Pioneer PL-707... How good?

[Magfinity]

Old but relevant , I got 3 tables a pro-ject rpm1 carbon with sumiko cart (belt) . A marantz 6100 (also belt driven) with audio technica cart .

And a few years ago I bought the pioneer pl707. It's proven by far the best table I have. Even over the pro ject which cost a decent penny. It's quit and doesn't suffer from any outside resonances it's impervious to it. The pro ject you sneeze and it has issues with it. It's my worst table by far and it's a belt , separate motor driven table. That's well received by today's community.

It's a toy in comparison with my pioneer. The marantz is also surprisingly good after a recap and new belt.

So far the only downside of the pl707 is that is has no interchangeable headshells like my marantz has. But a small price to pay for its functionality and definitely audible excellent quality. Definitely one of pioneers better offers

 

[Thorsten R.]

How could the Marantz not be good? It´s a CEC.

 

[Magfinity]

How could the Marantz not be good? It´s a CEC.

Where did you read that the marantz isn't good?
. If anything it's an excellent table. It doesn't pretend to be something it's not.

Belt driven, auto return of the arm works even after 40 years flawless thanks to its mechanism. They do need a recap by now (ac suppressor cap wears out) . But again, super simple to do and cost virtually nothing.

Interchangeable headshells,and a spot for a back up headshell on the table itself. It does run a tad slow 2.3% in my case. And it's not adjustable as it's a 4 pole synchronous motor . So a variac is definitely a good upgrade to them, you can dial them in to way more accurate speeds.

Or as some do, use some nail polish on the belt drive poulie. I heard that supposed to help. I rather go the variac route . .

But put a pioneer pl707 next to it, you're talking about a quartz speed regulated table. Fully automatic, it's really a drop record play and forget table. I think for a beginner also important to note. Can't get any easier and if you find them? I found hen cheaper than the marantz 6100 these days. Pretty bizarre.

 

[Magfinity]

How could the Marantz not be good? It´s a CEC.

Where did you read that the marantz isn't good?
. If anything it's an excellent table. It doesn't pretend to be something it's not.

Belt driven, auto return of the arm works even after 40 years flawless thanks to its mechanism. They do need a recap by now (ac suppressor cap wears out) . But again, super simple to do and cost virtually nothing.

Interchangeable headshells,and a spot for a back up headshell on the table itself. It does run a tad slow 2.3% in my case. And it's not adjustable as it's a 4 pole synchronous motor . So a variac is definitely a good upgrade to them, you can dial them in to way more accurate speeds.

Or as some do, use some nail polish on the belt drive poulie. I heard that supposed to help. I rather go the variac route . .

But put a pioneer pl707 next to it, you're talking about a quartz speed regulated table. Fully automatic, it's really a drop record play and forget table. I think for a beginner also important to note. Can't get any easier and if you find them? I found hen cheaper than the marantz 6100 these days.

My modern pro-ject is in its original package what a disappointment. I can't even sell it as people that understand vinyl a little bit. Understand the new stuff out there is definitely not on par with the old gear of the formats golden era. Owell lesson learned

Pretty bizarre

 

[mcgjohn]

I already have the Pioneer PLC-590, which is quite nice. It replaced the PL-570.

I was wondering how the PL-707 would compare to any one of the above. The one I found has a damaged stylus, possibly the high-output PC-6MC MC. Not sure of the rest of the condition yet. How or what would I replace that cart with?

I don't need another TT but it looks pretty cool. I've already gone through all the AK links. I would like some real and practical information.

Here is a link to some info on that model.
http://www.thevintageknob.org/PIONEER/PL707/PL707.html

Thanks!
Carl

the 707 has a really nice arm. And you are right. The 707 is a cool looking table. The arm is from the era where Pioneer, Sony and others were using motors to damp arm movements instead of using silicon damping fluid. The 707 will give you better arm control than the 590 but like many tables of that era, the main thing on the 707 that can be improved upon is resonance control. Both from the platter and the plinth. The wood plinth rings like a wood box. Anything to damp it will be better. You can use brass plate stock to do this or a combination of brass and rubber damping material. You'll get much cleaner highs and midrange as well as better imaging when you do this. At some point you may want to consider stepping into a 1200GR2 or a 1200G with the KAB mods which will be a better quieter table. I have owned the 707, the 590 as well as the GR2 and the G. Its a step up in price but also a large step up in performance.

 

[Magfinity]

the 707 has a really nice arm. And you are right. The 707 is a cool looking table. The arm is from the era where Pioneer, Sony and others were using motors to damp arm movements instead of using silicon damping fluid. The 707 will give you better arm control than the 590 but like many tables of that era, the main thing on the 707 that can be improved upon is resonance control. Both from the platter and the plinth. The wood plinth rings like a wood box. Anything to damp it will be better. You can use brass plate stock to do this or a combination of brass and rubber damping material. You'll get much cleaner highs and midrange as well as better imaging when you do this. At some point you may want to consider stepping into a 1200GR2 or a 1200G with the KAB mods which will be a better quieter table. I have owned the 707, the 590 as well as the GR2 and the G. Its a step up in price but also a large step up in performance.

What's a step up , tbh that all relies on the cart /stylus arm combo. The rest does what any table does...

Spin .... It's the same I heard people say get a belt driven over direct drive. I yet have to hear a direct drive cause any issues.

Also you said something about the 707 resonance improvement. Not sure what you had that table sitting on. But I never , even on a small table ,on a wood subfloor with 4 big dogs passing by that table had as much as one skip from it. We tested that in the worst case scenario even

It's where all my other tables failed miserably. The belt driven marantz too actually.

Under normal conditions I use a granite cut slab to put under the table. I prevent pretty much any table we put on it. There is IMHO absolutely no need for a overdone plinth . There are way cheaper and easier solutions, even a thick concrete (cheap) tile will definitely aid in that. But I felt with the 707 that never was an issue (original dampers under the table)

I'd love to have a floating shelf , as my entire stereo rack is stud mounted and floating. But I don't have the space for it

And it's not practical..

 

[mcgjohn]

What's a step up , tbh that all relies on the cart /stylus arm combo. The rest does what any table does...

Spin .... It's the same I heard people say get a belt driven over direct drive. I yet have to hear a direct drive cause any issues.

Also you said something about the 707 resonance improvement. Not sure what you had that table sitting on. But I never , even on a small table ,on a wood subfloor with 4 big dogs passing by that table had as much as one skip from it. We tested that in the worst case scenario even

It's where all my other tables failed miserably. The belt driven marantz too actually.

Under normal conditions I use a granite cut slab to put under the table. I prevent pretty much any table we put on it. There is IMHO absolutely no need for a overdone plinth . There are way cheaper and easier solutions, even a thick concrete (cheap) tile will definitely aid in that. But I felt with the 707 that never was an issue (original dampers under the table)

I'd love to have a floating shelf , as my entire stereo rack is stud mounted and floating. But I don't have the space for it

And it's not practical..

A step up in price.....

you are right, a nice granite slab does help but does not address the vibrations from the cart to the record, to the platter and down through the main bearing. If you can reduce those reflections your midrange and treble will clear up. Many thing of vibrations originating from the room. But there are smaller high frequency vibrations coming from the stylus into the cart, then into the arm down the arm base and either being reflected from the arm base back towards the cart or grounded in the arm base. Same vibrations are traveling in the other way too. Off the stylus tip, through the record, through the platter, bearing and into the plinth where they are absorbed or reflected back to the source.

 

[Magfinity]

A step up in price.....

you are right, a nice granite slab does help but does not address the vibrations from the cart to the record, to the platter and down through the main bearing. If you can reduce those reflections your midrange and treble will clear up. Many thing of vibrations originating from the room. But there are smaller high frequency vibrations coming from the stylus into the cart, then into the arm down the arm base and either being reflected from the arm base back towards the cart or grounded in the arm base. Same vibrations are traveling in the other way too. Off the stylus tip, through the record, through the platter, bearing and into the plinth where they are absorbed or reflected back to the source.

What also helped and this might sound crazy ...

Remove the cover during playing, that seems to catch a lot of resonances

 

[mcgjohn]

What also helped and this might sound crazy ...

Remove the cover during playing, that seems to catch a lot of resonances

yes quite so. Agree completely. I used to think it was crazy, but playing a record with the dust cover in place acts as a huge reflection panel for any frequencies coming off the record.