KA2Z
Active Member
ok great! Thank you so much!
What Phono Stage to buy?
- Thread starter KA2Z
- Start date
ok great! Thank you so much!
markd51
Nyuk Nyuk
I'd say you'd probably be good with that Table-Arm with almost any MM Cartridge, and many nice MC Cartridges.
And with the Sutherland KC Vice, I would again say it should be able to accommodate basically all MM's and probably MC's down to about .4mv output, possibly .35mv.
With my Sutherland PHD, I was able to run either 60db or 62db Gain with a Benz Micro Ruby 3 LO at .34mv, and currently the ZYX Airy 3X LO which is rated at .24mv, but due to different testing methods used is actually comparable to about .34mv as well. Again, either Cartridge sounded great at either 100ohm or 200ohm settings for loading.
Could you pair your Table-Arm and Phono Stage with such Cartridges I mention above? Sure, biggest problem commonly is $$$$! LOL
Any MC Cartridges with output over 1.0mv usually then act like MM Cartridges, and it is then fine to let the reigns loose and let the KC Vibe or others operate at 47k Ohms. Of course your ears and system should be the final criterion as to best liked sound with any given Cartridge.
Integrated Amps, sure, there's many nice ones out there. A big honkin McIntosh would personally fit that bill for me! LOL
The integrated saves space, cabling issues. Those big Macs are still sort of cumbersome though, often a 2-man lift!
Ain't she a little honey!? LOL
https://www.mcintoshlabs.com/products/integrated-amplifiers/MA9000
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KA2Z
Active Member
I'd say you'd probably be good with that Table-Arm with almost any MM Cartridge, and many nice MC Cartridges.
And with the Sutherland KC Vice, I would again say it should be able to accommodate basically all MM's and probably MC's down to about .4mv output, possibly .35mv.
With my Sutherland PHD, I was able to run either 60db or 62db Gain with a Benz Micro Ruby 3 LO at .34mv, and currently the ZYX Airy 3X LO which is rated at .24mv, but due to different testing methods used is actually comparable to about .34mv as well. Again, either Cartridge sounded great at either 100ohm or 200ohm settings for loading.
Could you pair your Table-Arm and Phono Stage with such Cartridges I mention above? Sure, biggest problem commonly is $$$$! LOL
Any MC Cartridges with output over 1.0mv usually then act like MM Cartridges, and it is then fine to let the reigns loose and let the KC Vibe or others operate at 47k Ohms. Of course your ears and system should be the final criterion as to best liked sound with any given Cartridge.
Integrated Amps, sure, there's many nice ones out there. A big honkin McIntosh would personally fit that bill for me! LOL
The integrated saves space, cabling issues. Those big Macs are still sort of cumbersome though, often a 2-man lift!
Ain't she a little honey!? LOL
https://www.mcintoshlabs.com/products/integrated-amplifiers/MA9000
the big mac looks great but way over my budget.
Im looking at under 2k
VintageVibe
Active Member
I'm glad you pointed out the 103r mismatch. Based on the previous comments I assumed someone had checked the EM before posting. I had been considering the 301mkii for my 11gr tonearm, but I was able to locate a 103D (high compliance LOMC), which is the TOTL of the 103 series and a better version of the 103r.
markd51
Nyuk Nyuk
I'd say you'd probably be good with that Arm with almost any MM Cartridge, and many nice MC Cartridges.
And with the Sutherland KC Vice, I would again say it should be able to accommodate basically all MM's and probably MC's down to about .4mv output, possibly .35mv.
With my Sutherland PHD, I was able to run either 60db or 62db Gain with a Benz Micro Ruby 3 LO at .34mv, and currently the ZYX Airy 3X LO which is rated at .24mv, but due to different testing methods used is actually comparable to about .34mv as well. Again, either Cartridge sounded great at either 100ohm or 200ohm settings for loading.
Could you pair your Table-Arm and Phono Stage with such Cartridges I mention above? Sure, biggest problem commonly is $$$$! LOL
Any MC Cartridges with output over 1.0mv usually then act like MM Cartridges, and it is then fine to let the reigns loose and let the KC Vibe or others operate at 47k Ohms. Of course your ears and system should be the final criterion as to best liked sound with any given Cartridge.
Integrated Amps, sure, there's many nice ones out there. A big honkin McIntosh would personally fit that bill for me! LOL
The integrated saves space, cabling issues. Those big Macs are still sort of cumbersome though, often a 2-man lift!
Yeah, I know what you mean! At current day over my budget as well, but about 4 years ago I did buy myself two brand new Bryston 7BSST2 600 watt Monoblock Amps. It is nice knowing with Bryston, I still have 16 years of warrantee left on them.
Here you can see my Sutherland PHD sitting beneath my VPI Table on its SRA Iso Base.
KA2Z
Active Member
Cant see the photo.
Ilikevinyl
Cool Breeze
"Hagerman Trumpet MC" tubed phono stage with multiple loading options and MM input too, around $1000. Reading nothing but very positive reviews.
https://hagerman-audio-labs.myshopify.com/products/trumpet-mc-vacuum-tube-phonostage
https://hagerman-audio-labs.myshopify.com/products/trumpet-mc-vacuum-tube-phonostage
markd51
Nyuk Nyuk
It was at the very top of my last post, but here's another shot
, hope you can see it this time.
markd51
Nyuk Nyuk
Missing from these Pics due to a rough set-up, another Quad TEAC R2R Deck, and my Sunfire True Subwoofer MK-IV. My Mac MX-130 Pre/Tuner has enough hookups like a Nuclear Submarine on back! LOL
I've got enough gear to make another 2 full systems, two mint Sansui Receivers, Stereo and Quad, two Mint Denon DP-2550 Tables, 4 mint JBL L-65 12" 3-way Jubal Speakers, two nice smaller B&W Speakers.
Spare Cartridges, a Shure V-15 III with a variety of Stylus options, including Jico SAS, two mint AT Cartridges, the AT-15Sa, and an NOS in box AT-20SLa. Have 2 NOS ATN-20SS Stylus' for either.
I'd like maybe one day buying either another ZYX, or a Benz Cartridge. Either the ZYX 4D, or the Benz LP-S.
Then again, who knows, maybe Lyra, maybe Dynavector, or ?
I've got enough gear to make another 2 full systems, two mint Sansui Receivers, Stereo and Quad, two Mint Denon DP-2550 Tables, 4 mint JBL L-65 12" 3-way Jubal Speakers, two nice smaller B&W Speakers.
Spare Cartridges, a Shure V-15 III with a variety of Stylus options, including Jico SAS, two mint AT Cartridges, the AT-15Sa, and an NOS in box AT-20SLa. Have 2 NOS ATN-20SS Stylus' for either.
I'd like maybe one day buying either another ZYX, or a Benz Cartridge. Either the ZYX 4D, or the Benz LP-S.
Then again, who knows, maybe Lyra, maybe Dynavector, or ?
KA2Z
Active Member
Awesome!
KA2Z
Active Member
markd51
Nyuk Nyuk
I wanted to add a comment about the KC Vibe, as this is a possibility.
I noticed on the KC Vibe's Board, what appears to be 2 Op Amps. These, like on the Sutherland PHD, might be simple plug and play components?
After owning my PHD for about a year, I had found out that there was 2 OP Amps on the Board that could be easily upgraded with better OPA627. Yes, more costly, but a better OP Amp.
I had gotten the impression that Sutherland uses less expensive parts that work, and many of their phono stages are perhaps built to a price point with less expensive parts in certain areas. This appears to be one area I found.
The stock OP Amps on the PHD that could be changed were merely a $3-$4 part each, whereas the OPA627 cost between $26-$30 at current day.
Before going further with any purchases, and a possible harm to my Unit, I decided to call Ron Sutherland himself personally. Ron is a great guy to talk with, took his time, we probably chatted for 25 minutes, and yes, this upgrade had his personal blessing and approval to implement.
I'm not sure if there's any such info out there on the web about doing such also to the KC Vibe, but there might be? Otherwise a call to Ron Sutherland could confirm one way or the other about such an upgrade to that particular Unit? He for sure would know yes or no, and what OP Amp is suitable for the upgrade.
These OP Amps are simple plug and play affairs, merely a press fit into the Board. On the PHD the OPA627 is an 8 Pin Part.
The only one precaution is a possible discharge of static electricity when changing these, so it is common to ground oneself to the chassis of the unit while the procedure is being done. I've seen such done where a simple lanyard is attached to the wrist, then attached to the Chassis to ground with a small Alligator Clip.
If I'm correct about such an upgrade for the KC Vibe, then that might be something to consider down the road.
I'd say if the answer is yes, to first live with the Unit for a period of time, and enjoy it, and perhaps at some future point you could try such. I did such, and purchased the required OP Amps from Digikey.
I wanted to add, that there may possibly be no upgrade for the OP Amps in the KC Vibe. Just a brain fart I had.
As I previously touched upon, one person would know for sure one way or the other, and that would be Ron Sutherland himself.
It states that the KC Vibe uses Burr Brown OP Amps already, and the upgrade OPA627 OP Amps for the Sutherland PHD are Burr Brown, made by Texas Instruments.
I noticed on the KC Vibe's Board, what appears to be 2 Op Amps. These, like on the Sutherland PHD, might be simple plug and play components?
After owning my PHD for about a year, I had found out that there was 2 OP Amps on the Board that could be easily upgraded with better OPA627. Yes, more costly, but a better OP Amp.
I had gotten the impression that Sutherland uses less expensive parts that work, and many of their phono stages are perhaps built to a price point with less expensive parts in certain areas. This appears to be one area I found.
The stock OP Amps on the PHD that could be changed were merely a $3-$4 part each, whereas the OPA627 cost between $26-$30 at current day.
Before going further with any purchases, and a possible harm to my Unit, I decided to call Ron Sutherland himself personally. Ron is a great guy to talk with, took his time, we probably chatted for 25 minutes, and yes, this upgrade had his personal blessing and approval to implement.
I'm not sure if there's any such info out there on the web about doing such also to the KC Vibe, but there might be? Otherwise a call to Ron Sutherland could confirm one way or the other about such an upgrade to that particular Unit? He for sure would know yes or no, and what OP Amp is suitable for the upgrade.
These OP Amps are simple plug and play affairs, merely a press fit into the Board. On the PHD the OPA627 is an 8 Pin Part.
The only one precaution is a possible discharge of static electricity when changing these, so it is common to ground oneself to the chassis of the unit while the procedure is being done. I've seen such done where a simple lanyard is attached to the wrist, then attached to the Chassis to ground with a small Alligator Clip.
If I'm correct about such an upgrade for the KC Vibe, then that might be something to consider down the road.
I'd say if the answer is yes, to first live with the Unit for a period of time, and enjoy it, and perhaps at some future point you could try such. I did such, and purchased the required OP Amps from Digikey.
I wanted to add, that there may possibly be no upgrade for the OP Amps in the KC Vibe. Just a brain fart I had.
As I previously touched upon, one person would know for sure one way or the other, and that would be Ron Sutherland himself.
It states that the KC Vibe uses Burr Brown OP Amps already, and the upgrade OPA627 OP Amps for the Sutherland PHD are Burr Brown, made by Texas Instruments.
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KA2Z
Active Member
That might be a good idea.
I could send him an email.
The KC Vibe arrived today and it sounds real good. I will let it break in a couple months then look into upgrading the op amps. Thanks!
AvFan
Super Member
The Sutherland PH3D I owned had the original opamps replaced with OPA627s. It was a nice upgrade. I can't say they would also be for the KC Vibe so you made a good recommendation to call Ron Sutherland.