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Pickering XV-15 cartridge fans and users, spout for a while!

I only know of the brushes included on generics, which I realize might vary considerably from the original Pickerings or Stantons. The generic brushes of each style that I have seen all seem stiffer than they need be. I would be happier trying to use the Pickering type if it was possible to adjust it so that lightly skimmed rather than deeply plowed. On the Stanton-type generic I used, the brush actually generated noise. That one had to be removed.
 
Pickering vs Stanton styli

Hi. I'm new here and sorry for my English. Some appreciations from South America.
For 3 years I've been collecting some Pickering and Stanton styli. First some aftermarket, and now some NOS.
After listening both Pickering XV-15 and Stanton 680-681 cartridges, i have seen they sound the same. But the stylus don't. Pickering styli sounds a little brighter.
For example NOS Stanton D680 sounds equal on both cartridges. The same with Pickering D625. But the sound of the stylus is different. Pickering stylus is a bit brighter, or Stanton a bit warmer. Even though they are both ellipticals 0,3 x 0,7.
The same can be said to Pickering D1800 and Stanton D6800 II-S and even with another cartridges: Pickering XSV and Stanton 881s with NOS.
Aftermarket Stantons also sounds brighter, more like NOS Pickerings than NOS Stantons (at least D6800 Jico Shibata, D6800 Jico EVG from KAB and LP Gear D6800 MKIII)
 
vinilossolo,

That is fascinating information. I was going to point out the the online vendor linked in earlier posts also has generic replacements for the Stanton 680 series and Stanton 681 series, both of which would also fit and work with the Pickering XV-15 cartridge, but looking at those links one finds that the Stanton generics are priced differently from the Pickering generics that look comparable in elliptical specifications and VTF. If they are priced differently, I wondered what one is paying for if the Stanton generic is more expensive? At least on this scale of Bright-to-Warm sound, the Stanton generics may be more similar to the Pickerings, than would be NOS Stantons. Have others observed this or have differing views?
 
vinilossolo said:
Hi. I'm new here and sorry for my English. Some appreciations from South America.
For 3 years I've been collecting some Pickering and Stanton styli. First some aftermarket, and now some NOS.
After listening both Pickering XV-15 and Stanton 680-681 cartridges, i have seen they sound the same. But the stylus don't. Pickering styli sounds a little brighter.
For example NOS Stanton D680 sounds equal on both cartridges. The same with Pickering D625. But the sound of the stylus is different. Pickering stylus is a bit brighter, or Stanton a bit warmer. Even though they are both ellipticals 0,3 x 0,7.
The same can be said to Pickering D1800 and Stanton D6800 II-S and even with another cartridges: Pickering XSV and Stanton 881s with NOS.
Aftermarket Stantons also sounds brighter, more like NOS Pickerings than NOS Stantons (at least D6800 Jico Shibata, D6800 Jico EVG from KAB and LP Gear D6800 MKIII)
Click to expand...

Welcome to AK!

What you say is interesting and, I confess, something that I hadn't noted before. It does make a certain amount of sense though.

Have you notices this difference when comparing more than one example of each stylus? That would be the test. It's possible that what you're hearing is differences in individual styli rather than differences in type. In other words, might you hear similar differences between two D680s or two D1200Es? This is certainly possible, especially with styli that have been kicking around for 30 or 40 years.

John
 
Glad you started this thread, it got my to put my XV-15/KAB EVG D68eee stylus on for a while. VTF sounds best at 1.3gr. This stylus only has about less than 5hrs. on it. After playing several hour today, I'm beginning to like the tones. Maybe a tad brighter than my M97xE, but still a warm sound. Think I'll continue to listen to my XV-15 the rest of the weekend.
 
illinoisteve said:
Have heard Phanstiehls are hit or miss quality.
Click to expand...
Gary at V of M seems to think (and I'm inclined to agree) that the Pfanstiehl elliptical Pickering/Stanton styli are the most troublesome ones. The conicals have been a much safer bet.

The 606-DEX that Gary sells is an EVG, much more consistent quality-wise. They are quite a bit louder than the original 1200E. The OEM and the EVG are really two different animals, but given the price of a NOS OEM and the relative quality of the EVG, it's hard to go wrong with the generic.

Also Gary is and always has been very clear that if you feel there's something wrong with the stylus, a) he wants to know about it and b) he accepts returns.
 
bangsezmax,

It is very fortunate to learn of this online vendor. I noticed that, in the Stanton 680 & 681 replacements, Gary has 78 styli at a reasonable price, too. One of the reasons I was using the Shure M97 cart was I could get a 78 stylus that would fit it more easily.

I was thinking of swapping my Dual 1229 with the Miracord 50H to listen more to my XV-15, but the Dual started having an issue with skipping in lead-in grooves and needs more time than I can give it right now, so I just put the XV-15 on the Miracord. Funny, it sounds a little different on the other machine, but nonetheless better than the M97.

As for Pfanstiehls, if I found the right original box for it, the needle I'm using on the XV-15 is one, and not Japanese--a 4606-DEG (D750 replacement) .3x.7 mil, 0.5-1.5gr.
The Pfanstiehl I had so much trouble with was a 4822-DEE .2-.7mil, 0.75-1.5gr.--had the noisey brush and seemed impossible to align to avoid sibilance (with or without the brush). So right there is a hit and a miss. I may try the second one again on the Miracord, but not with high expectations. That EVG 606-DEX definitely sounds like the next one to try.
 
bangsezmax said:
Gary at V of M seems to think (and I'm inclined to agree) that the Pfanstiehl elliptical Pickering/Stanton styli are the most troublesome ones. The conicals have been a much safer bet.

The 606-DEX that Gary sells is an EVG, much more consistent quality-wise. They are quite a bit louder than the original 1200E. The OEM and the EVG are really two different animals, but given the price of a NOS OEM and the relative quality of the EVG, it's hard to go wrong with the generic.

Also Gary is and always has been very clear that if you feel there's something wrong with the stylus, a) he wants to know about it and b) he accepts returns.
Click to expand...

EVG doesn't produce styli, theirs are sourced from other producers. Some are Pfanstiehl, some are JICO, some may be from other Japanese manufacturers.
 
The Stanton D68EEE, EVG I'm using is a PM4216DE from KABUSA. I'm going to order one of the Pickering EVG from VOM to try, can't beat the price.
 
Sam Cogley said:
EVG doesn't produce styli, theirs are sourced from other producers. Some are Pfanstiehl, some are JICO, some may be from other Japanese manufacturers.
Click to expand...
Not that I'm doubting you, but what's your source for this info? FWIW, I always thought Pfanstiehl was just a reseller as well, especially as they sell/sold OEM styli in Pfanstiehl packaging.

All of the EVGs I've seen appear to be from Japan and most Pfastiehls are Swiss.
 
Figured out most of the difference in sound after moving the xv-15 to the Miracord. After finding the specs on the stylus, I set the vtf at 1.25g (guesstimate of optimum in the 0.5-1.5g suggested range. At that vtf, the highest highs weren't sparkling/sizzling. Bumped it up to the 1.5g max, and they're back. I may have been tracking at closer to 1.75-2g on the Dual (having forgotten the specs), but that makes the record noise sizzle a bit more than necessary, too! Could be other issues, though, the Miracord's interconnect cables look a bit dodgey. I haven't done a thing to it but remove the thick protective layer of dust left by the previous owner and then use it...well, other than install and switch cartridges.

Has anybody remarked about music that sounds especially good via their Pickering XV-15, with a particular stylus? If so, I may have missed that.
 
illinoisteve said:
Figured out most of the difference in sound after moving the xv-15 to the Miracord. After finding the specs on the stylus, I set the vtf at 1.25g (guesstimate of optimum in the 0.5-1.5g suggested range. At that vtf, the highest highs weren't sparkling/sizzling. Bumped it up to the 1.5g max, and they're back. I may have been tracking at closer to 1.75-2g on the Dual (having forgotten the specs), but that makes the record noise sizzle a bit more than necessary, too! Could be other issues, though, the Miracord's interconnect cables look a bit dodgey. I haven't done a thing to it but remove the thick protective layer of dust left by the previous owner and then use it...well, other than install and switch cartridges.

Has anybody remarked about music that sounds especially good via their Pickering XV-15, with a particular stylus? If so, I may have missed that.
Click to expand...

Where you using the Pfanstiehl stylus ? Right now, I'm listening to my XV-15 with the KAB EVG D6800EEE .3x.7 stylus at 1.3gr. The cymbals have a nice sizzle to them. I'm finally putting some time on this combo. Tonight I ordered a EVG 4606 DEX. Can't wait to try it. I don't use the brush.
 
Yep, the Pfanstiehl imitation D750. Also not using the brush.

kcblair--when you get the new stylus, bump this thread back up (if it's died) and report about what you hear and how you compare it to the KAB stylus or others, okay?

On music, some of the things I've been listening to the last two days with the XV-15: Joe Venuti, Tijuana Brass, Holst's "Planets," The Hi-Los, Nancy Wilson, and right now--"Dixieland", Matty Matlock and His Dixiemen, Tops L1569, monaural. Lined up for later Korngold's classic movie scores including "The Seahawk," and E.Power Biggs plays Scott Joplin on the pedal harpsichord. I forgot how good this Matlock LP is--they're really cookin' on "Shimmy Sha Wabble"!!!!
 
Speaking of KAB, here is a link to their Stanton-Pickering Cartridge and Stylus Compatibility chart. Note it doesn't include generic stylus numbers, only the original mfr numbers. http://www.kabusa.com/STANTONX.HTM

Once you find the block of cartridge numbers in the left column that includes the Stanton 680 & 681 series and the XV-15 and some other Pickerings, ALL the styli named in the corresponding block immediately to the right will fit on and work properly on all those cartridges.
 
bangsezmax said:
Not that I'm doubting you, but what's your source for this info? FWIW, I always thought Pfanstiehl was just a reseller as well, especially as they sell/sold OEM styli in Pfanstiehl packaging.

All of the EVGs I've seen appear to be from Japan and most Pfastiehls are Swiss.
Click to expand...

Based on an email exchange I had with the sales manager at Russell Industries (EVG, PRB, Empire, etc.)I can confirm part of what Sam said. They don't make anything. As for who does, I was told that JICO "is one of our suppliers", leaving implicit that there are others besides JICO. Pfanstiehl (or the Swiss factory that makes Pfanstiehl generics) is one obvious possibility.

John
 
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kcblair said:
The Stanton D68EEE, EVG I'm using is a PM4216DE from KABUSA. I'm going to order one of the Pickering EVG from VOM to try, can't beat the price.
Click to expand...

It should be noted that any JICO made EVG elliptical will be a 0.3 x 0.7 mil since that's the only elliptical profile they make. So, if you're ordering a replacement for, say, a D1200E or a D6800EEE, it will not be a 0.2 x 0.7 mil elliptical like the original.

John
 
boreas said:
Based on an email exchange I had with the sales manager at Russell Industries (EVG, PRB, Empire, etc.)I can confirm what Sam said. They don't make anything.

John
Click to expand...

On the other hand the first page linked on Gary's online site indicated an origin of Japan for every stylus on that page with the EVG label. So does that mean he doesn't know some EVG styli actually come from Switzerland? Or could it mean that he only stocks EVG styli labeled as coming from Japan?
 
illinoisteve said:
On the other hand the first page linked on Gary's online site indicated an origin of Japan for every stylus on that page with the EVG label. So does that mean he doesn't know some EVG styli actually come from Switzerland? Or could it mean that he only stocks EVG styli labeled as coming from Japan?
Click to expand...

I don't know which specific styli you're referring to above but, if you're speaking specifically about Stantons and/or Pickerings, it's likely that all those are indeed made in Japan (and by JICO). It's probable, almost certain, that EVG gets all their Stanterings and all their Shures from JICO. Perhaps all their Audio-Technicas are Pfanstiehl. I don't actually know. It's also possible that, though JICO is "one of" Russell Industries' suppliers, they may be their only stylus supplier but, again, I don't know.

Like Kevin Barrett at KAB, Gary (Stork) at V-M is a really great guy and very approachable. If you have questions like the above that you're not getting definitive answers to here, I'm sure Gary would be glad to answer them.

John
 
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