I've been using a pair of JBL LSR6328P's in my 2 channel setup for the past month or so and just got the callibration kit for them. These monitors have a ruler flat frequency response but also come with parametric equalization adjustments on the back of each speaker. The callibration kit comes with a mic, test tone cd and a chart to plot your measurements on. You plot your measurements, find the largest low frequency response peak and set the center frequency, width and depth of the mode on the back of the speaker. I set mine up yesterday and the difference is pretty striking. My room was creating a 9dB 62hz resonance from the left channel and a 6dB 47hz resonance from the right channel. The way it's tightened the bass is amazing. I haven't used any form of rmc before but this has got to be one of the largest improvements I've made in the sound of my system.
Room mode correction
- Thread starter rntlee
- Start date
Register to hide this ad
NumbDiver
Super Member
Room correction was the single biggest step forward I have made in audio in years. The differences are astounding..
I use RC entirely in the digital realm using IK ARC 2, through Pure Music, then off to my Lynx Hilo for D/A. Another friend just bought the new Amarra Symphony with RC built in. His system is already tweaked to the nines (tri-amp'd with 3 Pass XA amps...), and he too is loving the new RC. He had already tweaked for the room manually using his Metric Halo's EQ and his calibrated mic, with Amarra's parametric digital EQ, but the RC software took him leaps and bounds forward.
Sadly, few AKers use RC, although it's popping up more these days. Your room is the biggest contributor to your system's end-product.
I use RC entirely in the digital realm using IK ARC 2, through Pure Music, then off to my Lynx Hilo for D/A. Another friend just bought the new Amarra Symphony with RC built in. His system is already tweaked to the nines (tri-amp'd with 3 Pass XA amps...), and he too is loving the new RC. He had already tweaked for the room manually using his Metric Halo's EQ and his calibrated mic, with Amarra's parametric digital EQ, but the RC software took him leaps and bounds forward.
Sadly, few AKers use RC, although it's popping up more these days. Your room is the biggest contributor to your system's end-product.
tomlinmgt
Lunatic Member
My room is sufficiently treated that my max SPL deviation on the room response curve is around +/- 6 from 20 to 20. I think my decay times are pretty good, but might need a little more tweaking there. I still hear what I think to be a few issues that I'd like to address with DRC. I picked up a dbx DriveRack PA+ to try out its DRC function but wasn't too happy with the results. First off, the unit I picked up (used) is noisy, so I think something might be wrong with it. And I might not have even been using the DRC feature correctly. At any rate, I'd much rather not be performing DRC so far downstream in my signal stream. Rick, I googled the two DRC systems you suggested and noticed the Amarra Symphony is $$$ and for Mac, so that rules that one out. The IK ARC2 is designed to plug into a DAW but you run it through Pure Music? Could you please elaborate? And be forewarned, I'm willing to wander around in the world of computer based audio, but do so feeling my way through the darkness and stumble quite a lot....so talk to this 42-year old like he's 72.
- Michael
- Michael
Guess I always considered it a bit of a gimmick...i stand corrected! Now I've had a sip of the koolaid and I want more!
Going to look into the more extensive options listed by Numbdiver.
What are your opinions on bass-management? Do you high-pass your mains and run a sub (or two)? Apparently this will decrease distortion from the mains?
tomlinmgt
Lunatic Member
Distributed bass is wonderful if you can a accommodate all the subs.
NumbDiver
Super Member
Distributed bass and extensive room correction is awesome, and done correctly can yield amazing results with the right guy with an RTA and the knowledge to use it. Since I live in the real world (my living room is my main 2 channel room, and I can't live with every wall/floor/ceiling treatment needed. Nor can I place my speakers absolutely anywhere they need to be). RC isn't perfect, and is best saved for lower freq room modes. That said, it made things dang good.
There's so much out there, and it gets so elaborate that I'll scratch the surface based on my own personal wants/needs:
First and foremost you have to decide whether the output of your RC will be in the analog or digital domain. 90% of what is out there gives you only analog output. I didn't want that for many reasons. So moving to RC in the digital realm gives one limited choices. And most are pricey. Since I didn't know if the end-result would be worth it, I chose to use one of the cheaper routes (albeit a bit more complicated).
Michael asked if the IK ARC2 was designed to run through a DAW. Yes. BUT...it can run as a plug-in with any program that can use it. While originally I did purchase both ProTools and Reaper DAWs, by the time I got around to implementing the RC, PureMusic could use plug-ins. Amarra could not. Oh, you wanna talk complicated? Try firing up ProTools or Reaper with no working knowledge. Makes Photoshop CS look like PacMan!
Ok, so I buy Amarra and PureMusic to experiment with both about a year ago. Amarra's GUI was better, but PM was able to use plug-ins and can do DSD on the fly if your Dac is up to task. I stuck with PM for both reasons. The problem with PM is it is server-based only. Awesome for my 2 TB of uncompressed music on my server. However, I cannot spin a disc from my transport; send the digital signal to the Lynx Hilo; have the Hilo route it to my Mac server; run the signal through the RC program and back to the dac for D/A conversion. The only way to spin discs (or RC my Sonos signal) is through a DAW. Sadly, IK's ARC2 does not work as a stand-alone program. It needs the support of a DAW or another 'music' program like PureMusic/Amarra/Itunes/etc.. Since only PM can utilize plug-ins, my choice was simple. My choice also keeps me from using RC on any music not from my server. Hence the advantage of the stand-alone/all-in-one units like McIntosh or Lyngdorf or others.
For me, the Mc/Lyngdorf/other option was out. Digital goes into the unit, but analog comes out. Your Mc/Lygndorf/other is also your DAC. Fine for many, but not for me. I want to decide which dac I use. Also, as things move forward at light-speed on the DAC front, I want to be able to upgrade my dac. The units work well, but they stick you with a $3-$5k+ box that you will be stuck with. Plus, I have additional control of the signal that the one-box systems do not. I can change curves and eq. I do it strictly in the digital realm so I'm not stomping on the signal, adding noise, shifting phase angles, etc.. All the BAD things that tone controls and graphic EQs do in the analog realm, does not happen while digital. FWIW, if you don't mind the additional cost and tweak/dick-around...a combo of Amarra and Metric Halo as a DAC/ADC/Phono pre/preamp can move you to amazing signal processing power while never degrading your source at all. Period. The Amarra stuff gives you additional parametric EQing and other filters that could help tweak your room further.
In the end, if you hire a guy that REALLY, REALLY knows room correction and RTA measurement; and you don't mind lots of room treatments and obtrusive speaker placement...I believe that person can beat most RC systems.
For me, RC got me 90% there. It can be better. I still tweak speaker placement and such.
There is a now-defunct company called TacT that I almost bought into, while they were going under. The TacT unit was awesome as it was a stand-alone unit, but it kept everything in the digital realm. It was expensive (around $6kish), but more importantly it is impossibly hard to program and set curves. Most of their features assumed you had real sound engineering knowledge. Still, I almost bought in but they went the way of the DoDo when I was actively looking.
Trinnov appears to be the best stand-alone unit out there that keeps things digital, but things crept close to $10k. Amazing gear, amazing software, amazing results. No way I could hide that purchase though.
So, in the end, my 'experiement' with IK ARC2 ended up good enough that I decided to forego spinning discs (I just sold my transport to Cdfac this week). I don't have a way to RC my Sonos. But in truth, when I'm listening to Sonos, it's not for end-all resolution and image; it's for fun tunage.
I've followed a few threads of a few different Akers journeys into RC. Everyone reports great results. I have issues with how some of that hardware is implemented. And I'm sure some of those owners would have issue with my decision to be tied to server-only media. Many ways to skin a unicorn. You have to decide what your end-game is; how deep your pockets are; how much dick-around you are willing to endure.
FWIW, I would never ever be without RC again. Minimally, I'd buy a Lyngdorf/McIntosh or some other stand-along RC box. But for now, I DO NO want to go from D to A to D to A multiple times. THAT can really wonky-up your source signal.
BTW, the cost of Amarra Symphony with DRC is well worth the cost, when you hear the results. I'm unsure if they still give you a free trial period like they did prior to the room correction addition, but if they do...try it and you'll prolly pony-up the funds.
whew....sorry for the randomized thought process.
There's so much out there, and it gets so elaborate that I'll scratch the surface based on my own personal wants/needs:
First and foremost you have to decide whether the output of your RC will be in the analog or digital domain. 90% of what is out there gives you only analog output. I didn't want that for many reasons. So moving to RC in the digital realm gives one limited choices. And most are pricey. Since I didn't know if the end-result would be worth it, I chose to use one of the cheaper routes (albeit a bit more complicated).
Michael asked if the IK ARC2 was designed to run through a DAW. Yes. BUT...it can run as a plug-in with any program that can use it. While originally I did purchase both ProTools and Reaper DAWs, by the time I got around to implementing the RC, PureMusic could use plug-ins. Amarra could not. Oh, you wanna talk complicated? Try firing up ProTools or Reaper with no working knowledge. Makes Photoshop CS look like PacMan!
Ok, so I buy Amarra and PureMusic to experiment with both about a year ago. Amarra's GUI was better, but PM was able to use plug-ins and can do DSD on the fly if your Dac is up to task. I stuck with PM for both reasons. The problem with PM is it is server-based only. Awesome for my 2 TB of uncompressed music on my server. However, I cannot spin a disc from my transport; send the digital signal to the Lynx Hilo; have the Hilo route it to my Mac server; run the signal through the RC program and back to the dac for D/A conversion. The only way to spin discs (or RC my Sonos signal) is through a DAW. Sadly, IK's ARC2 does not work as a stand-alone program. It needs the support of a DAW or another 'music' program like PureMusic/Amarra/Itunes/etc.. Since only PM can utilize plug-ins, my choice was simple. My choice also keeps me from using RC on any music not from my server. Hence the advantage of the stand-alone/all-in-one units like McIntosh or Lyngdorf or others.
For me, the Mc/Lyngdorf/other option was out. Digital goes into the unit, but analog comes out. Your Mc/Lygndorf/other is also your DAC. Fine for many, but not for me. I want to decide which dac I use. Also, as things move forward at light-speed on the DAC front, I want to be able to upgrade my dac. The units work well, but they stick you with a $3-$5k+ box that you will be stuck with. Plus, I have additional control of the signal that the one-box systems do not. I can change curves and eq. I do it strictly in the digital realm so I'm not stomping on the signal, adding noise, shifting phase angles, etc.. All the BAD things that tone controls and graphic EQs do in the analog realm, does not happen while digital. FWIW, if you don't mind the additional cost and tweak/dick-around...a combo of Amarra and Metric Halo as a DAC/ADC/Phono pre/preamp can move you to amazing signal processing power while never degrading your source at all. Period. The Amarra stuff gives you additional parametric EQing and other filters that could help tweak your room further.
In the end, if you hire a guy that REALLY, REALLY knows room correction and RTA measurement; and you don't mind lots of room treatments and obtrusive speaker placement...I believe that person can beat most RC systems.
For me, RC got me 90% there. It can be better. I still tweak speaker placement and such.
There is a now-defunct company called TacT that I almost bought into, while they were going under. The TacT unit was awesome as it was a stand-alone unit, but it kept everything in the digital realm. It was expensive (around $6kish), but more importantly it is impossibly hard to program and set curves. Most of their features assumed you had real sound engineering knowledge. Still, I almost bought in but they went the way of the DoDo when I was actively looking.
Trinnov appears to be the best stand-alone unit out there that keeps things digital, but things crept close to $10k. Amazing gear, amazing software, amazing results. No way I could hide that purchase though.
So, in the end, my 'experiement' with IK ARC2 ended up good enough that I decided to forego spinning discs (I just sold my transport to Cdfac this week). I don't have a way to RC my Sonos. But in truth, when I'm listening to Sonos, it's not for end-all resolution and image; it's for fun tunage.
I've followed a few threads of a few different Akers journeys into RC. Everyone reports great results. I have issues with how some of that hardware is implemented. And I'm sure some of those owners would have issue with my decision to be tied to server-only media. Many ways to skin a unicorn. You have to decide what your end-game is; how deep your pockets are; how much dick-around you are willing to endure.
FWIW, I would never ever be without RC again. Minimally, I'd buy a Lyngdorf/McIntosh or some other stand-along RC box. But for now, I DO NO want to go from D to A to D to A multiple times. THAT can really wonky-up your source signal.
BTW, the cost of Amarra Symphony with DRC is well worth the cost, when you hear the results. I'm unsure if they still give you a free trial period like they did prior to the room correction addition, but if they do...try it and you'll prolly pony-up the funds.
whew....sorry for the randomized thought process.
Last edited:
tomlinmgt
Lunatic Member
Distributed bass and extensive room correction is awesome, and done correctly can yield amazing results with the right guy with an RTA and the knowledge to use it. Since I live in the real world (my living room is my main 2 channel room, and I can't live with every wall/floor/ceiling treatment needed. Nor can I place my speakers absolutely anywhere they need to be). RC isn't perfect, and is best saved for lower freq room modes. That said, it made things dang good.
There's so much out there, and it gets so elaborate that I'll scratch the surface based on my own personal wants/needs:
First and foremost you have to decide whether the output of your RC will be in the analog or digital domain. 90% of what is out there gives you only analog output. I didn't want that for many reasons. So moving to RC in the digital realm gives one limited choices. And most are pricey. Since I didn't know if the end-result would be worth it, I chose to use one of the cheaper routes (albeit a bit more complicated).
Michael asked if the IK ARC2 was designed to run through a DAW. Yes. BUT...it can run as a plug-in with any program that can use it. While originally I did purchase both ProTools and Reaper DAWs, by the time I got around to implementing the RC, PureMusic could use plug-ins. Amarra could not. Oh, you wanna talk complicated? Try firing up ProTools or Reaper with no working knowledge. Makes Photoshop CS look like PacMan!
Ok, so I buy Amarra and PureMusic to experiment with both about a year ago. Amarra's GUI was better, but PM was able to use plug-ins and can do DSD on the fly if your Dac is up to task. I stuck with PM for both reasons. The problem with PM is it is server-based only. Awesome for my 2 TB of uncompressed music on my server. However, I cannot spin a disc from my transport; send the digital signal to the Lynx Hilo; have the Hilo route it to my Mac server; run the signal through the RC program and back to the dac for D/A conversion. The only way to spin discs (or RC my Sonos signal) is through a DAW. Sadly, IK's ARC2 does not work as a stand-alone program. It needs the support of a DAW or another 'music' program like PureMusic/Amarra/Itunes/etc.. Since only PM can utilize plug-ins, my choice was simple. My choice also keeps me from using RC on any music not from my server. Hence the advantage of the stand-alone/all-in-one units like McIntosh or Lyngdorf or others.
For me, the Mc/Lyngdorf/? option was out. Digital goes in. Analog comes out. Your Mc/Lygndorf/? is also your DAC. Fine for many but not for me. I want to decide which dac I use. Also, as things move forward at light-speed on the DAC front, I want to be able to upgrade my dac. The units work well, but they stick you with a $3-$5k+ box that you will be stuck with. Plus, I have additional control of the signal that the one-box systems do not. I can change curves and eq. I do it strictly in the digital realm so I'm not stomping on the signal, adding noise, shifting phase angles, etc.. All the BAD things that tone controls and graphic EQs do in the analog realm, does not happen while digital. FWIW, if you don't mind the additional cost and tweak/dick-around...a combo of Amarra and Metric Halo as a DAC/ADC/Phono pre/preamp can move you to amazing signal processing power while never degrading your source at all. Period. The Amarra stuff gives you additional parametric EQing and other filters that could help tweak your room further.
In the end, if you hire a guy that REALLY, REALLY knows room correction and RTA measurement; and you don't mind lots of room treatments and obtrusive speaker placement...I believe that person can beat most RC systems.
For me, RC got me 90% there. It can be better. I still tweak speaker placement and such.
There is a now-defunct company called TacT that I almost bought into, while they were going under. The TacT unit was awesome as it was a stand-alone unit, but it kept everything in the digital realm. It was expensive (around $6kish), but more importantly it is impossibly hard to program and set curves. Most of their features assumed you had real sound engineering knowledge. Still, I almost bought in but they went the way of the DoDo when I was actively looking.
Trinnov appears to be the best stand-alone unit out there that keeps things digital, but things crept close to $10k. Amazing gear, amazing software, amazing results. No way I could hide that purchase though.
So, in the end, my 'experiement' with IK ARC2 ended up good enough that I decided to forego spinning discs (I just sold my transport to Cdfac this week). I don't have a way to RC my Sonos. But in truth, when I'm listening to Sonos, it's not for end-all resolution and image; it's for fun tunage.
I've followed a few threads of a few different Akers journeys into RC. Everyone reports great results. I have issues with how some of that hardware is implemented. And I'm sure some of those owners would have issue with my decision to be tied to server-only media. Many ways to skin a unicorn. You have to decide what your end-game is; how deep your pockets are; how much dick-around you are willing to endure.
FWIW, I would never ever be without RC again. Minimally, I'd buy a Lyngdorf/McIntosh or some other stand-along RC box. But for now, I DO NO want to go from D to A to D to A multiple times. THAT can really wonky-up your source signal.
BTW, the cost of Amarra Symphony with DRC is well worth the cost, when you hear the results. I'm unsure if they still give you a free trial period like they did prior to the room correction addition, but if they do...try it and you'll prolly pony-up the funds.
whew....sorry for the randomized thought process.
I'll revisit this after a cup of coffee in the morning!