I am recording straight from my pioneer SA 9800/mcs 6700 tt (new stylus) combo to my pc using xitel, inport plug and play hardware. Is it possible to alter the recorded sound with the amp? If not, can the wav.file be altered (bass treble, volume) with the msn media player when music is downloaded to the cd? What I would like to do is add more bass and increase the volume. I used auto-leveling on the first take since I found clipping occuring at very low recording levels. Appreciate any help.
Vinyl to PC Recording
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tasha
Active Member
You could alter the bass and treble with an equalizer in the system, maybe? But my suggestion is to let the next playback unit (car CD, component system, computer audio) be the point of alteration. I'm not familiar with the software or plug n play devise you're using. I snagged a copy of Cool Edit Pro a few years back off eBay and use the native sound card in my computer for audio work. There are many adjustments for all sorts of effects once it is digital in Cool Edit. Another choice that I'm not familiar with is Audacity (open source freeware at SourceForge). I've just never used it.
I wouldn't be using auto leveling at all. More than likely that is where your clipping originating. I've done very low level input (via control panel>sound>record level) with excellent results. In the end, before making a final copy, I do have to boost the audio levels. But zero clipping has occurred to me at very low levels and I can control the amount of db boosting so that high end clipping doesn't happen.
OMG, that deviant Microsoft player! That's all I would use it for -- playback only. The last time I tried anything else was burning a CD. I felt like I was on a trip from Chicago to New York with stop overs in Omaha and Miami. Disc burning works very well with Nero. I've made about a hundred or so that way. You could try out winamp or audio catalyst. I just found a copy of Realtek player on my computer. It does have a 10 band equalizer on it. Must have come with the motherboard on the last rebuild.
Well, that's my ten cents worth...
I wouldn't be using auto leveling at all. More than likely that is where your clipping originating. I've done very low level input (via control panel>sound>record level) with excellent results. In the end, before making a final copy, I do have to boost the audio levels. But zero clipping has occurred to me at very low levels and I can control the amount of db boosting so that high end clipping doesn't happen.
OMG, that deviant Microsoft player! That's all I would use it for -- playback only. The last time I tried anything else was burning a CD. I felt like I was on a trip from Chicago to New York with stop overs in Omaha and Miami. Disc burning works very well with Nero. I've made about a hundred or so that way. You could try out winamp or audio catalyst. I just found a copy of Realtek player on my computer. It does have a 10 band equalizer on it. Must have come with the motherboard on the last rebuild.
Well, that's my ten cents worth...
It sounds like something is wrong with your set up. Further details regarding equipment and how everything is hooked up would help. Are you using an RIAA phono preamp, the phono section of an amp/receiver, a built in RIAA preamp in the turntable, or do you have the turntable connected directly to the PC soundcard without benefit of RIAA preamplification?
tasha
Active Member
cactuscowboy has a good point to make. Given the fact you're working with vintage equipment, there is a possibility that the internal magnetic cartridge pre-amp in your Pioneer has some problems. The least expensive way to check that out is to find a Radio Shack and pick up an external magnetic cartridge pre-amp. The link to the product is http://www.radioshack.com/product/i...r=1&kw=preamp&origkw=preamp&parentPage=search . You might even find another small electronics shop that could beat the $30 price at the shack. Or if you have time to surf around there are several on-line dealers with this product. It looks like you've got at least two rat shacks for shopping.
This external preamp setup will take you directly from the turntable to the external preamp and then into the computer sound card. You might not even have to record anything at all. Mine automatically starts feeding signal, as soon as the audio card loads, to the cheap home theater system hooked up to my computer's audio out. This might also give you another perspective on how you want to set up the recording work flow. And if there is a problem with the Pioneer's magnetic cartridge preamp, you've got something to work with until you can repair the Pioneer.
Also experiment with how your computer will do this job. Now that you think the mute button is the culprit, try another short recording session. Check out how it sounds. Then move on in diagnosing what is right or wrong. Try this one first before taking a trip to the store.
I also skipped a few steps on the record level on your sound card. It should be done by going to Control Panel>Sounds>Audio Tab in that window and look at Default Device under that listing is Volume> Options> Properties then check off recording. The window changes to the recording view. Look at the Line-In levels and adjust if needed.
This external preamp setup will take you directly from the turntable to the external preamp and then into the computer sound card. You might not even have to record anything at all. Mine automatically starts feeding signal, as soon as the audio card loads, to the cheap home theater system hooked up to my computer's audio out. This might also give you another perspective on how you want to set up the recording work flow. And if there is a problem with the Pioneer's magnetic cartridge preamp, you've got something to work with until you can repair the Pioneer.
Also experiment with how your computer will do this job. Now that you think the mute button is the culprit, try another short recording session. Check out how it sounds. Then move on in diagnosing what is right or wrong. Try this one first before taking a trip to the store.
I also skipped a few steps on the record level on your sound card. It should be done by going to Control Panel>Sounds>Audio Tab in that window and look at Default Device under that listing is Volume> Options> Properties then check off recording. The window changes to the recording view. Look at the Line-In levels and adjust if needed.
Thanks guys! Ok I had better share all the facts. As stated sources are:
Pioneer SA 9800 amp with MCS 6700(stylus has 3 hours on it.)
Hook up to amp tape 1 plug with 30 ft of studio grade RCA audio cable to
Digital interface inport - from there 5 ft. of usb cable to PC usb port.
CD is Memorex CD-R 52X, 700MB, 80 min.
Music source is a 43 year old radio copy of James Brown, "It's a Mother", Starday-King Record. Clean lp in good condition with no scratches but some popping.
Here is my problem which after thinking about it may not be my problem at all. I recorded this for a professional DJ of 40 yrs. The cd plays very well on my home system and in my car's premium sound system. The cd was mailed to Los Angelas and the DJ stated that it is playing at low volumn with no bass and treble on his system. Not sure of source he is using but believe it to be of high quality. I guess I had better ask some questions. The deal I have is that if I record his lp he will give me the lp. By the way his name is Johnny Mathias but he has to remind everyone that he is not the gay one!
Pioneer SA 9800 amp with MCS 6700(stylus has 3 hours on it.)
Hook up to amp tape 1 plug with 30 ft of studio grade RCA audio cable to
Digital interface inport - from there 5 ft. of usb cable to PC usb port.
CD is Memorex CD-R 52X, 700MB, 80 min.
Music source is a 43 year old radio copy of James Brown, "It's a Mother", Starday-King Record. Clean lp in good condition with no scratches but some popping.
Here is my problem which after thinking about it may not be my problem at all. I recorded this for a professional DJ of 40 yrs. The cd plays very well on my home system and in my car's premium sound system. The cd was mailed to Los Angelas and the DJ stated that it is playing at low volumn with no bass and treble on his system. Not sure of source he is using but believe it to be of high quality. I guess I had better ask some questions. The deal I have is that if I record his lp he will give me the lp. By the way his name is Johnny Mathias but he has to remind everyone that he is not the gay one!
tasha
Active Member
In the software you use for these conversions, do you get a wave display of the music? That would be like this example at Audacity http://audacity.sourceforge.net/about/images/audacity-macosx.png . I'm specifically referring to this screenshot as I think that whatever audio is being recorded there will come out with a tinny sound, lack of bass and volume issues. The db range isn't loud enough. There was a couple of my first CD's that were pitched because of this. It just didn't sound right. When I finish going digital with a track, album or tape, I do the db boost last and make the peaks at least touch or exceed the display pane for their channels. My suggestion at this point is to a.) find out what equipment the DJ is using for playback and b.) try another recording of the LP and give it a good boost, then c.) find a playback unit outside your systems and close to the specs to the DJ's system or maybe a friend with a different system would work easier. Some age on the playback unit might shed a different light on the sound as well.
Once again, experimenting with the equipment and software is the key to learning this. The last time I tried using a pre-amp device with USB output, the device took over my sound card. That didn't set well with me at all and I returned to using an external RCA to RCA plug pre-amp to sound card setup.
Uh Oh, I just re-read your last post. Did you misspeak by writing "Hook up to amp tape 1 plug with 30 ft of studio grade RCA audio cable to Digital interface inport ". There should be two RCA's into the Amplifier and possibly but not a must to one RCA into the capture device? This would be the Y cord.
Or is the early morning hours affecting my brain? It's been one of those nights that hitting the sack wasn't going to work.
Once again, experimenting with the equipment and software is the key to learning this. The last time I tried using a pre-amp device with USB output, the device took over my sound card. That didn't set well with me at all and I returned to using an external RCA to RCA plug pre-amp to sound card setup.
Uh Oh, I just re-read your last post. Did you misspeak by writing "Hook up to amp tape 1 plug with 30 ft of studio grade RCA audio cable to Digital interface inport ". There should be two RCA's into the Amplifier and possibly but not a must to one RCA into the capture device? This would be the Y cord.
Or is the early morning hours affecting my brain? It's been one of those nights that hitting the sack wasn't going to work.
tasha
Active Member
Great, that is one less link in the chain of items that could be a problem. I'll keep monitoring this thread if you need more help, write all about it.
Learning how to transfer music from LP to CD was the best thing since, well use your imagination. I have and am expanding my LP collection which at last count was 500 + or - excluding three major purchases at auctions totaling 250 + or - also excludes an unknown number of 45's previously purchased new or new used acquisitions this year. So an inexpensive way to make an LP to a CD was a must. And I must face it, i'm stuck in the 70's, think the 80's is new material and think rappers are best left to packaging food.
AK has been a great benefit to me repairing and maintaining my system and vinyl collection. So count my help as passing on the good karma of the forum.
Learning how to transfer music from LP to CD was the best thing since, well use your imagination. I have and am expanding my LP collection which at last count was 500 + or - excluding three major purchases at auctions totaling 250 + or - also excludes an unknown number of 45's previously purchased new or new used acquisitions this year. So an inexpensive way to make an LP to a CD was a must. And I must face it, i'm stuck in the 70's, think the 80's is new material and think rappers are best left to packaging food.
AK has been a great benefit to me repairing and maintaining my system and vinyl collection. So count my help as passing on the good karma of the forum.
I've never seen one input for both Mic and Line-in. Pre-amp should be connected to Line-in only.
The hardest part for me was always getting rid of the noise with minimum impact to the content.
If editing is expected (normalization, noise reduction) it helps if higher sampling rate/bit resolution card is used. I do it at 96K/24bit since that is the max for my current card. One can find sound cards (internal or external) with higher rates (EMU0404 or EMU0202 or similar).
tasha
Active Member
My most dreaded point of LP to CD is noise clean up. Having a little bit of the OCR and Anal Retentive afflictions makes it worse. I have on occasion spend 20 minutes of manually cleaning up a 3 minute track after running the automated clean up filters. Of course it was a rare lp of an obscure artist. Yeah, it was a local artist with small distribution. Then there was the Abbey Road lp that had 2 pops on side 1 and 15 on side 2. It took longer to listen for the issues than to fix them.
I really look forward to cutting the tracks up and burning the CD. I can't wait to find an "excuse" to take a trip in the truck for 30 minutes to check out the results.
I'm glad you pointed out the bit rate sampling. I'm spoiled by Cool Edit with a default rate of 44,100 in stereo at 16 bits. Obviously spoiled enough to forget to mention it in any previous posts.
And if you are converting any of the uncompressed files to MP3, using a variable bit rate makes a more compact file size without further compromising the audio quality. The best software for the conversion is Audio Catalyst. It require about 30 minutes of setup to get the smallest size file with the least loss of quality.
Jetrell69
Amatuer Vinyl Enthusiast
For clean up....I'd suggest ClickRepair if you are looking for something more automatic with settings that can help you out....you should google it. I use Adobe Audition 1.5 for recording and such.
I am still learning how to get the best quality sound without too much software intervention as I don't own huge, high-end recording equipment and the likes. Your sound card can be a faltering too. My Creative Audigy II processes 24/96 recording...some others may not...unless they are an external type.
I am sure there are others here with WAY more experience than me.....good luck and enjoy the vinyl.
I am still learning how to get the best quality sound without too much software intervention as I don't own huge, high-end recording equipment and the likes. Your sound card can be a faltering too. My Creative Audigy II processes 24/96 recording...some others may not...unless they are an external type.
I am sure there are others here with WAY more experience than me.....good luck and enjoy the vinyl.
Wow! Not meaning to hijack your thread but... THAT takes me back! I was 13 when 'Mother Popcorn' came out on Top 40 AM radio in 1969. In between the C.C. Revival and the 1910 Fruitgum Company songs James Brown was SCREAMING his BUTT off on 'Mother Popcorn' and I thought that was SO cool!. And I only THOUGHT he was screaming until I heard Part 2. Geez... And the bass line in that song- simply genius.
'MP' was one of the first 45's I ever bought. I wore it out so I went out and bought the album. Listening to other songs on that album, 'Popcorn With A Feeling' and 'The Little Groove Maker Me', also take me back to '69... listening to them on my Dad's crappy Arvin stereo or the kiddie record player I had at the time, putting the speaker in the window and blasting it out in the yard, listening to my mom tell me to turn it down... JB was just having too much fun on that album- and that was the appeal. Simpler times when nothing else mattered...
When you get your digitizing done you could try with 'MP' what I did with the two part "I'm The One" by Little Sister- merge the two parts into one long 'dance mix', if you will. I haven't tried it with MP yet but now that you got me thinking about it I might try it. It's certainly easier to do that with digital that it was with tape!
Thanks for the blast from the past!
"Buildin' is you ready cuz we gonna tear you down..."
Brian
oh man, get cdwav editor for spliting tracks...it is soo damn easy. it can even output flac files from wav, or lets you edit a flac and output wav if you record then archive before you edit...
There's nothing difficult about manually splitting the tracks in Audacity. I takes maybe 2 minutes total for the typical 10-12 track LP. I've never tried "cdwav editor", but it just seems cumbersome to save the large WAV file (the entire LP), reopen it in another program, and then split the file.
tasha
Active Member
And if you do a similar track cut as I do, you'll never notice the time involved. I cut each track and then run the clean up filters. When I'm satisfied with the results, then I save the track. In Cool Edit, you are allowed to "copy to new (track)". That way if you overdo a noise filter, the original recording is still available. Besides who wants to wait around for 30 minutes to wait on the noise filters to run on a whole side...
You know Cactuscowboy, I just may try out the Audacity. I was too far into learning Cool Edit to switch at the time I needed it. Now that I'm really comfortable with CE, I should learn the open source equivalent. Who knows I might like it better!!
