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Using Mac 1700 In Japan

J

joshualizer

New Member
Hello. I'm new here.

I moved to Japan from USA recently and I brought my McIntosh Mac 1700 and some KLH Model 17s with me (I bought a Japanese turntable here)

When I listen to music through the aux like bluetooth etc, it sounds great. But when I listen to records I notice it's pretty loud and it feels slightly distorted to my ear.

I was looking at the specs and I realized that the Mac 1700 says it requires 117v. And Japan is 100v. Could this be the culprit?

I've seen some people asking about step up voltage transformers . Could that be a potential solve and also is there one anyone can recommend?

Thanks in advance!
Josh
 
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62caddy said:
Apparently the AC can either be 60 Hz or 50 Hz depending on location in Japan. That may pose more of an issue than the reduced voltage. I would suggest checking with Audio Classics.
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Thanks! Hmm yeah I’m in Tokyo and that’s 50hz. I just checked the manual and looks like it says it’s rated for 50hz/60hz. So hopefully it’s ok….

Is Audio classics the company in NY?
 
joshualizer said:
Thanks! Hmm yeah I’m in Tokyo and that’s 50hz. I just checked the manual and looks like it says it’s rated for 50hz/60hz. So hopefully it’s ok….

Is Audio classics the company in NY?
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Yes Vestal, NY.

I can’t see much harm from the lower voltage except output power may be reduced somewhat. You might want to post your question on the FB page “Vintage McIntosh” where Ken Zelin is usually active. He’s a McIntosh engineer and very helpful.
 
Hi Josh,

Welcome to Tokyo. Generally speaking I’ve run most of my {foreign} contemporary solid state gear on 100 V/50hz but for old gear and tubed gear I either use a stepup trans or my variac. Primarily the reason is because voltage regulation mostly doesn’t exist in older or tubed gear. If you look at the circuitry, it’s basically a rectifier (very basic at that to boot) and a few filter caps. No voltage regulation usually. You can get the stepup trans or a variac on Amazon rather cheaply. Variacs are called voltage sliders in Japan btw.

Also, I would like to add, since you were looking for recommendations on transformers – don’t knowingly buy anything Chinese on Amazon. There’s tons of it. Probably, I would get a Swallow (Japanese) brand. I have a Swallow SU-1000 which gives me multiple voltages so I can use European/UK gear. The 1000 is about ¥30,000.

And one more reason to use a transformer with tubed gear in Japan - there is always a filter capacitor on the primary side of the power transformer in your vintage audio gear. If that capacitor blows (shorts) it can potentially expose you to 100 V house current. Normally in America that wouldn’t be a huge problem because the ground path helps tripping the breaker. However, in Japan, they have very dubious ungrounded electrical distribution systems. That together is another big discussion, but the take away is that a step up transformer will provide you with isolation, as well as a breaker local to your outlet.

Hope this helps. Let me know if you need further information.
—Brett
 
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VoltMan said:
Hi Josh,

Welcome to Tokyo. Generally speaking I’ve run most of my {foreign} contemporary solid state gear on 100 V/50hz but for old gear and tubed gear I either use a stepup trans or my variac. Primarily the reason is because voltage regulation mostly doesn’t exist in older or tubed gear. If you look at the circuitry, it’s basically a rectifier (very basic at that to boot) and a few filter caps. No voltage regulation usually. You can get the stepup trans or a variac on Amazon rather cheaply. Variacs are called voltage sliders in Japan btw.

Also, I would like to add, since you were looking for recommendations on transformers – don’t knowingly buy anything Chinese on Amazon. There’s tons of it. Probably, I would get a Swallow (Japanese) brand. I have a Swallow SU-1000 which gives me multiple voltages so I can use European/UK gear. The 1000 is about ¥30,000.

And one more reason to use a transformer with tubed gear in Japan - there is always a filter capacitor on the primary side of the power transformer in your vintage audio gear. If that capacitor blows (shorts) it can potentially expose you to 100 V house current. Normally in America that wouldn’t be a huge problem because the ground path helps tripping the breaker. However, in Japan, they have very dubious ungrounded electrical distribution systems. That together is another big discussion, but the take away is that a step up transformer will provide you with isolation, as well as a breaker local to your outlet.

Hope this helps. Let me know if you need further information.
—Brett
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Brett this is awesome. Thanks so much. I’m going to take your advice and try the transformer. For all the reasons you mentioned.

And I’ll make sure to find a quality one such as the one you recommend! Thanks a lot.

Yeah I’ve been having some weird stuff going on with my integrated amp. It’s fine if I use the aux and just pass signal through it but when I use the phono side w my record player it just sounds really weird and distorted and it bothers the heck out of me.
 
Josh, one thing I failed to say is that a transformer may not fix your phono input issue in the end, but it definitely gets your 1700 back into its design envelope for the power supply, and subsequently the bias supply for your tube stages. When dealing with phono inputs you have to be especially careful with grounding the turntable signal path to the preamp input at minimum, and if you’re using a moving coil (MC) you also might need a matching signal transformer. Do you know what type of cartridge you have?

Regardless the phono issue I still recommend a transformer btw. 100v is still 1/6th less voltage compared to 120v.
 
62caddy said:
Only the tuner section of the MAC1700 is tube.
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This changes everything :D. Thanks 62caddy! A glance at the schematic looks like RF/IF/DET run on tubes, and unregulated PS, but all the audio is solid state ( just WOW!) and runs regulated by a zener. What a Frankenstein.

So Josh your pre and main amplifier stages are solid state - only the tuner section is tube. Makes an a** of me for ass-uming :rolleyes:. Maybe now though you’ll hear a bit less “warmth” … “symphonic clarity” and “etherial presence” though now knowing it’s coming from cold hard silicon.

Sorry for backtracking but the transformer is less likely to have an effect on your phono input issue. Still great for isolation and a breaker, but that’s another story.
 
VoltMan said:
This changes everything :D. Thanks 62caddy! A glance at the schematic looks like RF/IF/DET run on tubes, and unregulated PS, but all the audio is solid state ( just WOW!) and runs regulated by a zener. What a Frankenstein.

So Josh your pre and main amplifier stages are solid state - only the tuner section is tube. Makes an a** of me for ass-uming :rolleyes:. Maybe now though you’ll hear a bit less “warmth” … “symphonic clarity” and “etherial presence” though now knowing it’s coming from cold hard silicon.
Click to expand...

McIntosh had a few hybrid models in the past- the MA230 integrated, MAC1500 & MAC1700 come to mind. After many decades of absence, McIntosh has incorporated hybrid design in a number of current units in recent years. I don’t know if that makes them “Frankensteins” but they’re all well regarded components.
 
VoltMan said:
This changes everything :D. Thanks 62caddy! A glance at the schematic looks like RF/IF/DET run on tubes, and unregulated PS, but all the audio is solid state ( just WOW!) and runs regulated by a zener. What a Frankenstein.

So Josh your pre and main amplifier stages are solid state - only the tuner section is tube. Makes an a** of me for ass-uming :rolleyes:. Maybe now though you’ll hear a bit less “warmth” … “symphonic clarity” and “etherial presence” though now knowing it’s coming from cold hard silicon.

Sorry for backtracking but the transformer is less likely to have an effect on your phono input issue. Still great for isolation and a breaker, but that’s another story.
Click to expand...
Hmmm so does that mean Mac1700 might be fine w 100v?

Also I have a Denon300f that I put an Ortofon Red cartridge on. I wonder if that could have something to do w it ?
 
joshualizer said:
Hmmm so does that mean Mac1700 might be fine w 100v?

Also I have a Denon300f that I put an Ortofon Red cartridge on. I wonder if that could have something to do w it ?
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Yes it means it could be fine without a step up transformer. I was under the incorrect assumption that it was pure tube. Your receiver only has tubes in the tuner, which can’t receive any stations in Japan anyway.

Is the Ortofon a 2M? If so that’s a moving magnet (MM) which should be fine. They also have a marbled red moving coil though. That could be problematic without a moving coil stage. Check your grounding between the Denon and Mac.
 
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VoltMan said:
Yes it means it could be fine without a step up transformer. I was under the incorrect assumption that it was pure tube. Your receiver only has tubes in the tuner, which can’t receive any stations in Japan anyway.

Is the Ortofon a 2M? If so that’s a moving magnet (MM) which should be fine. They also have a marbled red moving coil though. That could be problematic without a moving coil stage. Check your grounding between the Denon and Mac.
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Yes it’s just the Ortofon Red 2m which is moving magnet I believe. But I’m not sure if that’s the culprit if it’s giving too much volume for the preamp. I need to troubleshoot and try it with some powered speakers or somewhere else to see if it’s distorting other sources maybe….

Because for example I play Spotify through Bluetooth into my aux input on my mac1700 and it sounds great and very clean. Only when I play records is it kind of slightly overdrive sounding. I really tried to align the cartridge properly as well with a protractor mat I purchased so I don’t think that’s the issue ….
 
joshualizer said:
Yes it’s just the Ortofon Red 2m which is moving magnet I believe. But I’m not sure if that’s the culprit if it’s giving too much volume for the preamp. I need to troubleshoot and try it with some powered speakers or somewhere else to see if it’s distorting other sources maybe….

Because for example I play Spotify through Bluetooth into my aux input on my mac1700 and it sounds great and very clean. Only when I play records is it kind of slightly overdrive sounding. I really tried to align the cartridge properly as well with a protractor mat I purchased so I don’t think that’s the issue ….
Click to expand...
Try plugging your Denon directly into AUX because it may have a built in preamp and RIAA EQ.
 
62caddy said:
McIntosh had a few hybrid models in the past- the MA230 integrated, MAC1500 & MAC1700 come to mind. After many decades of absence, McIntosh has incorporated hybrid design in a number of current units in recent years. I don’t know if that makes them “Frankensteins” but they’re all well regarded components.
Click to expand...
I just found it odd that it would have a transistor output stage from a company that marketed tube amps as superior. If I lived in the USA I’d love to have one because tube FM receivers are fun to align.
 
Josh, this is the “upgrade” Tokyo Electric gave me for 200v. Typical in Japan. You’ll find worse examples.

200v/50Hz 75A. It’s enough to fry an elephant. Note the loose ground reference hanging below it. It’s the biggest reason I like my own transformer.

IMG_9921.jpeg
 
VoltMan said:
I just found it odd that it would have a transistor output stage from a company that marketed tube amps as superior. If I lived in the USA I’d love to have one because tube FM receivers are fun to align.
Click to expand...
I don’t recall McIntosh marketing tube amps as superior. McIntosh migrated from tubes to solid-state in the ‘60s, just like everyone else, but has since added back several tube and tube-hybrid offerings mainly because the market is buying tubes as well as solid-state, but has never stated that they are superior just an alternative.
 
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