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pioneer pl 41 vs technics 1200

I have pretty much decided to stay with the arm on there.

It sounds so nice allready. I took some advice to stick with it stock and milk it for all its worth, and have decided thats a good idea.

I will roll carts for awhile.
 
Hello
PL-41's I have a story there...
Bought #1 at the thrift for $10 a friend saw it, gave me a second for free.
I had a bid on E*** and won number 3. I didnt need it but it was too late.

Out of all 3 I have 2 decent tables and one that is about as clean as can be.
I noticed the same, a Rega arm is just about a perfect fit, just enlarge the mounting hole a couple mm, the arm to spindle measurement was 221-222 mm if I remember.
I didnt change arms but thought the same thing, the Rega would fit.

I did take the stock Pioneer arm off to clean and reset the vert and horiz bearings, because there was noticable slop.
I hated the original headshell and the PL-41 uses the SME headshell mount so finding a decent headshell shouldnt be a problem.
So I replaced it with a Sumiko headshell from Needle Dr.
The arm balances just fine with the Sumiko headshell and either Grado or Shure cart.
Oh I also took apart the counter weight cleaned and lubed the tracking weight adjustment mechanism.
Cleaned the arm lift and refilled with fresh silicone fluid, now she q's fine and drops very slowly.
One thing to look out for is the thrust pad for the platter bearing is most likely trash, all 3 of mine the pad was breaking up, I just replaced it with the same thickness delrin disk and relubed the bearing.
Also went a little nuts and polished the main bearing shaft and bearing tip.
The bearing tip, I polished this to a mirror finish.
I have found that this is a really nice table very smooth and quiet, nice sound.
Also Id like to have the raised edge on platter machined off so I could use a different platter mat.
But for now I'm stuck with the original mat.
I noticed on E*** a guy had a PL-41 with a SME 3009 mounted, he removed the SME arm lift and was using the liff built into the PL41.

bob
 
--@H@B--> said:
not sure if that is the exact auction (didnt check) but pl 41 are nice looking tables. Had alot to do with my purchase.

There are a few people on here with 41's though and they really like em.

I'm gonna tweak the bejesus outta it.

I'll keep eveyone posted on my upcoming tweaks.
Click to expand...

please do. I pretty much run mine stock(had none of the annoyances when
I got it, and bought locally, so I handled transport). The balance issue is the headshell. Not enough weight, compared to stock Pioneer shell. You can get a modern Tonar shell, with 2 and 4 gram weights that will work well, sans currency taped on. I have always felt the same about the tonearm, but then, I get to thinking that maybe that old curved arm is PART of the synergy. Thus, I'll gladly let you lead the way and see how it works out.:thmbsp:

Enjoy your PL-41. They really aren't bad tables at all......
 
MrIgotNomoney said:
Hello
PL-41's I have a story there...
Bought #1 at the thrift for $10 a friend saw it, gave me a second for free.
I had a bid on E*** and won number 3. I didnt need it but it was too late.

Out of all 3 I have 2 decent tables and one that is about as clean as can be.
I noticed the same, a Rega arm is just about a perfect fit, just enlarge the mounting hole a couple mm, the arm to spindle measurement was 221-222 mm if I remember.
I didnt change arms but thought the same thing, the Rega would fit.

I did take the stock Pioneer arm off to clean and reset the vert and horiz bearings, because there was noticable slop.
I hated the original headshell and the PL-41 uses the SME headshell mount so finding a decent headshell shouldnt be a problem.
So I replaced it with a Sumiko headshell from Needle Dr.
The arm balances just fine with the Sumiko headshell and either Grado or Shure cart.
Oh I also took apart the counter weight cleaned and lubed the tracking weight adjustment mechanism.
Cleaned the arm lift and refilled with fresh silicone fluid, now she q's fine and drops very slowly.
One thing to look out for is the thrust pad for the platter bearing is most likely trash, all 3 of mine the pad was breaking up, I just replaced it with the same thickness delrin disk and relubed the bearing.
Also went a little nuts and polished the main bearing shaft and bearing tip.
The bearing tip, I polished this to a mirror finish.
I have found that this is a really nice table very smooth and quiet, nice sound.
Also Id like to have the raised edge on platter machined off so I could use a different platter mat.
But for now I'm stuck with the original mat.
I noticed on E*** a guy had a PL-41 with a SME 3009 mounted, he removed the SME arm lift and was using the liff built into the PL41.

bob
Click to expand...
Wow, man, you're virtually a tt tech! Sounds great. It is a nice table and the arm is decent. The Sumiko headshell works well because this arm needs a heavy headshell. Incidentally, you are allowed to write "ebay," and even mention a certain product or seller. We talk about stylus dealers Ed Saunders and William Thakker all the time. What you can't do is include a direct link to an auction.
 
Howard
Thanks, I was wondering about the posting rules.
William Thakker, I bought a Denon 103 from him, excellent service.
I agree with you and the guys, the 41 is a sleeper, a little work and she sings.

bob
 
Wow, I have a PL41 on the cue with broken tone arm wires. I had no idea the tone arm was so well regarded. I guess i will try to fix the wires.
 
Why the need for a heavy shell? If your TT has it, there is an additional counterbalance weight that can be removed that is in the end of the arm. Are you talking about the 41 or 41A? The arm on the 41A that I have is very different.

ETA: Appears from the manual the arm on the 41 does not have the aux counterweight. Somebody who has the skills needs to figure out if a Rega/Moth 300 arm can be mounted correctly on a PL41/A. It would probably require surgery, and I'm unwilling to hack mine.

ETA again: Standard DIN phono cables plug right in to the 41A arm base.

ETA: What are the dimensions of the delrin bearing insert?
 
Tromatic said:
Why the need for a heavy shell? If your TT has it, there is an additional counterbalance weight that can be removed that is in the end of the arm. Are you talking about the 41 or 41A? The arm on the 41A that I have is very different.

ETA: Appears the arm on the 41 does not have the aux counterweight.
Click to expand...
Right, no aux weight. This discussion has come up in the past and apparently the counterweight is so heavy on the PL-41 that it requires a heavier headshell.
 
I really want to go ahead with the arm mod. Probably require cutting, enlarging the arm mounting hole so you could use a floating arm-board. I be 41 would be a great TT with a nice arm on it.
 
I think I want a new arm on mine. I already have a VPI HW19 with a massive SAEC 407 tonearm. The range of appropriate cartriges is poor. I do have a Denon 103r on the SAEC and it sounds great. Holographic mids etc.

I think I want to get a Rega based on reputation, price and availability. Then I can cartridge roll to my delight. Better yet something with changable headshells. Any suggestons?
 
Hello
Id check the motor to make sure it is free.
The belt, make sure your getting good contact, id clean the belt, platter and motor pulley, alcohol works fine for cleaning.
Id also check the main bearing to make sure it is free, especially the bearing thrust pad.
bob
 
superdog said:
The speed on my 41 starts to slow at times then even REALLY slows down. Any thoughts?
Click to expand...

Seems to me that would concern the motor or motor electronics, or possibly the bearing shaft isn't turning as freely as it should. If you haven't cleaned and relubed the platter shaft and serviced (replaced?) the thrust bearing plate, that might be a place to start. When I opened mine up, the plastic thrust plate was nothing but tiny plastic chunks! It's not difficult using basic tools and is easily accessed from the bottom. The motor bearings also have an oil port accessible from the top. After all these years, these things need to be addressed.

From what I've read here at AK, however, this TT might be better known for running too FAST.

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=125106

Still looking for the best way to slow it down, wondering if there is an electronic change that would do it. Been thinking the "electrical tape round the platter" trick sounds good, but am concerned it would age quickly and poorly, leaving a sticky mess. I remained unconvinced that the belt is the problem, as it's brand new. As long as the power pulley remains in constant relation to the platter, it's GOT to be the motor is running fast.

As others have found also, I had to add a weight to the non-stock headshell so the Shure M97xe cart would balance.

Otherwise, a very handsome and quality-built classic TT.
 
Sorry, I just had to resurrect this old thread. The guy I bought my PL-41 from had replaced the stock headshell with an Ortofon and it balances up real nice with the Shure M97xE. I found that the
Shure M97xE is VERY sensitive to VTA, TF, and alignment/overhang. I also had read that when you use the brush in the down position, that you add .5 to the tracking force. I tried it and have mine set up at 1.50 and now the Shure M97xE sounds considerably better than before I fine tuned everything.
Now, I plan to totally disassemble and polish all the components and send the plinth in for a new veneer skin, possibly different than the walnut. I like custom!
Additionally, has anyone followed up on modding the PL-41 with a Rega 250 tonearm? Is that particular tonearm really all that much better than the stock Pioneer J-shaped arm?
 
You would have to fill in the top plate of the 41 and drill a new mounting hole for the Rega arm as the mounting centers are different...I don't remember if there are any reinforcing ribs underneath the top that would interfere with any machining operations or not....it's been too long since I had mine out...

A modded Rega arm, one with the Incognito rewire kit, a Michell counterweight and VTA adjuster, is a no sh*t good arm....the Michell counterweight makes it easier to adjust the tracking force on the 250 as their is an almost vernier knob that you turn to adjust TF...instead of incrementally sliding the counterweight...the rewire allows you to hear what the arm is capable of delivering...stock, it's an OK arm, but it's true potential becomes a realization with the mods...in other words, the stock wiring is crap.

Even Rega acknowledges that by using upgraded wiring on their upper tier arms now....do a little research and you'll find just that....
.
 
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