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That 222 magic is back!

tom_tm

tom_tm

Active Member
I don't know what happened. Maybe I just needed to 'burn' it in, but in the last 24 hours after what I initially considered was a disastrous Silmic II/Panasonic FC recap, the Sansui 'magic' has somehow returned. I don't know how. But it's here. I've heard and owned a lot of amps in my time, including some fabulously exotic ones, but none has ever come close to this Sansui AU-222.

None.

I guess that's quite a statement? But it's true.

The 222 is a sonic masterpiece.

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I've experienced the same - just once, with an amplifier I know very well, and upgraded the main smoothing/filter capacitors - I really thought I'd killed it despite using the absolute best replacements. And then after 24 hours - it was back to its best - and some - since then it's never looked back and rubs shoulders with the best of them!
 
I'm very tempted to do what you suggest John and whip out the Silmics just to see what it would sound like with FC's only. It already has four of these in there already, but just for the PSU. I'm also going to see what sticking some 1µF film caps in does- as @AnalogueBen suggested. But as I said in the last 24 hours after playing music on this amp continuously pretty much ever since I recapped it, I'm simply stunned to just how good it has all of a sudden become again. The soundstage on the 222 is immense. The placing of different instruments is quite extraordinary, as too is how it seems to feel if the music is floating on a 'cloud' in front of me. It's also very easy to gauge different recordings' quality, something that my old NAD just cannot achieve. People say that the 222 sounds very similar to valve. Having owned a couple of Leak mono-blocks in the past, I get what they mean. And I'd say this sounds far better than the Quad I used to have too. There is still a tiny issue with the right-hand channel still being a little noisy, but I put this down to a dodgy 871, as they are renowned for going bad. But even with this tiny barely audible annoyance, this amp is amazing. Now I just need my old Arc 050's back....
 
Also, and very much like valve, this amp seems to need to 'warm up' before it sounds its best. That may however change with the new 871's exchanged for these fine new 2SC2240's.
 
Some teething problems with the new 2SC2240's in place of the C871's on the Main Amp board, where the left-hand was randomly emitting 'popping' sounds when I first fired it up, but it may just be the transistors settling in, because now the sound has stopped. I will keep an ear on this though, as you never know with generic semiconductors whether or not they are counterfeits. It appears that the 2SC3324 is a 1:1 replacement for the C2240, but this is an SMD part which will need some extra modification before placing. But the good news is that the 2SC3324 unlike the 2240, isn't obsolete.
 
tom_tm said:
Some teething problems with the new 2SC2240's in place of the C871's on the Main Amp board, where the left-hand was randomly emitting 'popping' sounds when I first fired it up, but it may just be the transistors settling in, because now the sound has stopped.
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I'm going to bet that the popping will return, unless you can be SURE that your 2SC2240's are original manufacture i.e. NOS, then there is an overwhelming likelihood is that they are fake or counterfeit. Their reputation as a reliable low noise high gain device made them a cert for counterfeiters to target.
 
I've taken out that 2240 and fitted another (applying freeze spray made it 'pop' in the speaker, and trannie thawed mighty fast too). Hopefully that'll fix it for now, but I fear John you are highly likely correct. Fingers crossed. Amp is gloriously silent at the moment.
 
Hi everyone! I haven't been around in a while due to a loft conversion we're having done here. But, I wanted to report back on the progress of the ELNA Silmic II's in my 222. Well all I can say is if you're prepared to wait out on these things 'settling in' after a recap, the wait is completely worth it. The sound that oozes like liquid from the speakers is something to behold. Especially now that I've replaced the small signals on the main board. This thing just oozes (I like that word!) quality, and I can certainly recommend Silmics as an alternative to Nichicons if that's all you can get hold of. Not that I've heard what the Nichicons sound like of course- could be even better? Dunno.

John, the 2240 replacement is still good. No more pops again, as this amp is now always on and playing everything pretty much under the sun. But my speakers, although fairly decent (Tannoy Mercury F1) are certainly now the weakest link in the chain, as they just cannot handle the bass the 222 chucks out- and the high range can sound a little harsh at times, even though it's pretty crystal clear. The 3D soundstage the 222 is capable of again, is quite mind bending, and as I shut my eyes and listen, it certainly feels like I'm in the room with the performers.

Bloody amazing amp all in all. I don't think I'll ever need to upgrade to anything else, as I don't think anything else will better this little beauty.
 
Great write up, Tom. In fact this may be enough persuasion for me to restore mine soon :)

The little 222 is a true gem, and if you love that then I'm certain you'd fall for the other cap coupled models of that era such as the 101, 555(A), 777(A) and receivers 1000, 2000, 4000, 5000 and 7000!
But certainly match yours up with the right speakers and you'll find nirvana :angel:
 
Thanks, Ben! It turns out that those who reviewed the Tannoy's said the only fault they found with them is that the highs could be a little harsh. So it is the speakers, not the amp. But for £40 secondhand for the pair, I'm not complaining. Bitches Brew by Miles Davis sounded incredible. But I had to roll off the bass slightly because the drums on that recording, I think were mic'ed quite closely, hence a certain frequency increase at around 120Hz. But other drum heavy recordings, such as Neu! 71 or Bowie's 'Blackstar' sounded great. I think the 222 just gets out what was originally put/recorded in, but in a very dynamic way. It certainly shows off what a great CD player the Sony CDP-XB930 is, despite the reviews of that claiming it was too 'smooth'. I guess the reviewers had that attached to the amp that matched it, which I wasn't that impressed with. (Sounds too much like a NAD). And I still haven't got the Tannoys on proper stands yet either. Just each on a pile of DVD cases on my desktop. So I may be being a little 'harsh' on them myself!
 
If you have doubt on the 2sc2240 try ksc1845 from mouser they will do the job check your soldering too in case there’s an intermittent dry joint or broken track
 
@quadmatrix82 Nowt wrong with this amp! No dry joints, no broken tracks, because I rebuilt the board *completely from scratch*, lifting the original copper trace PCB layout from the service manual. Rocking here old school with Press 'n' Peel and ferric chloride solution! Chinese _NOT_involved!! Here's what the underside of the 'new' board looks like:

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BTW, this pic was taken a couple of months back. The board has since been cleaned up a bit. And if you're wondering what the four gaping holes are near where the trimmers go, that was me having a 'lockdown brainfart' and accidentally drilling in the wrong place! Well actually it was me trying to figure out how I could place a smaller trimmer in a position where there was supposed to be a larger trimmer. Still a brain-fart though, because all I really needed to do was to solder some longer legs onto the trimmer, which I eventually did. But the good thing is that when I'm 80, I can look back at this moment, and laugh!
 
I want the magic too!!! But I told my self I wouldn't start another project until works finished up on the deck. The 222 would be a pretty quick recap with so few caps compared to bigger models so looks like I'll be compiling a BOM while it's raining here.
I'll even do a bit of comparing with Silmics and the popular Nichicon FG in some position, I already have some polyester film and 2240s to drop in.

Tom, was the original board very fragile during desoldering? My 777a was extremely sensitive to heat. As for speakers I think my Dynaco A25's will pair very nicely.
 
The existing board was in such bad shape. Much of the trace was missing or had been connected to adjacent components using wire and soldering connections. I think at some point it must have been raided for parts, as the main power transistors were all different and not original spec. Many of the resistors had been changed too. Fortunately though only on the main amp board. The other two boards were still in reasonable condition, although all had been flowed with solder, presumably to cover up any possible trace breaks. The head board on mine still needs work, but the only real sources I am feeding my 222 with at present are my CD player, and this Mac. I managed to find a really nice condition TP13a arm for my TD-150, without a head-shell, but that's okay because I'll use the original from the original arm (which was bent). But the head amp is still really noisy, so the trannies in that have got to go too. Just haven't got round to that yet.

Speakers, I've just picked up the ARC 050's I had up at my father-in-law's house. But they are in bad shape and need another complete rehaul. I think the bass drivers, the lubrication oil has dried out. But these things are supposed to sound amazing when working. Paired normally with Nytech amps and Linn LP12's. So the Thorens theoretically should fit right in- seeing it's really just an early LP12.
 
Yes, sorry Ben. Lost in musical excitement here... Yes, the board was very fragile. But not as fragile as the traces. I should've used desoldering wick, but I only had a pump, and everything was shut, so I had to just put up with what I had to hand. The pump was very good at destroying what was left on the board. A good lesson to any novice here, always if poss, use wick and a tin of plumber's flux. Edit: And a good quality temp-controlled iron. None of this 25w rubbish, or 'gas-guns'!!
 
tom_tm said:
Yes, sorry Ben. Lost in musical excitement here...
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That's no trouble, and by the sounds this is a fun thing for you to be getting back into. Yep it was the traces I was concerned about, I have all the gear and normally have few issues, just good to know if a particular model is prone to it.

Well right now I'm measuring up caps and making up an order, I'll start a new thread because like you also mentioned there isn't much info on the 222.

Best
 
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