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Vinyl to Reel to Reel

preston1000

preston1000

Active Member
Wanted to know the experience you had when recording a vinyl to a reel to reel, did it sound the same as the vinyl or was there a noticeable difference? Feel free to recommend any advice on how you improve your recordings from vinyl to reel to reel.

I have only recorded one vinyl to a reel to reel and thought the sound wasn't as bright as when playing the vinyl, although the soundstage seems very close.

It appears that this will be another rabbit hole to go down, I just hope it's not a deep one. This hobby is extremely addictive.
 
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The sound quality can be very, very close. There will always be some amount of change because in the analog world nothing is perfect. Some prefer the changed sound quality.

How ever, more information is needed. The sound quality will depend on the reel to reel deck used, its condition/alignment/adjustment, the type and quality of the tape used and the recording speed just to name a few.

And of course since our hearing perception is subjective it can depend on personal preference.

In terms of brightness, if you mean less high frequency content, that can be in general caused by a number of things. The capability of the particular tape deck, dirty/warn/misadjusted tape heads and tape speed. The brand and type of tape used and the bias adjustment per the type of tape used among other adjustments.
 
I LIKE MUSIC said:
The sound quality can be very, very close. There will always be some amount of change because in the analog world nothing is perfect. Some prefer the changed sound quality.

How ever, more information is needed. The sound quality will depend on the reel to reel deck used, its condition/alignment/adjustment, the type and quality of the tape used and the recording speed just to name a few.

And of course since our hearing perception is subjective it can depend on personal preference.

In terms of brightness, if you mean less high frequency content, that can be in general caused by a number of things. The capability of the particular tape deck, dirty/warn/misadjusted tape heads and tape speed. The brand and type of tape used and the bias adjustment per the type of tape used among other adjustments.
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Good points, I just looked at the service manual for my Pioneer RT-1011L and will check height, tilt angle and azimuth. Will I need a test tape to make these adjustments?
 
I don't think I can make many adjustments with the reel to reel without a test tape and the required measuring instruments. The only testing instrument I have is a DAMN.

I wonder if these adjustments can be made playing a tape and using your ear as a measuring instrument.
 
Preston;

If you really want to get into it, like so, you will need to do like I have.

You have a DMM and it has its uses, here, but not so much for calibration.

You are going to want to use a dual channel O'scope, phase and head height will meter well, with that. A dual channel AC millivolt meter that you can use to set output levels. And an audio frequency signal generator. Import a signal and monitor it with the other equipment. You can set levels and alignment of the record and erase head that way. And, of course, a test tape. Set the playback (Pb) head with that.

I can get by with that but it is a minimum of equipment. It is enough for starters, though.

As I have, you may find that you have set yourself up with a good sounding low frequency and then, when setting up for 10K, there isn't enough there, to adjust equalization AT 10K. It's because the head isn't quite in the right place yet.

Your looking for a maximum output at all audible frequencies but that isn't all ways possible. You nay find that output levels at low frequencies are good, with the Pb. head in one place but better at another, for the highs. Again, the heads are not quite there, yet. In that case, you need to go for a compromise. Find that spot where both the highs and the lows can by adjusted to a similar standard level.

The first time through it all, kind of 'gets you in the neighborhood' let's say. So, after that, back the test up and go through it all again to tweak it. And then, back the tape up and do it again. It's like 'limits' in math, each time, you get closer to the right place for a tape head.

After a while, I think you will find, that setting up a deck becomes more of an art, through time, practice and experience. Nothing wrong with spec. levels and you should find those first, but, as many members in this forum can attest to, you get to listen to music the way you like to hear it, with these things.

All this applies to the Pb. head but, the same thing goes for the record head, as well. You want 'it' to put a signal on the tape so the Pb. head can reproduce it right.

The erase head should be set to take off as much recorded signal as it can, with out removing any signal from the other side of the tape. Recordings are made on tracks 1 ans 3 on a 4 track/2 channel deck so you don't want to remove any signal from tracks 2 and 4.

I have no idea how much you all ready know about setting up a deck this way but, just thought I'd write in my experiences doing it.

Best of luck, carry on. I'd love to read more.

Lu.







.
 
I had two different Revox's, 2 tube Ampexs and 3 SS Ampexs. And though the A-77 1/4 trk, and the B-77 HS had the flattest response and the SS Ampexs the best signal to noise and lowest distortion, the tubed Ampexs were no slouch. If I were going to make the best dubs I used the 2 trk AG 350-s at 15 ips with DBX noise reduction. If I were going to be economical about a recording I would use the A-77 Revox with Dolby at 3 3/4. For 7 1/2 I would use my AG 500 2 trk , My F-4460 was my boot leg machine. It was small easily hidden and with Maxell UD tape did a fantastic job. It was 2 trk with a 1/4 trk play back head with a head shifter for two track play back. Any tape always sounded different when played back on the Revoxs.

But I chose to use the B-77 for the play back deck as it had a 1/2 trk and 1/4 trk head, was high speed, and with a variable speed control could play any speed. I have since either replaced the dubs with CD's or Made my own CD's.

Last month I replaced my Chuck Sagle dub recordings with CD's. I preferred the lower brass sounds of the original LP's but the the accuracy above 1 KHZ was much better with the CD's.

I also found a Tommy Newsom direct to disc with the Tonight Show band. Its a amazing how close the CD dub I made of the 2 trk 15ips DBX tape and the disc are. A 1 db correction in the highs and another in the bass and you really have to think to tell the difference between the dub made with a Ortofon Sl 15= mk II versus direct play back with my Dynavector 20 X 2. I will say the groove noise between tracks and on the lead in groove is much much lower with the Dynavector and the highs are cleaner. Not more predominate, but more detailed.
 
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preston1000 said:
I will see if I could find someone in my area that can set it up properly, hopefully by an AK member nearby.

Thanks
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Without your location, we can't help you with finding someone.

I recorded from records for most of my tapes. I had the store tech set my new machine up for the tape that I had purchased by the case and those tapes, recorded in the early 80s sound great being played back on a different machine I recently recapped and had set up for a similar tape. It also sounds great on the new tapes I have. Quality of the machine and the set up make a big difference. Both machines I mentioned are known for sound quality.
 
Blue Shadow said:
Without your location, we can't help you with finding someone.

I recorded from records for most of my tapes. I had the store tech set my new machine up for the tape that I had purchased by the case and those tapes, recorded in the early 80s sound great being played back on a different machine I recently recapped and had set up for a similar tape. It also sounds great on the new tapes I have. Quality of the machine and the set up make a big difference. Both machines I mentioned are known for sound quality.
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I'm in Orange County CA, if there is someone in that nearby area that can help, PM and we'll communicate our spacific location through that channel.

I didn't see any mention of the reel to reel deck you had used to make the recordings. I'm the second owner of my deck which is a Pioneer RT-1011L which I have no idea if it will do the recording quality I'm after. One thing I know for sure is that my deck must be off in more than one place.

Thanks
 
Tinman is in the LA area.

first machine is a tandberg second a crown, Built Missionary Tough.
 
I would avoid altering the alignment. If heads have any wear, you should not alter alignment, without relapping the heads. Even if things are a bit out of spec, a tape recorded on a misaligned machine often plays back fine, if either the record head or PB head have not been moved. The problem comes when another plays tapes you record, on their machine.

More likely areas have been mentioned:
Dirty heads
Worn heads
Improper tape tension
Low quality or poorly stored tape
BIAS mismatch between your deck BIAS switches and the tape used

Worn heads are pricy to resolve, so try the less expensive things first.

Try different BIAS settings and monitor for results.
Put some drag on the supply reel and listen for any change in HF output. This increases tension of tape across the head.
Clean heads. You may need to use firm pressure with a good swab, with a known good head cleaner. Always rub in the direction of tape travel.
Get some Maxell UDXL or similar off the Bay. Buy two reels from different sellers that have good feedback on tape sales. This tape vintage aligns with the age of your machine.
 
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