Turntable Cueing and Mat issues

[buckeye56]

Forgive if in wrong forum..

My Technics SL D35 has issues. The cueing doesn’t lift UP the tone arm, but works when lowering it.
Additionally, the tonearm skates across the album at the end due to arm not lifting high enough. Have adjusted all and still problem.
However, when I remove the rubber mat, the arm DOES CLEAR at the end and returns home
Oddly, despite how it looks, the sound is perfectly fine.
I’ve read abt the glue or whatever it is that can cause the cue to fail.
So what is happening here?
New mat needed? If so, what kind?
Have soaked my mat in hot water to try to flatten it, no luck.
When the table isn’ t spinning, the mat lays flat against the platter in some areas, raised in other areas
I can live without cue LIFT, but can’t live with ruining my albums.
Thanks for your help.
Also, Is there a way to attach video here or only pictures?

flat
raised

 

[alex213]

Do you have a friend that could lend you a Technics rubber mat?

Because if you can get your stylus to "clear" on a healthy mat, the Technics rubber mats are really decent.

 

[buckeye56]

Do you have a friend that could lend you a Technics rubber mat?

Because if you can get your stylus to "clear" on a healthy mat, the Technics rubber mats are really decent.

Sadly, I don't know anyone.

 

[alex213]

Well then I'm sure you could find an anti-static mat for not a lot of money. That would help you weather the storm.

Or maybe, even better, you could get some good quality double-sided stickers to force your existing rubber mat to lay completely flat. And if it works then you could get a fresh rubber mat at your convenience.

 

[Doug G.]

That's a good idea.

You should also investigate whether the arm should lift higher.

Doug

 

[Montycat]

Yeah, I expect the arm lift platform can be adjusted higher. Look for a screw either vertically oriented near the right end of the curved platform and if it has one, turn the screw counterclockwise a bit. If there is none there, look at the side of the area directly under the lift. If there's one here (potentially a very small allen head), unscrew a bit and lift up on the platform by a couple of mm and retighten.

I can't readily find a manual for your model but pictures of the lift area will help a lot.

 

[buckeye56]

Well then I'm sure you could find an anti-static mat for not a lot of money. That would help you weather the storm.

Or maybe, even better, you could get some good quality double-sided stickers to force your existing rubber mat to lay completely flat. And if it works then you could get a fresh rubber mat at your convenience.

Interesting idea about the tape. Will give it a try and test on an album I don't like. Thanks!

 

[buckeye56]

Yeah, I expect the arm lift platform can be adjusted higher. Look for a screw either vertically oriented near the right end of the curved platform and if it has one, turn the screw counterclockwise a bit. If there is none there, look at the side of the area directly under the lift. If there's one here (potentially a very small allen head), unscrew a bit and lift up on the platform by a couple of mm and retighten.

I can't readily find a manual for your model but pictures of the lift area will help a lot.

Thank you for looking. I have the manual, and actually uploaded the entire thing somewhere in AK. The page below shows the parts. I have adjusted items in 17, 18, 19. Still have a problem. Maybe I should go back and fiddle with them again.

 

[buckeye56]

Well then I'm sure you could find an anti-static mat for not a lot of money. That would help you weather the storm.

Or maybe, even better, you could get some good quality double-sided stickers to force your existing rubber mat to lay completely flat. And if it works then you could get a fresh rubber mat at your convenience.

Will look for another mat, but mine actually has two cut-outs, so may be difficult to find a matching one.

 

[Montycat]

A new mat can be cut to get the holes though it might be tricky to do it nicely.

Yes, 18 shows the screw you adjust to get the clearance shown in 17. Usually in that type there is a spring that pushes the platform up and the screw locks into a cutout shaped like the screw head. You might need to push the platform down so the screw head is exposed and then turn it to have any real effect.

 

[alex213]

but mine actually has two cut-outs

You're right. Apologies for not noticing that earlier. I'm past my bedtime so someone with a clearer head than mine needs to guess why those holes are there. They shouldn't be.

Also, I took the mat off my 1210 mk2 and am holding it up to your pic to compare, they appear identical.

edit: Identical sans holes obviously. For the life of me I can't even come close to guessing why someone would punch those 2 holes in the rubber mat.

 

[Montycat]

You're right. Apologies for not noticing that earlier. I'm past my bedtime so someone with a clearer head than mine needs to guess why those holes are there. They shouldn't be.

Also, I took the mat off my 1210 mk2 and am holding it up to your pic to compare, they appear identical.

edit: Identical sans holes obviously. For the life of me I can't even come close to guessing why someone would punch those 2 holes in the rubber mat.

The holes are there for the record size detector. It sticks up through the hole and is pushed down by 12" records but stays up with 7" ones so the automatic function sets the arm down in the right place.

oops: It's an optical sensor not a mechanical one. There's a light and photocells. The photocell is under the platter and the hole when exposed or not tells the arm where to move. Some others work on a physical lever as I first described. The 2 holes allow for 7, 10 and 12" detection.

 

[alex213]

The holes are there for the record size detector. It sticks up through the hole and is pushed down by 12" records but stays up with 7" ones so the automatic function sets the arm down in the right place.

oops: It's an optical sensor. There's a light and photocell. The photocell is under the platter and the hole when exposed or not tells the arm where to move. Some others work on a physical lever as I first described.

Dear lord, I really need to shut up then. Never in a million years would I have guessed that those 2 holes are from the factory.

 

[buckeye56]

You're right. Apologies for not noticing that earlier. I'm past my bedtime so someone with a clearer head than mine needs to guess why those holes are there. They shouldn't be.

Also, I took the mat off my 1210 mk2 and am holding it up to your pic to compare, they appear identical.

edit: Identical sans holes obviously. For the life of me I can't even come close to guessing why someone would punch those 2 holes in the rubber mat.

Dear lord, I really need to shut up then. Never in a million years would I have guessed that those 2 holes are from the factory.

Lol, you should not shut up. I appreciate the time folks take to help me. Honestly, I forgot myself that I had cutouts in my mat until I was typing my reply to you yesterday. Thanks for your help!

 

[buckeye56]

A new mat can be cut to get the holes though it might be tricky to do it nicely.

Yes, 18 shows the screw you adjust to get the clearance shown in 17. Usually in that type there is a spring that pushes the platform up and the screw locks into a cutout shaped like the screw head. You might need to push the platform down so the screw head is exposed and then turn it to have any real effect.

Er, can I just bring it to you to fix? This is what mine looks like with the adjustments:
Is there something I should adjust, or did you already tell me and I’m not processing it?

 

[buckeye56]

The holes are there for the record size detector. It sticks up through the hole and is pushed down by 12" records but stays up with 7" ones so the automatic function sets the arm down in the right place.

oops: It's an optical sensor not a mechanical one. There's a light and photocells. The photocell is under the platter and the hole when exposed or not tells the arm where to move. Some others work on a physical lever as I first described. The 2 holes allow for 7, 10 and 12" detection.

Yikes, I never knew that, (And why would I need to, in general?)and have owned this TT since ‘80 or ‘81. Fascinating bit of info. So the light is somewhere under the platter or is it the light on the upper left corner of the pic? Always though that was just some sort of strobe. Wow, thank you so much for your time, help, and super informative replies. Can I ask, what is your familiarity with these turntables?

 

[alex213]

or is it the light on the upper left corner of the pic?

Damn, this turntable has caught me off-gaurd!

OK so the light on the upper left is just so you can see what your doing in the dark. Like maybe read the record label or see tracks on the record in case you want to queue up a track. But it's on the opposite side of where I'm used to seeing it! I guess it really doesn't matter as long as it does the job.

Anyway I'm guessing the sensors are in the two rectangles on the platter but we should really wait for Montycat to pop back and tell us for sure. They appear to be where a 7" and 10" would end so...

Anyway, out of curiosity, are those 2 rectangles actually protruding from the platter or are they sunken in? I can't tell from the photos. The one pic without the rubber mat makes me think they are recessed but the pic with the mat makes it look like they fit snugly in the rubber. Because if they are protruding then that is going to limit your mat options (should you need a new one).

 

[buckeye56]

Damn, this turntable has caught me off-gaurd!

OK so the light on the upper left is just so you can see what your doing in the dark. Like maybe read the record label or see tracks on the record in case you want to queue up a track. But it's on the opposite side of where I'm used to seeing it! I guess it really doesn't matter as long as it does the job.

Anyway I'm guessing the sensors are in the two rectangles on the platter but we should really wait for Montycat to pop back and tell us for sure. They appear to be where a 7" and 10" would end so...

Anyway, out of curiosity, are those 2 rectangles actually protruding from the platter or are they sunken in? I can't tell from the photos. The one pic without the rubber mat makes me think they are recessed but the pic with the mat makes it look like they fit snugly in the rubber. Because if they are protruding then that is going to limit your mat options (should you need a new one).

Yeah, I figured the light in the upper left was purely for my visual benefit. And the mat does fit around the cutouts, which, based on what @Montycat wrote, is where the sensors are located, so I’m likely out of luck re. a new mat. Weird, I’ve clicked 3 emojis, none show up in my preview.

 

[Montycat]

I have to retract my retraction. These are mechanical sensors, not optical. The light is just a light. If you remove the mat you will see little levers stick up through the holes. They are held down by larger records so the system knows what size is on the platter.

Some other brands use optical sensors with light shining through the hole.

As for the lift, check visually to see if the tonearm clears it but just barely. If the lift doesn't rise enough the stylus will not clear the record, whether your mat is flat or not. The screw shown here (your pic) can be used to allow the lift go higher. I could be wrong but the screw doesn't look like it's seated in the recess properly (I should not see a shadow of the screw head, it should be flush with the plastic around it). If you turn the screw a small fraction of a turn it might cause the lift to pop up a bit.

 

[buckeye56]

I have to retract my retraction. These are mechanical sensors, not optical. The light is just a light. If you remove the mat you will see little levers stick up through the holes. They are held down by larger records so the system knows what size is on the platter.

Some other brands use optical sensors with light shining through the hole.

As for the lift, check visually to see if the tonearm clears it but just barely. If the lift doesn't rise enough the stylus will not clear the record, whether your mat is flat or not. The screw shown here (your pic) can be used to allow the lift go higher. I could be wrong but the screw doesn't look like it's seated in the recess properly (I should not see a shadow of the screw head, it should be flush with the plastic around it). If you turn the screw a small fraction of a turn it might cause the lift to pop up a bit.

View attachment 2329095

Hope these pics are better…daylight . The screw is already raised pretty high. Is it too high, and what is the correlation between that screw and #19 where the rubber cap is? I adjusted #19 as well. Is the black screw way too high?
I’ve looked closely at the arm upon return and the only time it clears the album is if the mat is removed from the platter. Obvs can’t operate like that. What am I missing here, aside from a bunch of brain cells? Thank you so much. Is it possible to upload a video on AK. I could show you how it doesn’t work.