Upgrade from Sony DVP-NC555ES?

[KeithD]

I've got two of these players in different systems, and like them. But, lately I've been thinking about "upgrading" to a better player in my main audio only system. Required to work with my vintage audio systems are a player with multichannel analog outputs and ability to play CDs and SACDs. I've been looking at some of the Sony single disk DVP players of that time, but wonder if they are essentially the same, just with single disk capability rather than the 5 disk carousel? Specifically, I was looking at Sony DVP-NS900V and DVP-NS999ES. Seems like the 999ES may be the same player, just single disk? Would I hear any differences between these single disk players and my 555ES?

Have also been looking at CD/SACD players without DVD/video capabilities. Some very high end ones in the Sony line such as SCD-XA777ES and SCD-XA9000ES, with prices to match. Then there are carousel CD/SACD players such as: Sony SCD-CE595, and SCD-C555ES, which are far less expensive than the single disk players. There may be others that i am missing. Do people have experience with SCD players and compared them to DVP players mentioned above? Is there an audible difference, and is it worth the much higher price of the single disk SCD players?

Other brands I've not mentioned that are worth looking at? I do have an Oppo DV-980H, but as that has been set to be a universal DVD player, I only use it for our region 2 DVDs. Would the Oppo be much better than the Sonys? I could cerainly do some comparison listening.

Thanks for any input/advice/guidance.

 

[duncan]

Commenting on only part of your post - going by the schematics, the nc555es and ns999es do appear to be essentially identical from an audio standpoint, even if they don't use exactly the same analog output board. I own a couple of 999 players and have noted that in their stock state, the multichannel outputs have better detail than the 2-channel outputs. Some 2 channel listeners can essentially "upgrade" the ns999es (and presumably the nc555es, for the same reason) by simply moving their cables from the 2-channel jacks to the multichannel front jacks and configuring the player to stereo. I mention that for the sake of others who come across the thread, but it seems you already listen in multichannel and it wouldn't apply to you.

I've owned the ns900v too. IMO it's slightly superior to the ns999es at the 2-channel output, but slightly inferior at the multichannel outputs. Part of what makes the 900 so popular here is the bang-for-buck factor, at typical used prices relative to the 555 and 999. For you I don't expect it would be an upgrade.

 

[KeithD]

Commenting on only part of your post - going by the schematics, the nc555es and ns999es do appear to be essentially identical from an audio standpoint, even if they don't use exactly the same analog output board. I own a couple of 999 players and have noted that in their stock state, the multichannel outputs have better detail than the 2-channel outputs. Some 2 channel listeners can essentially "upgrade" the ns999es (and presumably the nc555es, for the same reason) by simply moving their cables from the 2-channel jacks to the multichannel front jacks and configuring the player to stereo. I mention that for the sake of others who come across the thread, but it seems you already listen in multichannel and it wouldn't apply to you.

I've owned the ns900v too. IMO it's slightly superior to the ns999es at the 2-channel output, but slightly inferior at the multichannel outputs. Part of what makes the 900 so popular here is the bang-for-buck factor, at typical used prices relative to the 555 and 999. For you I don't expect it would be an upgrade.

Great! Thanks for that insight and comparison between those players. I do use the NC555ES for both multichannel SACDs and regular CDs. I've only got a couple 2 channel SACDs. These days, it seems the NS999ES and NS900V are about the same price. One thing I did look at though is images of the interiors of these two units. The NS999ES seems to have a "beefier" build inside (more metal vs. plastic components). I don't need the changer aspect of the 555, but it is convenient, and what I found at the time I bought the two I have. I have not compared the 555 with 999/900 at the component level, but it does make sense the 555 and 999 would be substantially the same. I've wondered what came after these two players from SONY? Were these the last DVP ES units to play SACD format and have multichannel analog outputs? I have not come across at timeline of Sony products yet.

Still would be nice to hear some opinions on the SCD players with respect to SQ vs. DVP players with SACD capability. I've see a couple opinions in one thread that the SCD-XA777ES is good for SACD, but not so good for redbook CD with respect to SQ.

 

[duncan]

You're definitely right about the beefiness. The ns999es is a beast compared to the ns900v in terms of rigidity and heft. Also it has an extra shielding plate bolted to the bottom of the audio board (maybe this is true of the nc555es as well?).

There were a couple of other ES players after these, that I know of anyway: the ns3100es and ns9100es, both single-disc models. Haven't been as tempted to pick one up because there don't seem to be very many around in working condition, I don't think replacement optical pickups are readily available for them like they are for the earlier players, and the audio boards are built with mostly surface mount components, which for me makes them a little harder to think about for repairs or modifications.

 

[KeithD]

I took the cover off the DVP-NC555ES tonight to see what's inside. It has a two level structure. The audio board and the power supply/transformer are on the top mounted to a metal tray that sits over the disc carousel and the other boards.


Unscrewing that tray and lifting it up reveals the carousel and the other boards, one of which seems to have the DSD processor.


Comparing pictures of the insides of an NS900V and NS999ES, without knowing dimensions of each it's hard for me to tell if there are compromises in the 555 to accommodate the large carousel.

Some things that are apparent from internet pictures: NS999ES and NC555ES have the same back panel with the same connections in the same locations. Front plate looks very similar, though remotes are different. The 555 is made in Malaysia while the 999 was made in Japan. However, they both have selectors on the back for different interlace modes, and a selector for different channels for the remote.

The NS9000ES was made in Japan, but the NS9100ES and NS3100ES were both made in Malaysia, so it seems these units bridge a time span where Sony was transitioning production out of Japan. The big drawback to the 9000 is that it is stereo only (no multichannel audio outputs). The 9100 and 3100 have multichannel analog outputs and HDMI output. As you said, the 9100 is quite pricey, but the 3100 is fairly reasonable. I could not find any pictures of the internals of the 3100, so hard to say what's in there that's different from the 9100.

Of course, one notices a really big difference in build when looking at pictures of the internals of an SCD-XA777ES and other SCD-XA models. Makes me wonder what else Sony did in there with the SCD models, and can you hear the difference?

 

[duncan]

There's some beauty in that design. The separate switched-mode power supply is used for disc transport and video, but the audio board gets its own transformer and linear supply. That big stamped metal sheet between the layers of electronics would seem to provide shielding like what's under the 999's audio board. Very nice.

The funny thing is in the upper right where you see the four op-amps of the audio output stages. The three with the beefy Silmic coupler silos above them provide the multichannel outputs. The one on the far right is for the 2-channel outs. Sony clearly squeezed some shekels there - dirt-cheap 4558 opamp, very generic coupling caps, and most of the small film caps around the opamp are demoted to a cheaper type too. But with a few exceptions, those are all through-the-hole components and there's pretty good spacing, so modders have latitude for building that stage out to their liking without needing neurosurgical skill.

I too am interested in how the audio-only ES models sound. There are a few opinions posted here and there but what do those people know? I certainly hope my own subjective impressions aren't taken too seriously by anyone.

 

[KeithD]

Interesting about the outputs of the multichannel vs. stereo. Fortunately, on this model, if one is playing a two channel CD, the signal is sent to both the two channel outputs and the Front L/R outputs of the multichannel connectors. In that case, do you know if the stereo signals still sent through the two channel op-amps, or are are they sent through the better multi-channel circuit? On the Sony SCD-XA777ES the signal is not sent to both outputs such that stereo only goes to the two channel outputs. So, you need separate connections to your amp for each type of media you're playing. Looking at the 555 manual, it appears the two channel stereo outputs are only for connecting a TV or amp that has only two channel inputs.

I don't know if you've seen this, but found this last night. If you search for the DVP-NS999ES on Sony's site, one of the things that comes up other than the manuals and warranty info is what they call a Technical Manual. It's a 53 page document giving a bit of a history of Sony's DVD player development and then a deep dive detailed, technical explanation of the similarities and differences between the NS999ES, NC555ES, and CX777ES. Reading through the document it becomes quite clear NS999ES is the flagship in that series, getting all the "extra" engineering to improve video and audio quality over the other two. So, one can see the compromises that were made in the 555 and 777 by what was left out.

Will do some searching to see if I can find something similar for the SCD models...

 

[cpt_paranoia]

a Technical Manual. It's a 53 page document giving a bit of a history of Sony's DVD player development and then a deep dive detailed, technical explanation

From a quick skim, that looks a rather nice primer.

 

[Sgt Shultz]

I've got two of these players in different systems, and like them. But, lately I've been thinking about "upgrading" to a better player in my main audio only system. Required to work with my vintage audio systems are a player with multichannel analog outputs and ability to play CDs and SACDs. I've been looking at some of the Sony single disk DVP players of that time, but wonder if they are essentially the same, just with single disk capability rather than the 5 disk carousel? Specifically, I was looking at Sony DVP-NS900V and DVP-NS999ES. Seems like the 999ES may be the same player, just single disk? Would I hear any differences between these single disk players and my 555ES?

Have also been looking at CD/SACD players without DVD/video capabilities. Some very high end ones in the Sony line such as SCD-XA777ES and SCD-XA9000ES, with prices to match. Then there are carousel CD/SACD players such as: Sony SCD-CE595, and SCD-C555ES, which are far less expensive than the single disk players. There may be others that i am missing. Do people have experience with SCD players and compared them to DVP players mentioned above? Is there an audible difference, and is it worth the much higher price of the single disk SCD players?

Other brands I've not mentioned that are worth looking at? I do have an Oppo DV-980H, but as that has been set to be a universal DVD player, I only use it for our region 2 DVDs. Would the Oppo be much better than the Sonys? I could cerainly do some comparison listening.

Thanks for any input/advice/guidance.

I have two DVP NS900V decks (both black), one DVP NS999ES (in silver), and one DVP CX777ES (also in silver), the 900 is my favorite, would like one in silver but they're at a premium. Purchased these about 8yrs ago none over $80, all still work flawlessly.

The 999 I use with the Kenny silver stack in the bedroom, the 900 in the media rm with all the black face equipment, the big carousel is in the living rm getting the most use.

If not familiar with these decks you need to look into the menu for the "attenuator", this will lower the output to a more friendly level with less distortion for 2-channel listening, especially with older gear.



There's been mention of the big carousels eating discs, I can see that happening if the belts are worn, new belts were $12 and easy enough to change in that cavernous interior.

It doesn't hurt that these are all such great looking decks to match their SQ.

Sony DVP NS900V (still want one in silver)


Sony DVP NS999ES


Sony DVP CX777ES

If you like the big carousel keep in mind it's HUGE and will need some real estate.

As for which sounds the best, my vinyl lol.

 

[KeithD]

From a quick skim, that looks a rather nice primer.

Yeah, that's a neat document that is only found in the list of manuals for the DVP-NS999ES even though it covers the other multi-disc units. Seems Sony was quite proud of their achievement with that line of DVP players. It'd be neat to find a similar document for the SCD players and/or the next generation of DVP players (NS9100ES/NS3100ES).

 

[duncan]

do you know if the stereo signals still sent through the two channel op-amps, or are are they sent through the better multi-channel circuit?

The op-amps are tied to their respective jacks. So yes, when you're listening via the multichannel front jacks to 2-channel material, it's going through the better output stage.

 

[KeithD]

The op-amps are tied to their respective jacks. So yes, when you're listening via the multichannel front jacks to 2-channel material, it's going through the better output stage.

Interesting, makes me wonder why they even bothered having stereo outputs if the Front L/R carries the 2 channel signal if that's what's playing. In the user manual for both 555 and 999 they show four possible configurations for audio connections. None of them show connecting the 5.1 analog connectors and the analog stereo connectors to an amp.

 

[Bill Ferris]

I have two DVP NS900V decks (both black), one DVP NS999ES (in silver), and one DVP CX777ES (also in silver), the 900 is my favorite, would like one in silver but they're at a premium. Purchased these about 8yrs ago none over $80, all still work flawlessly.

The 999 I use with the Kenny silver stack in the bedroom, the 900 in the media rm with all the black face equipment, the big carousel is in the living rm getting the most use.

If not familiar with these decks you need to look into the menu for the "attenuator", this will lower the output to a more friendly level with less distortion for 2-channel listening, especially with older gear.

View attachment 3048972

There's been mention of the big carousels eating discs, I can see that happening if the belts are worn, new belts were $12 and easy enough to change in that cavernous interior.

It doesn't hurt that these are all such great looking decks to match their SQ.

Sony DVP NS900V (still want one in silver)
View attachment 3048958

Sony DVP NS999ES
View attachment 3048959

Sony DVP CX777ES
View attachment 3048960
If you like the big carousel keep in mind it's HUGE and will need some real estate.

As for which sounds the best, my vinyl lol.

I really loved my gifted 777 (black) w/remote for the 5 yrs. of 24/7365 use until the laser died over night during a hurricane.
And that`s when I made the reluctant choice to start WAV. ripping all my CDs and not ever being dependent again on electromechanical/optical playback based players for my all day music desires.

I`ll have take folks word on the player`s analog output SQ, since I only used the S/PDIF coax output, because of the location of the player in my sunroom for no where else to physically place that big boy in my adjoining living room where my master source/control A/V rack resides, and concerns of the length of the analog L/R cables required, plus concerns of possible ground loops caused by that analog signal connections.