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The magnificent Zenith 49cz852's

botrytis, these ancient Zeniths are absolutely amazing even after all these years and others will tell you the same regarding theirs. Because I didn't know any better mine spent the last 5 years in an unheated/uncooled garage. While Columbia, SC winters are mild the summers are brutally hot and humid. Even with that abuse they've lost nothing that affects their wonderful sound and should they ever require a re-charge I won't be around to know it. In many areas they surpass my $1400 Lowthers. The $500 Tang Band W8-1808 aren't even close.
 
Poultrygeist said:
botrytis, these ancient Zeniths are absolutely amazing even after all these years and others will tell you the same regarding theirs. Because I didn't know any better mine spent the last 5 years in an unheated/uncooled garage. While Columbia, SC winters are mild the summers are brutally hot and humid. Even with that abuse they've lost nothing that affects their wonderful sound and should they ever require a re-charge I won't be around to know it. In many areas they surpass my $1400 Lowthers. The $500 Tang Band W8-1808 aren't even close.
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Lofty praise. I'll certainly have these on my radar from here on out. Does anyone know what these Zeniths were installed into? What should I be looking for?
 
onwardjames said:
Lofty praise. I'll certainly have these on my radar from here on out. Does anyone know what these Zeniths were installed into? What should I be looking for?
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Mine came from a console similar to this one. It features a Cobra-matic table, no radio and with a mono tube amp. It addition to the two 49CZ802 drivers it had two tweeters which were not remarkable.

DSC_0368.JPG
 
Has anyone ever seen a frequency response for the 49CZ? They sound higher than they have a right to. In Ahmad Jamal’s Poinciana, he plinks the highest piano notes and they don’t sound diminished in any way.
 
Hey nick... question on your speakers.

How do they sound with leaving the back open like that?
Do you get any bass out of them?

Reason for asking...
Friend of mine had some 6x9 speakers for his car.
He asked me why he isn't getting any bass.
I looked at his install, he had not cutout the deck so the speakers would mount flush.
We cutout the deck to mount them flush and BAM, there was the bass.
 
Skip Shot said:
Hey nick... question on your speakers.

How do they sound with leaving the back open like that?
Do you get any bass out of them?

Reason for asking...
Friend of mine had some 6x9 speakers for his car.
He asked me why he isn't getting any bass.
I looked at his install, he had not cutout the deck so the speakers would mount flush.
We cutout the deck to mount them flush and BAM, there was the bass.
Click to expand...
that’s what I’m wondering too...maybe some cats with OB building experience might chime in on this
 
Skip Shot said:
Hey nick... question on your speakers.

How do they sound with leaving the back open like that?
Do you get any bass out of them?

Reason for asking...
Friend of mine had some 6x9 speakers for his car.
He asked me why he isn't getting any bass.
I looked at his install, he had not cutout the deck so the speakers would mount flush.
We cutout the deck to mount them flush and BAM, there was the bass.
Click to expand...


Two things

rear coaxials are NOT for bass. Never try to get bass out of them.
You get exactly zero bass running them with open backs. If you wanted better bass, you would have to have such a large baffle( like 30 feet wide). I ALWAYS recommend getting a subwoofer. I have a 8” Dayton audio ultimax in my car and it’s fantastic. I’m actually looking to sell it
 
The 8 inch little brother of the Zenith 49CZ also with alnico motors. It reminds me of the Coral Holey Baskets in construction and SQ. It was used as the mid range in the console pictured above.

P1010015 2.jpeg
 
angelaudio said:
I think I’ll build a similar copy of your 49cz852 OB’s...not sure what woofer or tweeter I would like to use though. did you build a crossover for that setup?
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I would start without tweeters as the Zeniths play remarkably high for 12 inch drivers. It's easy to add them later powered by the same Zenith amp. My H-frames are open ended cubes with Eminence Alpha 15's mounted on a centered baffle. All interior dimensions of the H-frames are approx. 17 inches. I use no crossovers to mar the sound of the Zeniths which run full range from their dedicated tube amp. The Alpha woofers are powered by a 100 watt plate amp which has an adjustable low pass filter. The inverted T-top is 24" tall with a base that matches the H-frames. The Zenith offset is not critical but with enough room to add a tweeter. You might check out the quarter wave website for suggested dimensions.

Tweeters I use are front firing Eminence compression horn ASD1001 (?) and rear firing Realistic pod super tweets with 1.5uF caps on each.
 
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nick parkin said:
I used a 3" Goldwood $5 tweeter and it sounded incredible!
I didn't expect much for $5 but it made the zeniths sound absolutely stunning. I think I crossed it over at 13,000 hz, just used a cap.
https://www.parts-express.com/goldw...zKhe_NTybOTOZPPbHbW2k3ciInAx7u5IaAioHEALw_wcB
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13,000 hz? That's definitely near or above my hearing range.
I know from your other posts you're a young dude with better range than me for sure but did you mean 3,000 hz by some chance?
 
valvenator said:
13,000 hz? That's definitely near or above my hearing range.
I know from your other posts you're a young dude with better range than me for sure but did you mean 3,000 hz by some chance?
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If he used just a cap it would be down 6dB at 6,500 hz and down 12dB at 3,250 hz.
 
I ran a frequency sweep of my 49CZ's if anyone is interested in seeing a room eq wizard graph of their rolloff, etc.

I'm planning on going down Poultrygeist's path with his guidance.
 
mccarty350 said:
I ran a frequency sweep of my 49CZ's if anyone is interested in seeing a room eq wizard graph of their rolloff, etc.

I'm planning on going down Poultrygeist's path with his guidance.
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Yes please do share!

I’m also going to be measuring the parameters of my coral holey baskets as my friend Jake bought me the dayton audio test system and I have one laying around
 
Oh heck yeah. I would like to see that.

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So here are a few details. Used dual M&K subs crossed over at 150 hz so discount everything below 150hz. These were tested in a cardboard 15" woofer box not an open baffle so take the results with a grain of salt. These things have pretty good and flat response but have a huge dropoff at 10khz. I think this seems to be well known since most folks recommend that a helper tweeter be employed with about a 2uf cap tuning them for about 10khz. Please ignore the overall efficiency rating since I didn't take this sweep with 1 watt from 1 meter. Just take the trend line for what it's worth. This graph is smoothed out at 1/12 within room eq wizard. My model specifically is a 49cz1045 that I picked up locally this week. No whizzer cone on this model.
 
I think one of the main reasons the Zenith and CHB ( also mentioned here ) have superior sound is their alnico motors. You rarely see alnico magnets these days as they can cost ten times more than conventional ceramics plus they won't take much power. Even on PC speakers you can hear the difference in this youtube comparison test.

 
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