• The move to the new server is done. There are some software and database maintenance updates in process. This has us passing the hat around to help out. We appreciate any donations. Seriously, even a dollar helps. The payment page may be found here - https://www.audiokarma.org/support.html

Please recommend non-McIntosh amp for C46

W

Will

New Member
Hi,

I cannot afford to buy both McIntosh C46 and MC252 or MC402 all at once. I've decided to get the C46 first... has anyone had experience with relatively inexpensive power amps that work well with the C46?

I'm thinking along the lines of Odyssey, used Bryston, or even the $350 Outlaw 2200 monoblocks... I would use it for about 3 or 4 years before getting a Mac amp.

Darn... why couldn't McIntosh put the digital volume control in the MA7000 integrated... that would have made it the perfect piece for me. Anyone know why they chose not to go that way? I'd consider the MA6600... but all those firmware issues I've been reading about is scaring me off.

Thanks,
Will
 
Register to hide this ad
Will said:
Hi,

I cannot afford to buy both McIntosh C46 and MC252 or MC402 all at once.

Thanks,
Will
Click to expand...


In your situation, McIntosh integrated amps make a lot of sense. Same quality and sound as separates but at a more affordable price. Good resale value. :music:
 
Hello....I currently have a Nakamichi PA-7 Solid State Amp connected to my C46 and it sounds fantastic! The reserve power of this amp really allows the C46 to shine. You can usually pick one up via Audiogon/E-bay for around 700-900 bucks.

Hope this helps,

Tom
 
Or how about a used MC2200 for similar $$ (or less)
Those blue meters cost a lot, but the plain jane amps sound the same...
:scratch2:

The integrated idea is a good one as well
 
LOts of options

I have an older Classe' amp, the Model 15. It is very musical and voiced similar to the McIntosh gear. The only fault is a slightly less transparent upper midrange.

If you get a Bryston, make sure it is an ST version at least.

The emotiva amps seem to be well regarded by the HT community and a great value, but I haven't heard one personally.

2 XPA-1's are now $1600. They are 1 kW into 4 ohms. They claim to be a fully differential balanced design.

The stereo XPA-2 is 500W into 4 ohms and is $700.
 
Thanks for the suggestions everyone.

If the MA6600 firmware issues get ironed out in the next month or 2, I might consider that. But I really like the multi-band EQ of the C46... The MA7000 is too expensive... and I can't understand why they took a step backwards by not using the digital volume as in the C46 and MA6600. Sigh.

In terms of matching power amps to the C46... how much do I need to worry about the input impedance?

For example, the MC252 and MC402 have an input impedance of 10K Ohms. If I were to match a C46 with a Bryston power amp with an input impedance of 50k Ohms, is the higher impedance negligeable? When people talk about impedance mismatch between components, what kind of ratios are they referring to?
 
The output impedance of the current line of Mac preamps are all so low they'll drive most anything. IIRC, the C2200 pre is something on the order of 200 ohms from the RCA jacks! I believe your owner's manual has the spec for the C46. It should be close.

Cheers,

David
 
Mine sounded flat plus I didnt like the fact that it utilizes a newly designed (and proprietary) hybrid Class A/B/G circuit. It will provide Class A/B power up to 80 watts (which covers about 98% of most listening situations). Above 80 watts the Model 2200 will instantly shift into Class G amplification.

I like the Rotel alot
 
Will said:
For example, the MC252 and MC402 have an input impedance of 10K Ohms. If I were to match a C46 with a Bryston power amp with an input impedance of 50k Ohms, is the higher impedance negligeable? When people talk about impedance mismatch between components, what kind of ratios are they referring to?
Click to expand...

The higher input impedance of the Bryston is actually beneficial to the cause, IMO.

Impedance "matching" in audio is sort of a funny thing. In many other types of electronics, such as radio transmitters, impedance matching means having the same value between the amp output, antenna cable, and antenna. However, in audio, the proper match is actually NOT having the same values.

Generally speaking, the lower the source output impedance and higher the amp or preamp input impedance, the better you are. A common rule of thumb is 1:10or higher output impedance to input impedance. The higher the ratio the more optimal is the voltage bridge between the components.
 
Bassmantweed said:
Mine sounded flat plus I didnt like the fact that it utilizes a newly designed (and proprietary) hybrid Class A/B/G circuit. It will provide Class A/B power up to 80 watts (which covers about 98% of most listening situations). Above 80 watts the Model 2200 will instantly shift into Class G amplification.
Click to expand...

Any idea what the proprietary bit of that is? Multi-tiered power supply rails aren't new and not particularly proprietary, afaik.

Something like Class G is still basically a Class AB amp but it switches to a higher rail voltage to cover the high power peaks rather than sitting at a constantly high rail voltage.
 
Last edited:
Will said:
Darn... why couldn't McIntosh put the digital volume control in the MA7000 integrated... that would have made it the perfect piece for me. Anyone know why they chose not to go that way? I'd consider the MA6600... but all those firmware issues I've been reading about is scaring me off.
Click to expand...
Hi Will! Take a look around this forum and somewhere there's a thread on the MA-7000 in which Ron-C explains why the volume control in the MA-7000 is a motarized unit instead of McIntosh's usual digital variety. I can't recall the explanation.

I will say that I used an MA-7000 to power the towers of a pair of Infinity Prelude MTAs at the 2008 AK Fest. Everyone who heard the setup had positive comments, including the rep from Wadia Digital, who used it to demo his $13K CD player. The motarized volume control works fine off of the front panel and off the remote, and if there are sonic differences between it and the McDigital control, they're certainly not apparent. There may be functional differences, but I'm not aware of those.
 
Will said:
In terms of matching power amps to the C46... how much do I need to worry about the input impedance?

For example, the MC252 and MC402 have an input impedance of 10K Ohms. If I were to match a C46 with a Bryston power amp with an input impedance of 50k Ohms, is the higher impedance negligeable? When people talk about impedance mismatch between components, what kind of ratios are they referring to?
Click to expand...
Thank you may be worrying about something that you won't be able to hear (sonic difference between 10K and 50K input on the amp). That said, the Bryston 2B-LP, a pair of that I ran as monoblocks for 10+ years, was my introduction to the high-end way back in '83. Still have fond memories of them Excellent gear, though from what I've read I think I would prefer the previous generation of amps to their latest SST(?) amps.
 
You can get a Rotel RB-1080 amp on Audiogon for $500-$600. Some of the very best bang for the buck you will ever find, extremely well-built with 200 watts of high quality sound. The silver model with black fins in front looks as great as it sounds. :thmbsp:
 
Will,

Have you already bought the C-46? I gave you info on the MA-7000, but it seems to me that there are other paths you could go with greater efficiency.
 
Negotiableterms said:
Will,

Have you already bought the C-46? I gave you info on the MA-7000, but it seems to me that there are other paths you could go with greater efficiency.
Click to expand...

No, not yet. Frozen by indecision. I'm considering taking some money out of the speaker budget and getting the C46+MC252 now. I live in Canada, and with the strong Cdn dollar, it makes sense to buy tha Macs now.

Or if they get the firmware issues with the MA6600 ironed out soon, I might go that way.
 
Got it. Can you explain why you settled on a C-46 and MC-252? What speakers are you using?

Here is an idea: the 252 is not a fully balanced amp (which Mc calls "quad-balanced"), while the 402 is. There's a big improvement stepping up to any of the quad-balanced units. The cheapest quad-balanced amp is the MC-352, which you can get used for less than a 252. This might allow you to buy the C-46, or one of the tube preamps. Depending on your system, you may find the tube units to be a huge benefit.

Give us a better idea of what you're after, and why, and others may weight in with alternatives.
 
Negotiableterms said:
Got it. Can you explain why you settled on a C-46 and MC-252? What speakers are you using?

Here is an idea: the 252 is not a fully balanced amp (which Mc calls "quad-balanced"), while the 402 is. There's a big improvement stepping up to any of the quad-balanced units. The cheapest quad-balanced amp is the MC-352, which you can get used for less than a 252. This might allow you to buy the C-46, or one of the tube preamps. Depending on your system, you may find the tube units to be a huge benefit.

Give us a better idea of what you're after, and why, and others may weight in with alternatives.
Click to expand...

I settled on the 252 because of price and also because of a post by Ron-C that I found while searching the archives where he spoke very highly of it. I believe he bought it for himself... which to me says a lot since he can probably have any Mac amp he wants. Also, he mentioned that the main benefit of the quad-balanced architecture is lower noise (something like 120dB down for the MC402 vs 112dB for the MC252)... but since the SNR of 112dB for the MC252 is already better than the C46 preamp... well... "weakest link in the chain" :)

I want the C46 because of the 8-band EQ.. I like the idea of being able to make some of my badly recorded music more listenable. Also, I want to buy the Harbeth M40.1 speaker... it's a big speaker with 12" woofers and I expect I will have to make use of the C46's EQ to really optimize the bass for my room.

The other option I am considering now is to go for the smaller Harbeth C7-ES3 and put more money into the electronics...

I actually have no real system now... before moving to a new house, I sold off most of my last system... wanted to start over fresh, invest most of the budget on my dream speakers (Harbeth M40.1)... but then I made the mistake of walking into the McIntosh dealer and was reminded of how much I always loved the look and sound of McIntosh....

I have owned tubes in the past (not McIntosh though) and find it is not for me.... don't like the added cost/worry of tube replacement, random noise (although I understand this is not an issue with Macs), heat.
 
Last edited:
How about a used MC752 (75 wpc) or MC754 (100 wpc)? They can be found for around $700 (when they can be found) and they are great-sounding, robust direct-coupled amps. You might even find that you don't need to upgrade later.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom