered it IMHO.
 
If you go with the Nikko then you'll have to spring for another set of speakers . Unless you were thinking of using the PHONO pre of the Nikko and running the out into the Onkyo and playing it through the H/T speakers . I would go for the preamp if my H/T speakers were'nt those small bricks without a sub . LP's dont sound too good threw those things . But then more speakers puts you over that hundred dollar budget .
 
cubby01 said:
I would opt for vintage 2 ch receiver only IF you are intending to go with dedicated speakers. If you want to use the speakers you have in your 5.1 setup (the mains or all of them) then you are better off with a phono-pre I think.

If you can solder are up for a little DYI this little project http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=334875 which is available from Boozhoundlabs sounds VERY nice. (ps. noticed the BHL site has lost some content but the kits are still available.)

Edit: p.s again. Just reread the original post. If in good shape that Nikko is no slouch. If you are wanting to add another system or listening option you could do far worse with vintage receivers. I seem to recall the phono section in it is pretty decent. There were two phono outs but I don't recall if both were MM.
Click to expand...
I have the Boozhound Labs jfet pre, It's better than the Cambridge 640P to my ears, and was on a totally different level to the phono stage in my friends Sansui AU-777 when we tried it in his system.

Great bang for buck!

Although you will need connectors and a power supply, I run mine off two 12v SLA batteries connected in series for 24v, been using it for a month and still haven't needed to charge them.

Edit: I forgot to mention that I used Russian Teflon in the C4 position and another Teflon by-pass over C5.
 
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The Bugle, and even the dirt-cheap Art II DJ pre were noticably better than the Sansui's phono section, although, to be fair, it is old, and might not have been touched when I had the amp section re-capped. The Phonomena is in another class altogether above the Bugle, so I'd be a strong supporter of a standalone pre going into a line level input on your receiver.......
 
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