I love just about every Rush album. Ive tried on more than one occasion to listen to Presto and Hold Your Fire. By the way, i LOVE Roll The Bones! Even their attempt at rap music was funny and witty, but cool nontheless. Your right though, its very fun to see Rush mature over the years, absolutely. Maybe someday ill throw Presto or Hold your Fire on in the near future, and change my mind. Who knows, thats why music is amazing, because it never changes, but we do. Agreed?
Hold Your Fire is awesome!I haven't given a close listen to Presto yet, need to find the time to do that. I've already stated that I'm a pretty big fan of Counterparts, I think it holds up well compared to the albums around it. I like the first album quite a bit too. You have to look at it as a "different" Rush. It's quite enjoyable if you listen to it out of the context of their other albums. And it's fun to speculate where Rush might have ended up if Neil Peart hadn't become part of the band.
I can almost guarantee you that if he had not joined we would not be having this discussion at all right now! (Rutsey was just a whiny little bitch for one thing! And he could barely drum his way out of a paper bag
).I should admit that I am going off how I have felt about these albums for the past 10+ years. But back when I first heard Presto and Hold Your Fire I DID also think "where's the rock"? And "this is different".
However, that lasted for about 3 listens!
That's another thing, I am very adamant that before someone decides on/judges an album, he or she should at LEAST listen to it CLOSELY (not in the background, not in the car, not at a friends, not while watching tv with the sound off, not browsing the interntet), as in sit-in-a-dark-room-and/or-close-your-eyes-concentrate-exclusively-on-every-note listen. And this should be done a MINIMUM of 3 times, more like at least 5 to 10 times. And also over several weeks/months to see if it grows on you at all (not all at once, that will just burn you out on it if you don't start to like it after a few listens). I can't stand it when someone thinks they don't like an album that they half listened to, fast forwarding and skipping tracks even, one, twice, or even 10 times. Uh, no, you did NOT really give it a try because you have no patience.
If I was like this (and I admit when I was younger and more immature I was somewhat), I would literally have missed out on dozens and dozens of bands and albums that I now love. Give everything a chance, a FAIR chance. (Don't go in with preconceptions about how your not going to like this/that album or band, how it "sucks", etc....how CAN you start to like something this way with your judgment so clouded!? Perhaps, but it's going to be more difficult with the obstacles you are setting up!) This means really listening to the material more than just a few times.
Anyway, totally agree with what you're saying, and RTB is a great album (though not one of my favorites as of late). It was the first Rush album I ever heard, and it was enormously popular my freshman year of high school. I knew I was in love the second Dreamline (the first Rush song I really sat down and listened to) concluded lol.
Glad to hear you like HYF! :thmbsp: It is, imo, Rush's most "beautiful/emotive/sophisticated" album. That doesn't jive well with the rockers, so that's one reason it is overlooked/ignored.
Yes, yes, you REALLY need to listen to Presto closely. :yes: (I thought you had all the Rush's? I know there's limited time and all...but come on! lol).
Counterparts, again, meh; the first album, again, meh. Not bad, but not near what Rush is capable of.
No, no I do NOT wish to speculate on what Rush would be like without Peart!!!I can almost guarantee you that if he had not joined we would not be having this discussion at all right now! (Rutsey was just a whiny little bitch for one thing! And he could barely drum his way out of a paper bag
).
Why Thank you sir. Rush is still an awesome band and deserves the hall of fame. By the way, i love their first album! Its so heavy, and it brings back alot of memories.
I should admit that I am going off how I have felt about these albums for the past 10+ years. But back when I first heard Presto and Hold Your Fire I DID also think "where's the rock"? And "this is different".
However, that lasted for about 3 listens!
That's another thing, I am very adamant that before someone decides on/judges an album, he or she should at LEAST listen to it CLOSELY (not in the background, not in the car, not at a friends, not while watching tv with the sound off, not browsing the interntet), as in sit-in-a-dark-room-and/or-close-your-eyes-concentrate-exclusively-on-every-note listen. And this should be done a MINIMUM of 3 times, more like at least 5 to 10 times. And also over several weeks/months to see if it grows on you at all (not all at once, that will just burn you out on it if you don't start to like it after a few listens). I can't stand it when someone thinks they don't like an album that they half listened to, fast forwarding and skipping tracks even, one, twice, or even 10 times. Uh, no, you did NOT really give it a try because you have no patience.
If I was like this (and I admit when I was younger and more immature I was somewhat), I would literally have missed out on dozens and dozens of bands and albums that I now love. Give everything a chance, a FAIR chance. (Don't go in with preconceptions about how your not going to like this/that album or band, how it "sucks", etc....how CAN you start to like something this way with your judgment so clouded!? Perhaps, but it's going to be more difficult with the obstacles you are setting up!) This means really listening to the material more than just a few times.
Anyway, totally agree with what you're saying, and RTB is a great album (though not one of my favorites as of late). It was the first Rush album I ever heard, and it was enormously popular my freshman year of high school. I knew I was in love the second Dreamline (the first Rush song I really sat down and listened to) concluded lol.
Glad to hear you like HYF! :thmbsp: It is, imo, Rush's most "beautiful/emotive/sophisticated" album. That doesn't jive well with the rockers, so that's one reason it is overlooked/ignored.
Yes, yes, you REALLY need to listen to Presto closely. :yes: (I thought you had all the Rush's? I know there's limited time and all...but come on! lol).
Counterparts, again, meh; the first album, again, meh. Not bad, but not near what Rush is capable of.
No, no I do NOT wish to speculate on what Rush would be like without Peart!!!I can almost guarantee you that if he had not joined we would not be having this discussion at all right now! (Rutsey was just a whiny little bitch for one thing! And he could barely drum his way out of a paper bag
).
There's so many crummy bands in the HOF that it's not much of a shame that Rush is left out. They're almost too good to be in the company of some of those groups. I mean 37 years of outstanding musicianship? There's not many that can compete with that.
Why Thank you sir. Rush is still an awesome band and deserves the hall of fame. By the way, i love their first album! Its so heavy, and it brings back alot of memories.
Its all cool. Me and my own brother disagree on some Rush topics, and were related! lol. I do however think Rush's first ten albums was their best work. But maybe thats because i was listening to their first ten albums back in 84. Nostalgia. lol
Not to disagree with you anymore...but I hope they DON'T get into the RnR HoF because I think it is a silly joke, a popularity contest that appeals to the lowest common denominator. Rush, btw, (or at least Alex) has said much the same thing...Alex said he could care less! lol, he rocks! :yes:
Don't get me wrong, several bands who are in it I like/love (I also like Aerosmith and AC/DC btw, I wasn't knocking them when I stated they sound generic...they do, but that doesn't mean they are bad), but the whole thing is just vulgar and showy imo.
I understand your sentiment of course...if it's any consolation Rush will be inducted into the Canadian Songwriters Hall of Fame this year:
http://www.newswire.ca/en/releases/archive/January2010/19/c9889.html
And all 3 were recognized as Officers of the Order of Canada (partially for their charity work) back in '96.
And of course they have won many other awards besides...if it matters.
Yes, it is fine to disagree, this is all just subjective anyway. :yes:
My favorite Rush period is '75 to '91. That is their "classic" stage where they crafted, experimented, and perfected their sound imo. Every single album in that period is a classic. :thmbsp:
And now, though it's not a period, Snakes and Arrows is one of their best albums ever, if not THE best (yes it is that good :yes:...however, I maintain that no Rush album is so much "better" than another, just different and great in it's own way). Also, their live albums have gotten progressively better starting with Different Stages imo. I love Exit Stage Left (and it was my favorite live album until Rush In Rio) and also enjoy A Show Of Hands a lot, but I think they finally, with Different Stages, gained enough confidence in their abilities to alter the songs more live, to change them a bit, loosen up, and not try to stick so rigidly to the album versions of the songs out of fear that if they don't they will sound bad. RiR, R30, and Snakes and Arrows are my favorite live Rush albums to date.
It's refreshing to hear someone mention the strong psychological bias nostalgia plays on ones musical preferences btw, I think many don't like later music from the bands of their youth just because they can't associate it with those wild and carefree days like when they were kids. This "nostalgia effect" doesn't wield such power over me because I enjoy all periods of my life about the same (so far), and because I recognize it (as do you) and that's a big victory over its power to distort your perception.
So, for instance, just because RTB was the first Rush album I listened to (borrowed it from a friend) and I really liked it (and still do), hardly means that is has to be my favorite or I couldn't love subsequent releases, especially ones released past my "glory days" like Snakes and Arrows. The same with Exit and the newer live albums. I don't see why the time in your life something was released is so important...it's the music that is! :thmbsp:
Its funny that you mention giving an album a chance. I was following your Metal thread (and enjoying it might i add). But then all of a sudden you pissed all over Metal Chuch's Human Factor by saying the cover was gay, and that the start of the album wasnt very promising.
But anyway, the two albums in question, are just my opinion. Ive listened to them alot over the years. And yes, i own them both. And yes, i listen to music by myself with no distractions. lol We agree to disagree?
There's so many crummy bands in the HOF that it's not much of a shame that Rush is left out. They're almost too good to be in the company of some of those groups. I mean 37 years of outstanding musicianship? There's not many that can compete with that.
I just have to get Presto on vinyl, I suppose. I'm much more likely to sit and listen when I have to spin a record. OK, I'll speculate some on where Rush would be without Neil. Done by '76. Geddy and Alex, though talented musicians, just weren't that good at writing lyrics. Rutsey wasn't that great on the drums, decent for the blues rock of the first album. Can I get some back story on the "whiny little bitch" claim?I think I know (whining about tours), but I want some confirmation.
A funny thing about Counterparts. Shows how good Rush is when you say it's one of their lesser albums, but still like half the album! :yes:
Believe it or not, That time in my life really has nothing to do with it, because i think Snakes and Arrows is every bit as good as say 2112 or Caress of Steel. Ive been listening to Rush for 26 years, and im very familiar with everything ( including live albums) they've done throughout their careers. And as far as heavy/mellow? That doesnt matter to me. I listen to Renaissance and classic rock for crying out loud. I love stuff like Savoy Brown, Styx, Hell i even like Pat Benatar. So, heavy/mellow, isnt of concern to me. Its all about how the music speaks to me. If you ask anyone that knows me, there isnt a bigger music lover than i. My music collection will verify that. There are people however that love music just as much as me. But people get tired of me talking about music all the time, because i know so much about it. And about Rush.

However, you may be a bigger fan of Rush than iam. lol If thats where your passion lies, so be it. Im not trying to piss on your opinions, i just like giving mine as well. :yes:
Again, I wasn't referring to you specifically, besides saying that yes, the nostalgia effect doesn't seem to cloud your judgment as it does so many others, and that's cool to see! :thmbsp:
Also, I wasn't really assuming you liked heavier music more than lighter (although you did say: "What killed me on the two i mentioned are the fact that they are too poppy for Rush imo. Counter Parts and Test for Echo are really when Alex Lifeson was kind of reintroduced to the band (what i mean by this, is your CAN actually hear his guitar") and he sounded great i thought. On Power Windows and Grace under Pressure, his guitar wasnt really there that much either, but the music was so good that i dont even notice when im listening to it. Hold your Fire really bores me. And i thought Presto was a snore fest as well."---so I took that as you liked the more guitar based sound more than the "softer" synth sound...and also your name IS "metalownz"); sorry to not make that clear. I was really referring to the many many many "classic" Rush fans who "gave up" after Power Windows (at the latest) because Rush "didn't rock anymore". :screwy:
I have an eclectic music collection as well, from metal to classic rock through today's rock, (and I include a lot under "rock" like alternative and "post rock" and punk, etc.) 80's pop, singer/songwriter (even some Streisand!), a little jazz and classical, and even some cheesy movie soundtracks lol. It's all good and I don't care what anyone else says otherwise!
Meh, if I am I don't any pride in it...I just happen to like a particular band a lot, so what? And ditto, I take no offense, hope you have not either, and certainly like to speak my mind. :thmbsp:
Now I HAVE to get to bed! lol
Btw, I've just finished listening to Hold Your Fire. Wonderful album, I even like Tai Shan!![]()
Quick question - Would original stampers wear over time when used to press so many albums? Or is there an original master that is used to make stampers for the vinyl?
I didnt take anything you said to heart. Its just references you made, thats all. Maybe towards me, maybe not. It all doesnt matter. And as far as Hold Your Fire, and Presto, i havent made my final verdict on them either. Im merely speaking for "THIS POINT IN TIME".
If we all had the same opinion about music in general, life would be boring. However, i did like having this conversation with you, because i got to know you more, and thats always a good thing. So thank you for that.
By the way, that Metal Church album is also one of my favorites of all time. lol. On the surface, it does seem a little cheesy at first, i know. But read the lyrics, and sit by yourself and listen to it again. Not on the computer, and you will better appreciate it, i know it. :thmbsp:
What i mean about the two Rush albums, were that they were a little too poppy for the band. But every band changes, i understand that and accept change. But then you look past that and see if there is anything relevant with the two above mentioned albums. So far i havent found anything. Maybe i just havent entered the world of those two records. Thats the way i like to put it. But like you, i never give up on a record. What i usually do is pull out the cd or record 5 years from now, and give it another spin. :yes:
Thats cool that you have a wide variety of taste in music. Thats always a good thing.

Fly By Night was my first taste of Rush. I remember listening to my transistor radio doing grade 10 homework and FBN (single) came on. I stopped what I was doing and listened in awe.
The next day I went down to the mall and bought the album, never looked back.
As I've stated before...
RUSH, there is no finer drug.
Dude, you're taking what I've been saying too personally!But glad you aren't (too) offended. :thmbsp:
It was nice discussing Rush with you as well; I can always blab on and on about Rush (as this thread should evidence!). You can friend me if you wish...
I had no idea you liked that Metal Church album so much (how could I?). Don't worry, I will re-listen to it several more times as I get a chance/feel in the mood to do so, and I found much to like in the several Metal Church albums I have recently acquired. In fact, I'll try to a Metal Church "marathon" soon in the metal thread, in your honor. :thmbsp:
I like that saying, of "entering a world" of a record (or not). :yes: I totally understand that; there is much music out there that I know is good and that I should like, but, alas, I simply can not get "into" it no matter how valiant my efforts. But that doesn't mean it's bad, just because I personally don't like it!
Here's hoping you will someday come to love Presto and Hold Your Fire as much as I!
(I hold out hope that I will come to love the debut Rush, CoS, CP, and TFE too someday, but with close to 20 years of listening to the first two and about 17 and 14 years of listening, respectively, to the latter two, I don't see that happening...:tears.
In a way that's what happened to me when "Dreamline" came on over the radio (my boom box). I was just 13, just starting to really get into music (I liked just a few bands including Led Zep, Metallica, some grunge/alt bands that were just getting big at the time, etc.), and I stopped whatever I was doing (I think I was making my bed lol) and was like---"Woah, woah, woah...now what/who is this?!" Such a great feeling. :yes:
A friend of mine got the "Roll The Bones" cd shortly after and I bugged him so much he let me borrow it(though he really liked it and wanted to keep listening to it, lol poor guy). I was in love and I scratched together enough cash to go buy it on cd new (as well as Exit...Stage Left on the recommendation of another friend) at Streetside Records for I think $18 (in '91 money...the total for both albums was close to $40 with tax!).
I listened to both RTB and Exit dozens of times over the next week or so and Rush quickly replaced Led Zep as my favorite band (of which I had I - IV that I just loved) within a month or two (I kept buying or borrowing Rush cd's and tapes whenever I could). And they've remained my favorite band for nearly 20 years now. :thmbsp:
It has truly been a pleasure. And no, you didnt offend me at all. I remember being 17 in 1991, and buying The Human Factor by Metal Church on cassette, ha ha. I wore that tape out my friend. All my friends loved it also. I remember that time like it was yesterday. I even remember my playlist...
Metal Church-The Human Factor
Armored Saint-Symbol Of Salvation
Dio-Lock Up The Wolves
Vio-lence-Oppressing the Masses
Tesla-The great Radio Controversy
Slayer-Seasons in the Abyss
This was just a few on my playlist at this time period. In the mid 1990's music started to get stale, and alternative was taking over. Although i do like alot of that stuff too, there wasnt enough of it to keep up with me.
Ill friend you sure. I love talking about Rush as well. I listened to Caress of Steel on vinyl last night! What an experience.
Cool, good to hear, and ditto! :thmbsp:
I'm going to try to listen to some Metal Church tonight...
I agree that around the mid 90's, when the grunge/alt period was wearing down, rock did go downhill (and hasn't recovered too much). Pop boy/girl bands took over (and they weren't the good stuff like in the 80's) and then the whole "neo-punk/post rock/emo/indie" movement which, so far (yes I need to listen to more bands from these genres before deciding!), totally bores me.
I think I'll listen to my least favorite Rush albums again real soon...![]()
The 70's rocked....very hard. Too many epic bands/songs to mention.I didnt know the 70's had such great music!
The 70's rocked....very hard. Too many epic bands/songs to mention.
Have fun exploring it.
http://www.inthe70s.com/generated/toptensongs.shtml
Yeah, the grunge movement was ok. I liked bands like Soundgarden and STP. But the 80's for music was a special time for me, since i grew up in that time span. Now, im starting to delve into the 70's some with alot of Prog (minus Rush) rock and other stuff. I didnt know the 70's had such great music!