Sansui Receivers - Which one should I get?

[droid]

There's a 5000X for sale down my way at the moment (New Zealand) that I'm guessing is going to get hot-and-heavy come auction-close... going to see if I can snag it for my Vintage Sansui fix.

An update for anyone that wanted a giggle... the auction went absolutely crazy. I had already received the tip-off from Kevin that this unit would need a full recap in the near future, and to factor another $600 NZD into whatever the final price was... it ended up finally closing at $905 NZD. Once it crossed the $700 zenith I was reaching purely for the popcorn bucket...

True to form (and to what you guys have said, though) - Kev has given me a lead on some G-series receivers sitting with an older collector down here. More to come.

 

[Sansuiman]

Sheesh, they are really bidding up the 5000/A/X these days. Not sure what the present USD/NZ exchange rate is, but even so those prices are way to the high side for an unrestored unit.

I've noted the trend - and sure others have as well - that since the heavy hitter models now cost as much as a used car, the mid range and even the lower end models are getting a lot of money thrown at them at least in a auction format sale.

This in turn creates the expectation that these prices are the new baseline, and classified sites and the like start to show the same upward trend. On my local craigslist there is a 5000X with F-6013 drivers being offered at $450, but not selling at that price judging by the time it has remained listed. While that may not be ridiculously high, it is a long way up from what they were selling for 2-3 years ago by my admittedly informal observations.

I really have to wonder how much longer this ascendancy of prices to the stratosphere will continue.

 

[kevzep]

Sheesh, they are really bidding up the 5000/A/X these days. Not sure what the present USD/NZ exchange rate is, but even so those prices are way to the high side for an unrestored unit.

I've noted the trend - and sure others have as well - that since the heavy hitter models now cost as much as a used car, the mid range and even the lower end models are getting a lot of money thrown at them at least in a auction format sale.

This in turn creates the expectation that these prices are the new baseline, and classified sites and the like start to show the same upward trend. On my local craigslist there is a 5000X with F-6013 drivers being offered at $450, but not selling at that price judging by the time it has remained listed. While that may not be ridiculously high, it is a long way up from what they were selling for 2-3 years ago by my admittedly informal observations.

I really have to wonder how much longer this ascendancy of prices to the stratosphere will continue.

$900NZ is about $600US.
Its complete buffoonery for people that want to buy one and have it restored, the purchase price alone is out of reach to some..
I annoys me, that 5000X is simply not worth that sort of money in its current state.

 

[droid]

Just to take a moment to have a little show-and-tell... there has been a very happy resolution to my joining of this forum and reading this thread (and the many others like it!). Thanks again to all the knowledgeable folks who make this place great.

Oh, and... behold: my new stereo for life.

 

[BLAH BLAH]

Just to take a moment to have a little show-and-tell... there has been a very happy resolution to my joining of this forum and reading this thread (and the many others like it!). Thanks again to all the knowledgeable folks who make this place great.

Oh, and... behold: my new stereo for life.

Nice...do i spy a set of Sui speakers there as well per chance?!?!

 

[BLAH BLAH]

Sheesh, they are really bidding up the 5000/A/X these days. Not sure what the present USD/NZ exchange rate is, but even so those prices are way to the high side for an unrestored unit.
I've noted the trend - and sure others have as well - that since the heavy hitter models now cost as much as a used car, the mid range and even the lower end models are getting a lot of money thrown at them at least in a auction format sale.
This in turn creates the expectation that these prices are the new baseline, and classified sites and the like start to show the same upward trend. On my local craigslist there is a 5000X with F-6013 drivers being offered at $450, but not selling at that price judging by the time it has remained listed. While that may not be ridiculously high, it is a long way up from what they were selling for 2-3 years ago by my admittedly informal observations.
I really have to wonder how much longer this ascendancy of prices to the stratosphere will continue.

They are not making them anymore so i expect the prices to keep rising...in future easy double that $450...I'm expecting the Alpha series in future to cost the price of a new car...get them while you can gentlemen!

 

[Sansuiman]

^ I expect they'll continue to appreciate for a while yet. I also know that at some point there will come a correction to the market for this gear just like any other tangible asset. Economic conditions and sentiments of the public at large are still driving the trend upward presently. When the underlying conditions finally overheat - and we are certainly on our way to that in the US at least - the rocket shot in prices will end and come back down.

I won't deign to guess how far as that's above my pay grade, though I'd suggest reading about the Dutch tulip mania of the 1630's for a case study on this effect. It is true there are no more being made but remember that these are all purely discretionary purchases. Loss of confidence tends to nick the demand for these items quickly and deeply.

We've seen prices on vintage gear contract somewhat twice now since 2000 concurrent with economic downturns here and - again just from an American perspective, I can't speak to other parts of the world - we are, unfortunately, well due for another one.

This isn't really the forum for such discussion anyway, so I'm going to end my threadjack here. But do keep an eye on pricing trends in the next 2-4 years, I expect some big surprises that don't even seem possible right now.

 

[droid]

Nice...do i spy a set of Sui speakers there as well per chance?!?!

Yes sir! The collector I went to see had a heap of them... they are SP-3500's, they've taken a little bit of cosmetic damage but the speakers themselves are fine. I asked if he could throw in something appropriate for the G-8000

One of the loudest situations of my life, and believe me... I've been in a lot of loud situations over the years.

 

[kevzep]

Yes sir! The collector I went to see had a heap of them... they are SP-3500's, they've taken a little bit of cosmetic damage but the speakers themselves are fine. I asked if he could throw in something appropriate for the G-8000

One of the loudest situations of my life, and believe me... I've been in a lot of loud situations over the years.

You did well mate, they only way to get any kind of deal like that in New Zealand is to be in the 'inner circle', glad I was able to hook you up.....
Those speakers will tidy up nicely too....

 

[Brooklynwgtn]

Just to take a moment to have a little show-and-tell... there has been a very happy resolution to my joining of this forum and reading this thread (and the many others like it!). Thanks again to all the knowledgeable folks who make this place great.

Oh, and... behold: my new stereo for life.

Fantastic!

 

[Brooklynwgtn]

You did well mate, they only way to get any kind of deal like that in New Zealand is to be in the 'inner circle', glad I was able to hook you up.....
Those speakers will tidy up nicely too....

ahhh the good old inner circle

 

[kevzep]

ahhh the good old inner circle

Thats it, the "inner circle" of which you are most definitely part of.....

 

[SimplerTimes]

Had a 661 here. Sold it to upgrade and have had sellers remorse since. It's replacement sounds better, but could have lived very easily with the 661. Great low powered receiver. Don't know a lot about the others but the xx1 series are nice sounding.

I agree about the xx1 series being very good. I have the 881,771 and 551 and all three sound great.

 

[Plimpington2]

I JUST picked up a very nice condition 2000A from eBay. Paid $200 for it, which I thought was worth the trial and error. I MOSTLY bought it because I like the way the “less busy” Sansui’s look when all lit up. I don’t expect it to compete with any of my vintage tube amps, but as an aesthetic “thing”, it looks great.

That being said, I had a 5000X up on the bench at my local emporium on Monday and I REALLY liked that one as well. But some of the front panel lights were out (I didn’t try to listen to it) and i didn’t want to have to get into it since I know exactly squat about solid state service. Would have been $100 in its current state, tho. It had the upgraded driver boards - I checked.

So, a few questions arise:

How does the 2000A differ from the 2000X? And how do they differ from the 5000X.

I ALSO have an opportunity to pick up a QRX -9001 in (seemingly) excellent condition. But DAMN is it ugly in a sort of “everything that is wrong with the late 70’s/early 80’s way.” Does it sound THAT good?

 

[Sansuiman]

2000A was a minor improvement on the 2000 (updated front panel and a bit more output power). The 2000X slightly upped the power again, but looked identical to the 2000A. Either the A or the X are very nice. The 2000 (no letter suffix] is a nice receiver as well, though looks just a bit less refined than the A or X versions.

5000X is a great receiver, and would easily be worth $100 with the updated driver boards. Burned out lamps are no big deal to service, but any rece9ver this age - unless already gone through thoroughly by a good tech - will end up needing work (controls cleaned, recapping, noisy small signal transistors needing replacmement, tuner alignment at least).

The QRX-9001 does sound excellent if you want quad, but if you aren't concerned about 4 channel at all, then there are other receivers and amps that will serve you well. I wouldn't call the 9001 ugly, though the dial scale design could've been better IMHO. They pretty well resorted to filling dead space with that side-lit graphic above the frequency markings, and the sawtooth filter that partially obscures the vernier needle.

 

[AnalogueBen]

From top - 2000A and 2000X

 

[Plimpington2]

$900NZ is about $600US.
Its complete buffoonery for people that want to buy one and have it restored, the purchase price alone is out of reach to some..
I annoys me, that 5000X is simply not worth that sort of money in its current state.

I don’t know that i agree. I can’t speak to all of Sansui’s stuff, but my untouched 2000A sounds damned near as good as anything you can but today for about $1500 to my ears . . . Maybe more. And boy do they look nice - a damned sight better than what any modern receiver looks like in my opinion. I really dig on the late 60’s/very early 70’s receivers. The Sansui 2000(a)(x)/5000(a)(x) and the Mac 1500/1700/1900 series.

 

[kevzep]

I don’t know that i agree. I can’t speak to all of Sansui’s stuff, but my untouched 2000A sounds damned near as good as anything you can but today for about $1500 to my ears . . . Maybe more. And boy do they look nice.

Thats great, but on the Bench I would be able to prove your caps are now slowly turning into resistors and eventually either cause problems with performance, short circuiting caps, and other associated issues.
The old "but its working great" is all well and good and maybe it is, but its in a state of decline at this point in its life and in order for it to work as per spec it needs updating.
In units I have worked on from this era, the state of the Ecaps is getting worse and worse as expected.

By all means "don't agree", and its totally your entitlement, but its in your interest to do so on an informed basis.
I am not theorising here, I am purely stating my position from an experience perspective from working on a lot of gear, not just Sansui's.
I see these "its working great, I'll leave all the caps, just repair it" units coming across my bench all the time....

 

[Plimpington2]

Thats great, but on the Bench I would be able to prove your caps are now slowly turning into resistors and eventually either cause problems with performance, short circuiting caps, and other associated issues.
The old "but its working great" is all well and good and maybe it is, but its in a state of decline at this point in its life and in order for it to work as per spec it needs updating.
In units I have worked on from this era, the state of the Ecaps is getting worse and worse as expected.

By all means "don't agree", and its totally your entitlement, but its in your interest to do so on an informed basis.
I am not theorising here, I am purely stating my position from an experience perspective from working on a lot of gear, not just Sansui's.
I see these "its working great, I'll leave all the caps, just repair it" units coming across my bench all the time....

I’m not arguing that the thing doesn’t need caps. I believe in capacitor replacement. I’m a tube guy, mostly, and it’s my first order of business in almost all cases.

What I’m saying is that EVEN WITHOUT new caps, transistors, etc., this thing sounds scary good. It boggles my mind why it should.

 

[kevzep]

I’m not arguing that the thing doesn’t need caps. I believe in capacitor replacement. I’m a tube guy, mostly, and it’s my first order of business in almost all cases.

What I’m saying is that EVEN WITHOUT new caps, transistors, etc., this thing sounds scary good. It boggles my mind why it should.

Yes the 5000X I had a look at for a customer who just wanted to have it checked so he could sell it, that thing sounded great too, I was quite surprised.