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Radford S90 vocals dead flat... is it me?

D-Owen

D-Owen

New Member
After hearing all the great things about the Radford S90's, I was pleased to find some at a local garage sale for a good price. Sadly - and maybe it's just me - but the bass is exceptional (I know that should be the case) and the treble and detail are great, but vocals..... I cannot find a setup/track where vocals have any clarity whatsoever - Very distant and undefined (sounds like vocals are playing in a tube). Have the x-overs just deteriorated with age and will need a rebuild or am I expecting something from these speakers that I shouldn't? Drivers are in excellent cosmetic condition and are all working without issue - running off a Technics SU-8600 recever/amp that makes my other speakers sing. If these are just not for my ears, I can easily recoup my $ but the thought of offloading these beauties just makes me sad!

ps. Sorry, I am new to AK (and really any forum) so I hope this is in the right place...

Thanks!
 
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If the drivers are perfectly sorted, then it certainly could be the crossover. Speakers of this age need the capacitors replaced, so I would do that. It will probably clear up the issue.
 
Hello D-Owen. Welcome to AK. Found this on the S90 crossover network. https://images.search.yahoo.com/search/images?p=radford+s90+speakers+crossover+diagram&fr=yfp-t-s&imgurl=http://p10hifi.net/TLS/classics/images/RadfordXO.gif#id=0&iurl=http://p10hifi.net/TLS/classics/images/RadfordXO.gif&action=click hope it helps. Old Electrolytics tend to dry out changing the sound. The cap develops higher ESR (Equivalent Series Resistance). The E caps would need replaced. Depending on the types of the other caps in the crossover they might need changed. Posting a picture of the crossover would help. I recapped my Mission 737R. Sounds like new. Did some additional checking found this also. http://www.t-linespeakers.org/classics/radford.html. For caps check Parts Express.com
 
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Thanks for the replies. I am thinking it could be a resistor(s) issue as for any given volume level, the mids seem to be almost non-existant and the tweeters are definitely over-powering the woofers (slight, but noticable). I have dug further into things and have de-soldered the input/speaker wires from the xover so I could pull it out of the cabinet. I can troubleshout & I can solder but I am lost when it comes to whats-what in a crossover!! I have a couple pics of the xover here so hopefully someone can point me in the right direction!

Thanks!
 

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Looking at the picture of the crossover I would replace both C3 and C6. The black and red NP (non polarized caps) look like those everybody has problems. Check out Parts Express for NP caps. The cost is low compared to the film caps of the same value. C3 could have high ESR thus lowering the output of the midrange speaker. In my Missions the bad cap reduced the output of the tweeter a lot.
 
I have to better explain the pictures... My bad.

c6 is two 30 mfd, 50v caps in parallel (stacked on top of one-another).

c3 is a 12 mfd, 50v. does it matter if 100v is used here? as thats what seems to be available.

r1 is labelled w22, 3r3, 75ohm 06. Not gonna lie, that's the one throwing me off the most. Picture shows details.

C1,2, & 5 - the only film caps I see are 3mfd and the ones in my xover are 3.3... issue or no?

sorry I'm asking a lot of questions... but I think thats all of em!

again, I appreciate the help.
 

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C6 being 2 parallel 30Mfd is a way to get the 60Mfd total capacitance value. Sometimes it's the only way to get the total value. The original value itself may not be around anymore And it could be a lot cheaper than the bigger cap value. A lot of people do this to get what they need. C3 just replace with a single cap then. The 100 Vdc rating means the caps are simply rated higher, a bonus in this case. The film caps are ok for now given those don't really fail compared to E caps. The resistor might be a 7.5 ohm. Have you a meter to measure it?. I will have to look up your FN8C crossover later today. Time to go to work. I'll check back after 5:00.
 
Roger that.... Good call on the 7.5ohm r1 (currently only a measured reasistance of 3.2ohms). Dont know why I didn't just grab my tools. Long day I guess!

I haven't been able to find anything on the FN8C so thats why I have just pulled things out to get my eyes on it.
 
Hi D-Owen . Checked Parts Express they have 7.5 ohm 10 Watt audio grade resistor. Was wondering about how that resistor would measure. It didn't look all that good in the picture. Did you measure with a DMM (Digital MultiMeter)? So replace both caps and the resistor in each and you should be good to go then. I can understand about long days. Only found information on FN10C,FN11,FN12 crossovers.Radford-FN10-XO.gif ra13.jpg. The picture of the crossover shows how bad the caps can look. I think they are the type that can fail by spectacular means (exploding). Question is there anything written on the coils?
 
yes, just hooked it up to my dmm. The coils do have numbers on them. L3 &4 are 2173. L1&2 are 2199. Cant see the number on the others (looking at my pics... at work currently).
 
unfortunately not..

Im going to order up the E caps / resistors tonight as a starting point and report back when all is reassembled and tested.

Thanks again NAD80. Your help is most apretiated!
 
Your welcome. Will look back at this thread when you post how they turned out. Good Luck. Also pictures of the crossovers and speakers when done.
 
For those looking at the FN11 and FN 12 networks

RadfordXO.gif
 
You should also check the solder connections to the drivers, and measure their DC resistance disconnected from the crossovers to see if they measure correctly. The ohm value should be marked on the drivers. Do you have pics of the speakers themselves? Does the speaker have any other type of adjustment controls, and do both speakers sound equally dull?
 
The speakers have no outboard controls.

To the original poster ,congrats on a great set of speakers.I like mine so much that when a second pair came up for sale i bought them.:biggrin:
 
Mech986, the only driver that's labeled that I can easily get at is the tweeter and it says 8ohms. It measures 6.5 with my DMM. However, all drivers measure exact same impedence, in both cabinets.

Radioactive, its funny you mention, as I saw multiple posts/threads only a few days before coming across these. Some of the posts that convinced me were yours :) The guy I bought these off of actually had another set (not as good condition aesthetically) but having not been told that things needed work, Id hesitate buying them off him regardless how these ones turn out. It doesn't take an audiophile to notice how bad the xover was in the ones I got!
 
If the other set has decent working driver and the price is right, you might consider getting them just to have spares, and something to work on for the future. They aren't going to be easy to source.

Where in the wide world are you located, UK or Canada?
 
I'm not sure where the original poster is but I'm in canada where there seems to be a abundance of these speakers.i don't think I know of anyone here on AK or anywhere from the USA with a pair.there were a few Akers that have had these or other Radford speakers but they're from Canada.
 
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