VM95ML issues after playing warped LP – vertical oscillation, residue, burnt smell
- Thread starter Aleks63
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One of my favorite albums! Mine is not new, and only mildly edge warped. I use an Ortofon Fine Line, no issues with mis-tracking.
But, that doesn't really help you. I've never heard of this type of issue before.
Going out on a limb, I'm thinking you misaligned the suspension rubber on a warp. You're likely dragging the cantilever over the
top of the grooves, the white residue is shaved vinyl, and friction is causing the heating of the cantilever, affecting the relatively soft
rubber compound. It's also not doing your LPs any good.
But, that doesn't really help you. I've never heard of this type of issue before.
Going out on a limb, I'm thinking you misaligned the suspension rubber on a warp. You're likely dragging the cantilever over the
top of the grooves, the white residue is shaved vinyl, and friction is causing the heating of the cantilever, affecting the relatively soft
rubber compound. It's also not doing your LPs any good.
sound hound
Super Member
Maybe the "aliens" are gremlins, deep down in the grooves of the record. A microline stylus can dig deeper in the grooves than an elliptical stylus. I wonder if it is picking up some crud deep in the grooves of the record. That might explain the whitish residue on your stylus. I know there are a number of members who will clean every record they receive including the new ones. Styli can pick up all kinds of crud from records. You might try a tiny sliver of Magic Eraser and very gently wipe the stylus from the rear to the front. It can remove a lot of crud from a stylus. The crud buildup on a stylus can lead to mistracking problems.
Thanks to everyone for the quick replies.
@ripblade – whether it's rubber, plastic, or vinyl... don't quote me on that — I'm no expert.
Still, here’s an opinion I came across on another forum:
It seems that the warped record caused excessive vertical movement of the cantilever, beyond what the internal damper (rubber suspension) was designed to handle.
This likely led to mechanical fatigue or partial deformation of the damper.
As a result, the stylus started exhibiting unstable vertical behavior, especially during difficult tracking conditions, like the inner grooves.
After lowering the anti-skating, the mechanical stress on the suspension was reduced, which allowed the stylus to return to more stable behavior,
but it’s likely that the damper was permanently weakened to some degree.
Point beeing: 95ml was only few weeks old and the record was brand new. Despite all that, everything went south, which was very frustrating, to say the least
@ripblade – whether it's rubber, plastic, or vinyl... don't quote me on that — I'm no expert.
Still, here’s an opinion I came across on another forum:
It seems that the warped record caused excessive vertical movement of the cantilever, beyond what the internal damper (rubber suspension) was designed to handle.
This likely led to mechanical fatigue or partial deformation of the damper.
As a result, the stylus started exhibiting unstable vertical behavior, especially during difficult tracking conditions, like the inner grooves.
After lowering the anti-skating, the mechanical stress on the suspension was reduced, which allowed the stylus to return to more stable behavior,
but it’s likely that the damper was permanently weakened to some degree.
Point beeing: 95ml was only few weeks old and the record was brand new. Despite all that, everything went south, which was very frustrating, to say the least
Did you check whether anything loosened up after playing that warped LP?
Yeah. Still sounds very possible.
Check the movement of the arm, too. There should be zero friction.
here is the reply from reddit:
"this description is a bit all over the place but this is like the 12th report i see this year of stability issues with the red ATs on this turntable model. they have a compliance mismatch almost for sure. someone should take video of that combo playing a tone sweep on a test record."
@Aerobat yeah, 95e works completely fine
My conclusion, since the truth is always dull and boring — is a bit like this:
There is a compliance mismatch between the LP120X tonearm and the VM95ML, but everything worked fine (more or less) until the damper was pushed beyond its limits by the warped vinyl.
Afterwards, the flaw became obvious and presented itself as vertical tonearm oscillations. When the stylus stress was relieved by reducing anti-skating pressure, the system returned to normal.
Now I have a damaged cantilever, with slightly altered stereo image due to reduced anti-skating.
I thank you all for the help — I’ll try to invoke the warranty and see how it goes.
"this description is a bit all over the place but this is like the 12th report i see this year of stability issues with the red ATs on this turntable model. they have a compliance mismatch almost for sure. someone should take video of that combo playing a tone sweep on a test record."
@Aerobat yeah, 95e works completely fine
My conclusion, since the truth is always dull and boring — is a bit like this:
There is a compliance mismatch between the LP120X tonearm and the VM95ML, but everything worked fine (more or less) until the damper was pushed beyond its limits by the warped vinyl.
Afterwards, the flaw became obvious and presented itself as vertical tonearm oscillations. When the stylus stress was relieved by reducing anti-skating pressure, the system returned to normal.
Now I have a damaged cantilever, with slightly altered stereo image due to reduced anti-skating.
I thank you all for the help — I’ll try to invoke the warranty and see how it goes.
I'm not too sure how the numbers stack up, but the arm on the LP120XUSB has an effective mass of 20.6 grams, including the 9-gram headshell (from an e-mail AT sent in response to my query). On my LP120XUSB, I use the VM95 body with the ATN-XP3 stylus. I think it works great, but I don't have any severe warps to test how it handles those. It is nice to know that the VMN95E worked well on those warps.
It will be interesting to hear what AT has to say about your situation.
Good luck!
"We have received your breakdown report.
I will contact the Audio Technica technical station to request support for your product.
I will get back to you with the procedure to follow as soon as I hear back from them."
Step 1...check
Also, I checked the overhang (spot-on at 52 mm) and adjusted the offset slightly.
That allowed me to bring the anti-skating back up to 1.8.
Interestingly, Diamond Life by Sade — which previously triggered the worst vertical oscillations — still requires AS to be lowered to 1.5 to play cleanly.
So yes, realignment helped. But I'm still forced to keep AS at 1.5 in general, just to avoid adjusting it for each record individually.
I will contact the Audio Technica technical station to request support for your product.
I will get back to you with the procedure to follow as soon as I hear back from them."
Step 1...check
Also, I checked the overhang (spot-on at 52 mm) and adjusted the offset slightly.
That allowed me to bring the anti-skating back up to 1.8.
Interestingly, Diamond Life by Sade — which previously triggered the worst vertical oscillations — still requires AS to be lowered to 1.5 to play cleanly.
So yes, realignment helped. But I'm still forced to keep AS at 1.5 in general, just to avoid adjusting it for each record individually.
Thanks for the follow-up.
Having to adjust the anti-skate for each LP suggests another issue. Maybe the azimuth is far off.
I use a small round bubble level on top of the headshell to check the vertical and horizontal (azimuth) alignment of the tonearm. This may help find if your arm is far off. I doubt that a new cartridge could correct an arm that is way out of alignment.
Place the bubble on the surface of the headshell, which is parallel to the LP's playing surface.
@Aleks63, boy, either your picture is taken in a way that makes the cantilever/stylus looked like it's really off or it is really off.....would it be possible for you to take another picture and try to get as square with the front of the cartridge as you can, and the focus is really off as well so it's difficult to really see what is going on. However, the reflection of the front of the cartridge appears to be at an angle, which is not what you want, but instead you are trying to have the reflection parallel with the actual cartridge. Try this: put your camera in "macro" mode if you can to improve clarity. If you're using a phone camera, try to tap the screen right where the cantilever is which should tell the phone that this is where you want to focus. Then post that picture.
If indeed the cartridge is cocked like it appears to be in your photo, and your headshell/arm has no azimuth adjustment available, then the only way to get it more straight is to shim it a bit, which is not an exact methodology but likely will be better than what you have going on. To do so, loosen the cartridge screws slightly so that you can slide a small, rectangular shim under the LEFT side of the top of the cartridge, between it and the headshell, as we're looking at the cartridge from the front. Then, making sure you have the correct overhang and zenith and tighten the screws again. So, the shim can be cut from a piece of card stock, or if you need more height, an old credit card will do as well. I'd start with a piece about 1/8" wide and 1/2" long. Slide that shim as close to the left screw as you can so that it lowers just that left side of the cartridge a bit, which should cause the cartridge to be more parallel with the surface of the record, hence the stylus will track at more of a 90deg. angle looking at it from the front in relation to the surface of the record (and the groove).
OK, good luck and let us know how it goes......it sure does look like that cartridge is tweaked in a clockwise direction, so this might make things a whole lot better. However, I suspect that there is a whole, nuther problem with the "burning smell" thing......I would not think that changing the azimuth will correct that situation. You may have other issues with your equipment that have not yet revealed themselves.
PS - Do both of your headshells exhibit the same "cock" to the right? I.e., clockwise? What I can see from the picture you have posted is that the headshell and the cartridge seem to be parallel......it just appears that the whole headshell is off a bit.
If indeed the cartridge is cocked like it appears to be in your photo, and your headshell/arm has no azimuth adjustment available, then the only way to get it more straight is to shim it a bit, which is not an exact methodology but likely will be better than what you have going on. To do so, loosen the cartridge screws slightly so that you can slide a small, rectangular shim under the LEFT side of the top of the cartridge, between it and the headshell, as we're looking at the cartridge from the front. Then, making sure you have the correct overhang and zenith and tighten the screws again. So, the shim can be cut from a piece of card stock, or if you need more height, an old credit card will do as well. I'd start with a piece about 1/8" wide and 1/2" long. Slide that shim as close to the left screw as you can so that it lowers just that left side of the cartridge a bit, which should cause the cartridge to be more parallel with the surface of the record, hence the stylus will track at more of a 90deg. angle looking at it from the front in relation to the surface of the record (and the groove).
OK, good luck and let us know how it goes......it sure does look like that cartridge is tweaked in a clockwise direction, so this might make things a whole lot better. However, I suspect that there is a whole, nuther problem with the "burning smell" thing......I would not think that changing the azimuth will correct that situation. You may have other issues with your equipment that have not yet revealed themselves.
PS - Do both of your headshells exhibit the same "cock" to the right? I.e., clockwise? What I can see from the picture you have posted is that the headshell and the cartridge seem to be parallel......it just appears that the whole headshell is off a bit.
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I have not checked the LP120X's tonearm, but on the Technics 1200, there are two set screws under the tonearm, just behind the knurled headshell connector. By SLIGHTLY loosening each, you can rotate the headshell. Do NOT remove the screws, as they are hard to align with the threads and reattach.
I use a PH0 Philips head adapter to access and loosen the screws.