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Turntable recommendation to compliment my MAC 4100

tk1769

tk1769

Member
Good day all! :)

Just put together my system, a McIntosh MAC 4100 hooked up through Mac XR14's and Acoustic Research AR-2ax speakers (still working on the 3rd pair).

Currently utilizing a Pioneer PL115d turntable with an Audio Technica AT120E cartridge, looking to upgrade this piece, my budget is around $500 (but could go more).

I do have some responses (and background) on my original post looking for speakers HERE.
Thank you all in advance, this newbie appreciates the information you are all willing to share! :music:
 
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I think your falling into a trap of "I have a few bucks lets spend it on something" and call it a upgrade, or "how much stuff can I buy and plug into one box"

I have a question for you, well two of them.

Are you looking to build one system with the best sound quality you can afford?

Are you infatuated with buying and trying old gear and enjoy the hunt?

And welcome to AK
 
4-2-7 said:
I think your falling into a trap of "I have a few bucks lets spend it on something" and call it a upgrade, or "how much stuff can I buy and plug into one box"

I have a question for you, well two of them.

Are you looking to build one system with the best sound quality you can afford?

Are you infatuated with buying and trying old gear and enjoy the hunt?

And welcome to AK
Click to expand...

thank you, and the answer to your two secondary questions is 'somewhat' and 'probably', respectively...:smoke:

as far as "I have a few bucks lets spend it on something" ~ and call it a upgrade, no
and to "how much stuff can I buy and plug into one box" ~ a definitive no

i'm new to this, and realize (just recently, obviously) there is a massive market for this type of gear...the fact i've been doing modern live sound and studio production for over a decade has also lent a hand in the fact i aspire to 'continue to train my ears', and at times get back to the basics...that and i've had a huge fascination with vinyl since the first time i put a needle to buddy holly on a 30's(ish) victrola at the ripe age of 5 (maybe 6)...
 
i would sit on the money, perhaps grow your stash, research your options until the right deal/estate sale/armed robbery comes along.
 
woofmytweets said:
i would sit on the money, perhaps grow your stash, research your options until the right deal/estate sale/armed robbery comes along.
Click to expand...

i've got what i want right now for an amp & speakers, and maybe if the table i have now will suffice that's fine, just feel it is the weak link currently...
 
tk1769 said:
i've got what i want right now for an amp & speakers, and maybe if the table i have now will suffice that's fine, just feel it is the weak link currently...
Click to expand...

The tables not that bad and your not going to get a whole lot better for 500 bucks. However if you put a $500 cartridge on it it will sound better than most peoples $2000 tables that have a hard time spending that kind of money on a cartridge.

Then the fact if your looking at having a bunch of so so speakers instead of one great pair the cartridge could just be a wast anyway.

I personally think your table is a good looking match for the 1400. Put a really good cart on it and buy high quality records along with some fine studio monitors and you'll have a very nice receiver based system.
 
I have a MAC 4100 receiver in a secondary system. It is a great sounding and well built unit. It will serve you well for years to come. It also has two phono inputs so you can test and compare your Pioneer PL115d against another turntable in your own system.

As far as turntables go, I am partial to the Systemdek IIX which can be found for way under $500. Systemdek's are fantastic turntables. I also like AR XA's for their simplicity. Marc Morin can upgrade one for you and keep it under the $500 mark. Please note both are belt driven and fully manual.
 
If I was trying to build a nice system with the Mac 1400 being the heart of it, I would use one pair of speakers. The following can be had for the price you'll be paying for three sets of speakers

Like the JBL L100, 4311, 4312 or something in that range of the JBL line.

JBL 41.jpg

Then put a high output moving coil cartridge on your table for now. A very good cartridge will give you way more bang than buying another table that cost around $500.

Dynavector, Sumiko or Denon

dynavector-10x5-moving-coil.gif 1291474440_bluepoint_special_01.jpg

You can find some very nice cartridges even used and save some money. This should make your system pretty awesome and then save up and wait for a really good deal on a table that might cost you $1500+ but was a $2500-$3000 deck when bought new.

But let me also remind you of the quality of records, they are not all equal, and one title can have numerus masterings and pressings and then the condition of used.
 
4-2-7 said:
The tables not that bad and your not going to get a whole lot better for 500 bucks. However if you put a $500 cartridge on it it will sound better than most peoples $2000 tables that have a hard time spending that kind of money on a cartridge.
Click to expand...

I used to think the same thing, but after many years of listening to a collection of high and low-end turntables and cartridges, I've come to realize that the turntable is just as, if not more important than the cartridge.

A mediocre turntable will limit the performance of a high quality cartridge.
 
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malden said:
I used to think the same thing, but after many years of listening to a collection of high and low-end turntables and cartridges, I've come to realize that the turntable is just as, if not more important than the cartridge.

A mediocre turntable will limit the performance of a high quality cartridge.
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Well we all know about opinions.
However there is a limit to everything like the OPs budget, the limit is bring the table to the limit. The cartridge is the way to do that and if more people understood this the better. I used to spend a ton of money chasing SQ but until my cartridges got better I never found it.

I have no problem putting $500+ cartridges on sub $400 tables, 90% of them will out perform a $1500 table with a $100 cart on them.
 
4-2-7 said:
If I was trying to build a nice system with the Mac 1400 being the heart of it, I would use one pair of speakers. The following can be had for the price you'll be paying for three sets of speakers

Like the JBL L100, 4311, 4312 or something in that range of the JBL line.

View attachment 937876

Then put a high output moving coil cartridge on your table for now. A very good cartridge will give you way more bang than buying another table that cost around $500.

Dynavector, Sumiko or Denon

View attachment 937882 View attachment 937883

You can find some very nice cartridges even used and save some money. This should make your system pretty awesome and then save up and wait for a really good deal on a table that might cost you $1500+ but was a $2500-$3000 deck when bought new.

But let me also remind you of the quality of records, they are not all equal, and one title can have numerus masterings and pressings and then the condition of used.
Click to expand...

Just missed a really nice set of JBL's locally, they are exactly what I am looking for to complete my a/b/c set-up...thanks for the reply.
 
You have a decent turntable now. I agree with the others that the best way to improve it is to get a better cartridge. I recently switched to an Ortofon Super OM 40 and I'm very pleased with the sound quality. The JBL speakers recommended above are great speakers. Keep waiting for another pair to show up. I have a pair of JBL L100s connected to my basement system. I do turntable repairs and when people come to pickup their repaired turntable I demonstrate it connected to my Pioneer SX-1980 driving the JBLs. People are amazed at how great their turntable sounds but I remind them that what they are hearing is a great pair of speakers which makes the most difference in sound quality. A few of my customers have even located a pair of JBL L100s on Craigslist to add to their own system.
 
4-2-7 said:
Well we all know about opinions.
However there is a limit to everything like the OPs budget, the limit is bring the table to the limit. The cartridge is the way to do that and if more people understood this the better. I used to spend a ton of money chasing SQ but until my cartridges got better I never found it.

I have no problem putting $500+ cartridges on sub $400 tables, 90% of them will out perform a $1500 table with a $100 cart on them.
Click to expand...

Yes, I expressed my opinion. I don't agree with yours.
 
Here is my opinion / 2 cents of advise:

SELL / TRADE (on AK/BT or other channels)
- Turntable w/ cartridge
- Current Speakers

BUY / TRADE:
- Thorens TD-320, 318, 160, 147, 166 in reconditioned condition
- Cartridge - Denon DL 110 or even better low use DL-160 HOMC
- JBL L Series such as 112, 96, 166, 100
(Also make sure you have now or add)
- Good Low Capacitance Phono Cables
- Good LP & Stylus Cleaning Accessories
- Good Speaker Cables

McIntosh / Thorens / Denon / JBL match up very nicely. Good luck with your setup!
 
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Question, where you you experts place a Rotel RP-2500 in the hierarchy of tables?

Reason I ask is I have an opportunity to get one (along with 380 buld lp's to be sifted through) locally.

Thank you all! :music:
 
4-2-7 said:
Well we all know about opinions.
However there is a limit to everything like the OPs budget, the limit is bring the table to the limit. The cartridge is the way to do that and if more people understood this the better. I used to spend a ton of money chasing SQ but until my cartridges got better I never found it.

I have no problem putting $500+ cartridges on sub $400 tables, 90% of them will out perform a $1500 table with a $100 cart on them.
Click to expand...

I'd have to agree here. Most of the time a $500 cartridge will outperform a $50 cartridge on a $1,500 table though I've found it really does come down to the quality of the table.

A low end table will let all sorts of noise into the recording, may have timing and pace issues etc. So long as the table is competent then the cartridge and phono stage will have a greater impact on sound.

My system was held back by phono stage choice as one point. Once I receive my S.A.M. Aldebaran table / Calista II arm it just might be again. Then again, capacitor and resistor upgrades might fix that. Trick is to balance your components as best you can and try eliminate any bottlenecks ;)
 
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