Tough Choice...Marantz 2385 or 2500?

[Musicman10]

Hello AK'ers! Looking for some subjective opinions here, and I think this just might be the place!
I am currently in the market for a Marantz Receiver. Problem is, not quite sure which way to go.
I have a line on two receivers- the 2385 and the 2500. Both have been fully restored by a professional.
Both are in exceedingly beautiful condition and appearance. The 2500 has the FM Modulator with it.
Both have super nice wood cabinets. I currently own a Marantz receiver now, the 2325, which I am going to pass along to one of my kids. Either unit has more than enough power, so that's not a consideration.
I will be playing them thru some new Klipsch Forte III's. I play mainly vinyl records with a KAB modded-Technics SL-1200 MK5 TT and use an Ortofon 2M Black Cart. My main listen is rock from the 60's-70's and some Pop records from the 50's-80's. I have a TEAC reel to reel I utilize as well.
Given that info, do you guys have opinions on the overall sound of these two units? I like a lot of "bottom end",
and love that deep bass drum punch and bass guitar combo. Think Yes, Deep Purple, Beatles, Lynyrd Skynyrd.
I was wondering if the two units sounded similar except for power, or does one tend to have a deeper or warmer bottom end than the other?
This is a substantial investment for me- unfortunately I can't listen to them both, so I need to do my research, and would appreciate any advice you could give.

 

[Jailtime]

I'd lean 2385 only for the reliability factor. 2500 transformer failures seem to pop up more the older they get.

That said, the Forte III is so sensitive you should never need the sort of power a 2385 provides. Maybe you can borrow some gear outside the Marantz world to see if there's a sound you like more? The high power Marantz all sound pretty similar in my experience.

 

[Musicman10]

I'd lean 2385 only for the reliability factor. 2500 transformer failures seem to pop up more the older they get.

That said, the Forte III is so sensitive you should never need the sort of power a 2385 provides. Maybe you can borrow some gear outside the Marantz world to see if there's a sound you like more? The high power Marantz all sound pretty similar in my experience.

Thanks for the input (pun intended)! I am pretty much an open book on stuff. Are there other speakers or receivers you would recommend that I research? As mentioned, I really love that deep bass and punch! Not muddy, but a clean, crisp, DEEP sound. I expect to pull the trigger in about 2 weeks or so. Anything vintage would have to be a restored unit. Thanks!

 

[Jailtime]

I think the 2325 would give you a reasonable idea of what a 2385/2500 could do on Fortes.

Are you looking for the vintage look? Need a tuner? Tone controls?

Same price ballpark you're looking in, I'd recommend a Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum III for something completely different. Big tube power (100 WPC) for Forte IIIs.

 

[rBuckner]

I agree, the 2385 would be my choice too. Also it's a tad easier to service and doesn't have the noisy fan running all the time.

 

[TJacques]

noisy fan

Interesting comment. I have had my 2500 since new, and it has always been silent, or close to it, on tick-over. Yes, it’s loud on the higher speed, but that’s always, ahem, “in the noise,” given what’s then coming out of the speakers (Dayton-Wright XAM-4).

After a while, the fan developed the smallest ticking, but hardly above the smallest whoosh of the air coming out of the unit. Luckily, the ticking never got worse over its ~forty years of use. In normal use, I’d have to try VERY hard to hear even the ticking, if I’m more than a metre or so from the 2500.

Perhaps I was fortunate enough to get a near-perfect fan in my unit?

 

[Musicman10]

Great info...thanks! Still haven't decided yet. There are clearly pros on each. Not so many cons. The 2500 is a rarer animal, only 1700 were made. There were 5400
of the 2385's made. In terms of keeping value, the 2500 may have it somewhat over the 2385- but i'm not buying to resell later. Hell, I might end up flipping a coin!

 

[rBuckner]

Interesting comment. I have had my 2500 since new, and it has always been silent, or close to it, on tick-over. Yes, it’s loud on the higher speed, but that’s always, ahem, “in the noise,” given what’s then coming out of the speakers (Dayton-Wright XAM-4).

After a while, the fan developed the smallest ticking, but hardly above the smallest whoosh of the air coming out of the unit. Luckily, the ticking never got worse over its ~forty years of use. In normal use, I’d have to try VERY hard to hear even the ticking, if I’m more than a metre or so from the 2500.

Perhaps I was fortunate enough to get a near-perfect fan in my unit?

Yep, you were lucky. I've experienced about five 2500s and 2600s, all the same and quite audible with no sound coming out of the speakers. All of them got a new Pabst ball bearing fan which was better but still audible.

 

[dgunnr]

Currently own a 2500, 2325, 2330B, 2285B, and 2270. Have also owned a 2385. Liked the 2385 but the 2500 is a better looking unit. My 2500 fan does not make noise since I had it replaced during the restoration for precautionary reasons.

Sound wise they both were excellent and I can’t recommend one over the other. For FM tuning the meter is better (easier to use) than the oscilloscope. Coolness factor the 2500 hands down is better. I could never only pick 1-2 Marantz units over others so that is why I own 5 lol!

 

[macman007]

2385. Someone beat me to the punch regarding the 2500 and 2600's unobtanium transformers, not to mention the hassle with the cooling fan,.. cleaning, replacement, maintenance. Stick with an efficient speaker design, something over 90db 1 W~1 meter , or more, and 8 ohms not 4. You like big bass, and rock music, living with Klipsch Forte's currently,.perhaps a big pair of Altec's,..maybe VOTT's, or vintage JBL's. The there is no need to run more than 50wpc in an average room to get it LOUD and DEEP.

Cool factor and valuation go out the window when a multi-thousand dollar rare receiver becomes spare parts because of an unobtanium transformer. I've heard stories where if the open in the coil is close enough to the outside edge it can be repaired, but why even tempt fate?

I'd lean more towards a speaker you really like, FIRST. Then add a receiver/amp/ancillaries. It's harder to find speakers you can live with for a lifetime than to find something to push them with or play through THEM !

Just my .02 cents..

 

[Musicman10]

Great advice here. I agree with the concern about the transformer for the 2500- but isn't that the same one used in the 2385? Not sure about the fan noise- but I will need to check that out as well. If both units restored will provide the same sound, but the 2500 has 1 or 2 possible issues, I may go with the 2385 just for that reason- although I admit the 2500 is totally cool- especially fully restored- but I don't want to end up with an expensive boat anchor. Anyone out there actually had their 2500 become completely unusable due to the transformer? Also, I have decided against dropping $3800. for the Klipsch Forte III's. I currently own a pair of Klipsch KLF-20's I bought back in spring 2001. I have those set-up- but am going to invest in a full on set of upgrades, so I have a question about that- Several years back I ended up replacing one of the K-79 tweeters which had stopped working. I had a smaller K-84, which fit perfectly so I put that in. Unfortunately I didn't keep the old K-79. So, rather than rebuilding two different tweeters, I want to replace them both with something better. Does Bob Crites offer new replacement tweeters that would work? I'm thinking the
C-120 or 125. I want new horn drivers and crossovers, which they have. Has anyone here had any experience with the new LMAHL V2 Drop in tweeters or the B&C DE10 Drivers? Would they be compatible with either the Crites horn driver and/or crossover? I know, lots of questions, but I want to do this right. As for some different speakers altogether, I have heard the JBL 240/250ti's are awesome, but finding decent ones are tough, and would I need to upgrade those? Hence my thoughts about upgrading the KLF-20s'. Would love to hear feedback on this. Thanks so much!!

 

[Denten]

I agree with the concern about the transformer for the 2500- but isn't that the same one used in the 2385?

The 2600, 2500, and 2385 transformers are proprietary to each model, the 2600 and 2500 have an extra winding for the scope.
The 2385 is the only one with a reliable transformer and is the reason I'm sooooo glad I have the 2385, I'll take reliability over the scope any day. A restored 2385 can be used as a daily driver with confidence.
The 2500 and 2600 can be used as daily drivers too, but not with confidence, it's a gamble every time you hit that power button.
I've talked to a couple of members that have both the 2385 and the 2500, they say they sound the same just one go's to 10 and the other one go's to 11.
Trust me, when you see a 2385 in person, the presence and cool factor are way up there. IMHO (biased).

 

[Musicman10]

Wow...You make a very good case for the 2385! It is a beautiful receiver as well, and was the one I leaning toward getting until
I saw there was a fully restored 2500 for sale. But, if I understand you correctly, even fully restored means that the transformer has not been touched, and is
still original, but the 2385 is a more reliable transformer. BTW, did anyone you spoke to have any issues with their 2500? Did they have any opinion as to either one?
As I said, I'm leaning toward the 2385- it's fully restored- not just caps- a complete restoration with cabinet- but have to admit, I hear that 2500 calling me.....

 

[rBuckner]

Also keep in mind some of us seasoned techs won't take on repairs/resto's of the 2500/2600. Too much of a hassle and too heavy to toss around the bench. In my opinion, Marantz rushed this design to market by the way some boards plug in at right angles and form a "U". Then there's wires hanging in open space all criss-crossing in air. Ugh...

The 2385 is built quite a bit the same but is not quite as bad to negotiate inside. Not quite as heavy either but close!

I hate to be a discouraging voice but did want to let you know what you may be headed for so you can make an informed decision.

 

[Musicman10]

I very much appreciate the input- I'm someone who prefers to get differing viewpoints and experiences. As for having the unit serviced (either the 2385 or 2500) I can have
it serviced thru the same person/company that did the restoration. I'm hopeful that with a full on restoration, I won't need to have anything to it for many years.
As for the 2500, I originally thought it might sound better than the 2385, but if that isn't the case, then i'm fully happy with going for the 2385. I have no intention of selling it,
and even if I did, it isn't like the 2385 wouldn't be desirable. Do I like the cool-ness factor and the fact that the 2500 is a more rare beast- sure- who doesn't?
But at the end of the day I want something reliable that will last me many years. This would be my primary receiver.

 

[Denten]

The thing about the 2500 is you will have big bucks invested in something that could blow a transformer at any time, or not, it doesn't matter if it's been restored, nothing is done to the transformer during restoration.
The one member I spoke with said he use's the 2385 as his daily driver and the 2500 go's unused most of the time because of the transformer issue.
I agree the 2500 looks cool with the scope but Is it worth the gamble? All you give up with the 2385 is the scope and a few watts but gain a reliable unit and extra cash in your pocket.
My 2385 has been working perfectly for the last six years without skipping a beat.

it isn't like the 2385 wouldn't be desirable.

This guy thinks they are.


Good luck with whatever receiver you choose.
Cheers.

 

[Musicman10]

I agree. I'm going with the 2385. That's a great looking unit! Hopefully I will have it by next week. I'm also doing a full on upgrade to my Klipsch KLF-20's I bought in 2001.