Those look like Heppners. Where'd you get all those?
The horn sound- benefits, shortcomings
- Thread starter thedelihaus
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kfa888
Addicted Member
Tom Brennan said:
I think they are Utah or EV. All those speakers you see on that table including the 15" woofers came out of two big PA columns I got for $20. Story is they were built professionally using EV specifications. There were nice but huge, gave the cab away and kept the drivers. The big 15's actually sound fantastic for guitar amplification. The guy also threw in a hug EV speaker that contains a 18" cast frame EV woofer, a T35 horn tweeter and a Utah full range 8" that was a replacement for the stock Wolverine 8" EV. He threw it in as an "oh, you want that" !!! Little did I know at the time the woofer and tweeter were worth hundreds. I played around with the horns some and want to play with them some more at some point.
Oh, I also have some Magnavox horn mids and tweets and a few more EV horns.
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thedelihaus
Nocturnal transmissions
kfa888,
Your collection never ceases to amaze me. :thmbsp:
Your collection never ceases to amaze me. :thmbsp:
kfa888
Addicted Member
thedelihaus said:
Me too!!!! :screwy:
In under a year (joined AK in June 05) I have amassed quite a pile of stuff. when I do something I do it big :yes: I finally sold something last night, a mint Sansui G-8000, even though I got top dollar ($425) he had to pry that sucker from my hands.
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thedelihaus
Nocturnal transmissions
kfa888 said:
Couldn't you just have followed him out to the driveway and just picked it up after he dropped it from the heart attack/hernia he got lifting it and trying to carry to his car? :scratch2:
Wornears
Age & Treachery
After nearly 30 years of listening to dynamic speakers, I finally bought a pair of horn speakers last year. I heard a pair of K-horns in the mid-'70s and was stunned at how they filled a room. So, I figured I'd start small and move up, so I bought a pair of three-way Frazier Mark V with a horn tweeter. I enjoy their efficiency and low-level listening expertise. Frazier and Klipsch were admirers of each other -- probably because they were both horn-loaded speaker evangelists.
I was very wary and thought I might find the tweeter horn tinny and harsh and fatiguing from the accounts I had read, but not so with these -- even with a SS amp. I'm going to hook them up to my Grommes 520M tube receiver (thanks NAKdoc!) one of these days. I lust for some Klipsch Cornwalls, but haven't found the right local (within 500 miles) deal yet. Shipping on those is prohibitive!
I was very wary and thought I might find the tweeter horn tinny and harsh and fatiguing from the accounts I had read, but not so with these -- even with a SS amp. I'm going to hook them up to my Grommes 520M tube receiver (thanks NAKdoc!) one of these days. I lust for some Klipsch Cornwalls, but haven't found the right local (within 500 miles) deal yet. Shipping on those is prohibitive!
Jack Keck
Well-Known Member
I'm gonna try to keep this short, but I ain't promising.
I had assembled a HT system with a PIoneer VSX d709 receiver, Polk RTi 38s/CSi 30 (I think. Too lazy to go downstairs and look.), a Samsung 841 universal player, my DIY sub, and a pair of cheap speaks for the rear. I reached a point where I was happy with this until something broke. Then my cousin, who had upgraded to a Bose Lifestyle system ( I ain't making this up) GAVE me his early 80s Klipsch Heresy speakers.
I was happy with my Polks for music. I hooked them up to my "B" outputs on the Pioneer. I swithced to the Heresies during a CD to get an idea of what type of immediate difference I would hear. I've heard about how "harsh" horns are. If anything, the Heresies seemed to be less detailed in the treble. Actually, even rolled off. However, I couldn't switch back to the Polks. I can not describe what they do for the music, but I'd recommend them to anyone. There is such a smoothness to them. The few SACDs I have are a special treat.
The next thing I want to try is to hook them up to my NAD 3045 integrated amp, which I plan to do when I get the Pioneer receiver I won on eBay for my computer room. It has less about half the power of the HT receiver, but may still sound better. I might even bring down the turntable. I have a Rega Planar 2 that I use to transfer records to CD.
I had assembled a HT system with a PIoneer VSX d709 receiver, Polk RTi 38s/CSi 30 (I think. Too lazy to go downstairs and look.), a Samsung 841 universal player, my DIY sub, and a pair of cheap speaks for the rear. I reached a point where I was happy with this until something broke. Then my cousin, who had upgraded to a Bose Lifestyle system ( I ain't making this up) GAVE me his early 80s Klipsch Heresy speakers.
I was happy with my Polks for music. I hooked them up to my "B" outputs on the Pioneer. I swithced to the Heresies during a CD to get an idea of what type of immediate difference I would hear. I've heard about how "harsh" horns are. If anything, the Heresies seemed to be less detailed in the treble. Actually, even rolled off. However, I couldn't switch back to the Polks. I can not describe what they do for the music, but I'd recommend them to anyone. There is such a smoothness to them. The few SACDs I have are a special treat.
The next thing I want to try is to hook them up to my NAD 3045 integrated amp, which I plan to do when I get the Pioneer receiver I won on eBay for my computer room. It has less about half the power of the HT receiver, but may still sound better. I might even bring down the turntable. I have a Rega Planar 2 that I use to transfer records to CD.
House de Kris
Loud-n-Deep
I too am a horn fan, and for most of the reasons already given by others. I will give one twist though, in general I don't like the sound of horn tweeters in a smaller sized room. In my living room (a mere 12' x 16') I do have a horn woofer and a horn midrange, but I use electrostatic tweeters. The midrange is a highly modified horn, so much so that it is almost hard to call it a horn. It does still have the directivity control of a horn though.
I've got two outdoor systems that are fully horn loaded for woofer, mid and tweeter. None of my systems use a horn sub. Haven't found a horn sub that is pratical - yet.
I've got two outdoor systems that are fully horn loaded for woofer, mid and tweeter. None of my systems use a horn sub. Haven't found a horn sub that is pratical - yet.
reggaenaut
Addicted Member
Horns drive me nuts after any extendd listening.
Uncle Paul
Super Member
reggaenaut said:
A lot of horns out there can do that to you, especially those designed for PA systems. The JBL 2370 gets to me after a while, but the 2344 is a completely different critter.
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Unlike those who use turnkey horns the DIY horny by choosing various horns can control directivity and controlling directivity controls tonality.
I've used various horns and horn-lenses ranging in horizontal directivity from as narrow as 60 degrees to as wide as 130. This of course has a great effect on how much energy is directed on axis and to the sidewalls, through experimentation one can find the pattern that best suits one's room or taste.
One of my first experiments with directivity was back in the 1970s when I replaced the narrow pattern K-400 mid horns of my Klipsch LaScalas with 120 degree EV-SM 120 radial horns. The harsh, Skilsaw-like sound of the LSs was greatly softened by spreading the energy around more to the sides and directing less of it on axis. The wider pattern also made for a bigger, "cloudier" sound image.
Indeed by using 120 0r 130 degree horns you can get a diffuse planar speaker type of image. Imagine Maggies with dynamics. If your horns are placed atop cabinets as with VOTs you can also aid in this by removing the back covers of the compression drivers and letting them run as dipoles though of course less energy will come from the back than the horn-loaded front.
Anyone recall the EV dipolar compression drivers that had horns on each end?
I've used various horns and horn-lenses ranging in horizontal directivity from as narrow as 60 degrees to as wide as 130. This of course has a great effect on how much energy is directed on axis and to the sidewalls, through experimentation one can find the pattern that best suits one's room or taste.
One of my first experiments with directivity was back in the 1970s when I replaced the narrow pattern K-400 mid horns of my Klipsch LaScalas with 120 degree EV-SM 120 radial horns. The harsh, Skilsaw-like sound of the LSs was greatly softened by spreading the energy around more to the sides and directing less of it on axis. The wider pattern also made for a bigger, "cloudier" sound image.
Indeed by using 120 0r 130 degree horns you can get a diffuse planar speaker type of image. Imagine Maggies with dynamics. If your horns are placed atop cabinets as with VOTs you can also aid in this by removing the back covers of the compression drivers and letting them run as dipoles though of course less energy will come from the back than the horn-loaded front.
Anyone recall the EV dipolar compression drivers that had horns on each end?
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Kegger
R.I.P. 1/12/1966 - 6/1/2017
For me it's just the shear dynamics of the horn system that really makes me like them.
The amount of change from a very low sound that you can hear clearly to when a sound
or the music in general picks up can be just an incredably emotional ride that few others
can do very well. Not to mention I love tubes and the euphoric sounds they can produce
that horns just pick up so easily and fling out into the room! Can give you shivers!
Of'course as others have said a bad horn or non synergistic setup can be nails on a chalkboard!
The amount of change from a very low sound that you can hear clearly to when a sound
or the music in general picks up can be just an incredably emotional ride that few others
can do very well. Not to mention I love tubes and the euphoric sounds they can produce
that horns just pick up so easily and fling out into the room! Can give you shivers!
Of'course as others have said a bad horn or non synergistic setup can be nails on a chalkboard!
thedelihaus
Nocturnal transmissions
Thanks for all the responses, fellas, I've really learned a lot from all of you.
All of this has really prepared me for the experience of hearing some horns- and I won't be quick to disregard if the pair I hear sounds bad. If they sound great, I'll keep in mind that isn't always the case.
Thanks to all for a great education on this type of speaker approach!
Cheers,
Paul
All of this has really prepared me for the experience of hearing some horns- and I won't be quick to disregard if the pair I hear sounds bad. If they sound great, I'll keep in mind that isn't always the case.
Thanks to all for a great education on this type of speaker approach!
Cheers,
Paul
Brett a
~◦●○o0o○●◦~
Thought I'd bring this thread back to life and see what else might be added or revisited.
I've had my first pair of horn-loaded speakers in the system for a few weeks now and have appreciated what has been shared in this thread.
It's a pair of Klipsch KLH-20's. The upstream components are current in my sig. And with the room at around 14' x 17 'x 7 1/2', they are admittedly on the "too big" side.
Speaking only of the horns and not the cone woofers in these speakers, my impressions so far have been this.
The welcomed:
The not so welcomed:
If I were to try and sum it up, I'd say they are clear and light sounding which accounts for both the good and not so good listed above.
One of the truest expressions I've come across in audio is that it is a hobby of compromises. I can certainly see, at least from this one situation, what the strengths of horns can be and it's no mystery why folks really like them.
(The attached pic shows them with no grilles, but I listen to them with grilles on b/c it seems to smooth them out a little)
I've had my first pair of horn-loaded speakers in the system for a few weeks now and have appreciated what has been shared in this thread.
It's a pair of Klipsch KLH-20's. The upstream components are current in my sig. And with the room at around 14' x 17 'x 7 1/2', they are admittedly on the "too big" side.
Speaking only of the horns and not the cone woofers in these speakers, my impressions so far have been this.
The welcomed:
- In the mids and up, they are very clear and revealing.
- Good resolution of timbers. (The reediness of a saxophone, fine texture of a singer's vocal chords or the rasp of the snares under the snare drum.)
- They create a rather large wall of sound.
- Central imaging is well focused.
The not so welcomed:
- Although the instruments are clear, their placement in the soundstage is more diffuse and less three-dimensional than other speakers I've had.
- Instruments lack body and warmth. I can hear an acoustic guitar, but get no visceral connection of the resonance of wood it's made from.
- Fatiguing in a way that leaves my ears numb after listening session of an hour or more.
If I were to try and sum it up, I'd say they are clear and light sounding which accounts for both the good and not so good listed above.
One of the truest expressions I've come across in audio is that it is a hobby of compromises. I can certainly see, at least from this one situation, what the strengths of horns can be and it's no mystery why folks really like them.
(The attached pic shows them with no grilles, but I listen to them with grilles on b/c it seems to smooth them out a little)
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bowtie427ss
Lunatic Member
This can be at least partially a product of the non-horn loaded portion of the speaker system.
Optimum positioning with horn/bass reflex systems can be a challenge, and may require additional acoustic room treatments to get fully sorted out.
Compromise cannot be over-stated. Many times what is optimum for the bottom end is anything but for the dispersion angles of the horns and their first reflective points.
Taking your time to sort out the best balance of compromises can be very rewarding.