Stylus sounds like its dragging the vinyl! Help on identify the issue!

[yvesauad]

Hey guys, how are you?
Yesterday I bought some records on the old bookstore near my house. I cleaned all of them then used a carbon fiber bush.

Even so, the records sound surprisingly bad. I take like 10 min to take away all the dust on the stylus accumulated during these 15 min. Now I am playing my well-know records (which I know how exactly they sound) and I notice that sometimes there's a slow down on the sound. Not a lot of pops and crackles, but just that momentary the instant rpm became something less than 33 1/3. This lasts more or less 2-3 seg.

I instantly related with a high tracking force, as I ~think~ a high one can drag the vinyl on opposite force of the belt-driven rotation, difficulting the spinning.

The problem is that I have an old turntable that actually does not let you adjust tonearm balace, tracking force nor anti-skating.

What should I do? Any recommendations?

Model: Hitachi HT-102
P-mount cartridge / st-12 stylus.

 

[loudnoises]

Still using the old belt? MIght be time for a new one.

But if you can't adjust... well anything about that table, it might be time to upgrade.

Were there any speed issues before playing your new acquisitions?

 

[yvesauad]

Still using the old belt? MIght be time for a new one.

But if you can't adjust... well anything about that table, it might be time to upgrade.

Were there any speed issues before playing your new acquisitions?

Oh! I was so focused on the stylus that i forgot about the belt. I am going to check this out when I arrive home. I didn't have this kind of issue in the past. This is why I am so skeptical of the stylus performance.

I also run a stopwatch and tracked the number of full rotations of the plate (without any vinyl on it). It was indeed 33 rpm (tracked 66 rotations). I am going to investigate the rotation number of cycles:

1) without lp; (if problem --> belt completely bad)
2) with lp without stylus on top of it; (if problem --> belt)
3) with lp with stylus; (if problem --> stylus for some reason --> put it on a microscope)

I think I can figure it out whats happening with this drill..what do you think?

 

[jrtrent]

I can find no information about the HT-102, but most p-mount turntables were designed so that no adjustments are necessary, with cartridge weight, tracking force, and so on being standardized so all the consumer has to do is plug and play. If your Hitachi uses a belt, then one sensible course would be to try a new belt and stylus; if it's direct drive, then just a new stylus. For my belt drive turntables, the typical manufacturer or dealer recommendation has been to replace the belt about every five years, which is a practice I've always followed. Some turntables also require motor lubrication every so often; if you have a manual for your HT-102, you might check to see if that's the case with yours.

 

[vwestlife]

P-Mount turntables track at 1.25 grams -- far too low to cause any damage due to excessive tracking force. However, a damaged stylus can act as a chisel, carving away at the vinyl as it plays. I recommend you replace the stylus before using it to play any more records.

The ST-12 is Hitachi's model number for Audio-Technica's P-Mount cartridge stylus, for which a wide variety are available. Here is an inexpensive upgraded elliptical stylus for it:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/201541184803

 

[yvesauad]

I can find no information about the HT-102, but most p-mount turntables were designed so that no adjustments are necessary, with cartridge weight, tracking force, and so on being standardized so all the consumer has to do is plug and play. If your Hitachi uses a belt, then one sensible course would be to try a new belt and stylus; if it's direct drive, then just a new stylus. For my belt drive turntables, the typical manufacturer or dealer recommendation has been to replace the belt about every five years, which is a practice I've always followed. Some turntables also require motor lubrication every so often; if you have a manual for your HT-102, you might check to see if that's the case with yours.

It's definitely the belt. I went home and just re-attach and instantly i get a better steady velocity. Thank you so much!

P-Mount turntables track at 1.25 grams -- far too low to cause any damage due to excessive tracking force. However, a damaged stylus can act as a chisel, carving away at the vinyl as it plays. I recommend you replace the stylus before using it to play any more records.

The ST-12 is Hitachi's model number for Audio-Technica's P-Mount cartridge stylus, for which a wide variety are available. Here is an inexpensive upgraded elliptical stylus for it:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/201541184803

Absolutely! I get happy with your recommendation, because my stylus is similar this one. I live in Brazil and our e-bay is called "MercadoLivre". The diamond conical akai stylus is 150 reais. There's a similar like this one also conical made from shappire from 50 reais. I am saying this because small objects like this doesn't actually arrive here (our government inspect everything and then they are a mess and they usually lost small objects..this is really true).

Do you think buying these "brandless" stylus is a bad idea? I am thinking on this one: http://produto.mercadolivre.com.br/...33-st12-akay-philco-hitachi-teac-e-outros-_JM (conical and saphirre).

Thanks for you reply! 100% sure right now I need to replace both the belt and the stylus. I actually heard some pops on mint records and probably it's my bad stylus.

 

[revox-b77]

I think you need to find some way to get a factory replacement stylus. Maybe have it shipped in a refrigerator box?

 

[yvesauad]

I think you need to find some way to get a factory replacement stylus. Maybe have it shipped in a refrigerator box?

hahahaha sounds perfect! $300 dollars for shipping and 15 for the stylus. Thank you so much guys! I love this forum and the users engagement!

 

[vwestlife]

Do you think buying these "brandless" stylus is a bad idea? I am thinking on this one: http://produto.mercadolivre.com.br/...33-st12-akay-philco-hitachi-teac-e-outros-_JM (conical and saphirre).

A new aftermarket stylus will be much kinder to your records and ears than a damaged or worn-out OEM stylus.

But try to find one with a diamond tip. It will last much longer than sapphire.

 

[yvesauad]

I uploaded some files from my stylus just so you guys can have an idea.

CAUTION: its actually pretty disgusting

 

[DesertTwang]

I'm not an expert, but my limited scientific training tells me that there is no way that a stylus could possibly exert enough force to slow down a spinning record platter, old belt or not, just by excessive tracking force. A physicist may want to chime in, but intuition tells me that you would need a tracking force of several pounds to create enough friction with a microscopically small area to slow down a platter with the momentum that it has. So I would argue that tracking force has absolutely nothing to do with what the OP observed.

 

[HTHMAN]

I doubt the stylus is slowing your platter, more likely an aging belt. If your TT has a built in strobe, observe it for any speed fluctuations (or use a strobe disk on the platter). You could remove the belt and spin the platter to make sure the spindle bearings are in good shape. A direct drive TT with a 1/2" cartridge mount would be a nice upgrade if you are so inclined.

 

[vwestlife]

I'm not an expert, but my limited scientific training tells me that there is no way that a stylus could possibly exert enough force to slow down a spinning record platter, old belt or not, just by excessive tracking force. A physicist may want to chime in, but intuition tells me that you would need a tracking force of several pounds to create enough friction with a microscopically small area to slow down a platter with the momentum that it has.

I've seen it happen with the toy kiddie acoustic phonographs, which have a tracking force of more than 50 grams!

 

[Collin1141]

I uploaded some files from my stylus just so you guys can have an idea.

CAUTION: its actually pretty disgusting

That stylus is ridiculously bad do you ever clean it?
Definitely something stuck on it so impossible to tell what condition it's in
I would buy a new belt and a new stylus for your table if I were you I bet that cures both issues
It's an Audio-Technica you can still buy a genuine stylus for, for about $20 bucks give or take
Or you can buy the whole cart for around $25 on amazon
I did a little searching using your table model number and found more than a few sellers that would ship outside the U.S. so you're good there
Not an endorsement, just one example
https://www.turntableneedles.com/find10.asp?manfg=HITACHI&modelname=HT-102&Select=Model
Hope you get it straightened out

 

[don philipe]

That stylus is shot.

 

[Mister Pig]

I uploaded some files from my stylus just so you guys can have an idea.

CAUTION: its actually pretty disgusting

Those are some good photos.

Looks like you need to develop a protocol to clean your stylus better. Perhaps the vinyl also.

Regards
Mister Pig

 

[Sonic_Clown]

I uploaded some files from my stylus just so you guys can have an idea.

CAUTION: its actually pretty disgusting

Good god, man.

Time to grab a chunk of Magic Eraser and clean off that stylus.

 

[Collin1141]

What's the deal with the clip?
Maybe we should all tell him one more time that his stylus is funky
But I kinda think he already knows it

I uploaded some files from my stylus just so you guys can have an idea.

CAUTION: its actually pretty disgusting

 

[boreas]

That stylus is too far gone for Magic Eraser or any other of the typical cleaning methods. The only way to get that crud off would be by using an ultrasonic jewelry cleaner and after you're done that you might discover that there's damage to the tip. So, unless you already have an ultrasonic cleaner or want one, the cheap way out is to buy a new stylus.

John

 

[Collin1141]

That stylus is too far gone for Magic Eraser or any other of the typical cleaning methods. The only way to get that crud off would be by using an ultrasonic jewelry cleaner and after you're done that you might discover that there's damage to the tip. So, unless you already have an ultrasonic cleaner or want one, the cheap way out is to buy a new stylus.

John

You are correct it is a 15 - 20 dollar needle and I wouldn't spend a lot of time on it but I clean funky ones like that all the time with a few shots of CRC's electronics spray cleaner and a stylus brush when it's a thrift evaluation and have found good tips under far worse