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What do you think a new $1,000 TT should Be?

for_p1 said:
You want something special, but do not want to pay premium price for that.
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Nobody makes a modern changer, because nobody would buy it. The people that want changers, are the people who bash modern tables and play their Elacs and Duals. Because they still have their Elacs and Duals, they don't need a modern table that would run them $1500. They'd just complain about the price anyway, and say that it could be done for $500. If so, why isn't somebody doing it?

Its a free market with a lot of competition. If prices could be drastically lower, they would be.
 
JohnVF said:
Its a free market with a lot of competition. If prices could be drastically lower, they would be.
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Recently I spoke with designer of high-end ($20K range ) turntable about the cost structure. He mentioned that motor controller board cost him close to $1000 from his US based vendor. When I asked why he won't order one from China (there is nothing really complex there on that board), he said that since he order them in batches of 10 (ten!), there will be no saving from that. I suspect that most TT manufacturers are like this one. Their products are manufactured like experimental devices. And it is well known that cost can be up to 10 times higher than in normal mass market runs.
 
for_p1 said:
$1000 retail means $500 wholesale price. Which on its end means $200 manufacturing cost (considering turntable production volumes). There is no much space for adding any automation (and auto-return is indeed requires separate drive and mechanics). You can't compare cost overhead at 1970-80s, when production runs were in tens or hundreds of thousand units per year with today's runs usually under 1000.
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I'd also like to hear how semi auto (not full auto, not changers, SEMI) compromises sound quality. Over and over I hear that tonearms are what's really evolved over the decades and certainly the merits of the current <$1k *as described by many here* support that.

So maybe take a Denon DP300F with its oh so scary semi auto, improve the arm and plinth quality and call it a day.
 
[/I]Who would have thougt this thread was a veiled attack on current TT pricing?[/I]..... or people so stupid they insist on using a turntable when they should be playing digital. Those morons really pizz me off. Convenience & quality..... balderdash!!
 
I use manual turntables every day. But some want automatics. At present I don't even have a cueing lever (I am used to not needing one either due to my profession).
 
for_p1 said:
Recently I spoke with designer of high-end ($20K range ) turntable about the cost structure. He mentioned that motor controller board cost him close to $1000 from his US based vendor. When I asked why he won't order one from China (there is nothing really complex there on that board), he said that since he order them in batches of 10 (ten!), there will be no saving from that. I suspect that most TT manufacturers are like this one. Their products are manufactured like experimental devices. And it is well known that cost can be up to 10 times higher than in normal mass market runs.
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You also couldn't trust 99% of the manufacturers in China to build to the specified quality. Roy Hall once told me he had to have his agent parked in the factory to keep them from substituting cheaper parts in his CD players.
 
vinyl1 said:
You also couldn't trust 99% of the manufacturers in China to build to the specified quality. Roy Hall once told me he had to have his agent parked in the factory to keep them from substituting cheaper parts in his CD players.
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Sad, but true. Target is actually bringing their production back to Canada, because of all the grief they had.
 
vinyl1 said:
You also couldn't trust 99% of the manufacturers in China to build to the specified quality. Roy Hall once told me he had to have his agent parked in the factory to keep them from substituting cheaper parts in his CD players.
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They actually can, but price won't be as low as most expect. The problem is that some manufacturing does not make sense here in States, since almost all components have to be procured from South East Asia anyway. Those who need quality can operate their own QA divisions at manufacturing site. This adds to the cost, but results are good.

But all that is not the point here. TT parts cost that much simply because the are not produced at enough volume for normal mass production. They practically never get out of R&D stage.
 
I'm sitting here after just swapping about a dozen cartridges doing a little phono stage eval. I'd want a serious lightweight carbon fiber arm with headshells. Straight, J or S arm - I'd probably go with J if I had a choice as I favor that geometry, but I could live with any of the three.

I'd also like end of play lift so I do have to stay in the room while the record is playing. If I get caught away on the phone or something, it will keep the needle wear to a minimum. maybe switch controlled so that I could have it off if I wanted ... Solenoid driven should not be too complicated.

Logic is fairly cheap now days. Features that do not directly interact with the drive system would be OK with me. I'd prolly like DD with something like Yamaha's motor from the GT 1000/2000 tables. But a less expensive version of VPI's direct drive would not hurt either :)
 
DougMac said:
Just to add some perspective, FWIW. In 1973 I bought a brand new Dual 1228 for $225. I can't remember if that included the cart.

According to an online inflation calculator, that's $1146 in today's money. B&H is still selling NOS Technics SL-1200 MK5 for $1199. While I haven't owned an SL1200, but own similar Technics DD's I think the 1200 is more bang for the buck even at that price.

I don't use or need automatic or even semi-automatic features. I'd rather have a turntable that spent that money on other features. While it would be fun to have a table without removable headshells, I need that flexibility since I play early LP's and 45's with a conical stylus. Also, if for some reason I was restricted to only one TT, I'd need 78 speed as well. That made me think of a question. Has there ever been a belt drive TT with 78 speed?
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Empire made many turntables with 3 speeds. To get the Ortofon/SME/JIS standard headshell, you would have to change tonearms for that, but it's doable.
 
sl7 good jpeg.jpg


catBot said:
  1. with the tangential (linear tracking) tonearm
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This was my first real turntable. I was 16 years old, it was 1982, I worked and saved and worked and saved, I wanted this thing so bad!!!

The 'list' price at the time was $400, I got it from Wisconsin Discount Stereo for $262.50.

The SL-7 was stored and unused for about 10 years, but I fired it up a couple years ago. It still runs and sounds fantastic!! (new stylus of course)
 
waterjetguy said:
Bigerik's "Best New Turnatble for $1,000" thread got me thinking.

What do you think a $1,000 turntable SHOULD be?
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Basically a Rega P3 but re-engineered so:

- no silly subplatter
- belt drives the outside of the platter
- beefy, big 8-pole or 4-pole AC synchronous motor, not the tiny weeny slow-speed Premotec 24-pole motor.
- flat belt of at least 5mm height, no silly round belt
- 4 feet instead of 3, adjustable in height
- a beefy plinth would be nice
 
flavio81 said:
however the lid isn't so well isolated for feedback,
and the plastic stops that keep the lid closed eventually wear out.
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Yes, in this regard the SL-10 is much better.
But still - even like it is - the SL-7 is far superior to any TT with a pivoted TA.
 
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