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Wheels falling off of cars

cq.ab0nf

cq.ab0nf

Active Member
I regularly see cars at the side of a major road, a wheel off, and not on a jack. Doesn't appear the axle broke, or anything serious like that. Bewildered drivers are next to it their phones. Today I saw this with a brand new Toyota truck. The lug posts were in tact and it was resting on the pavement on the brake rotor.

How does this happen? Are people changing tires without using a jack? Tire changers forget to tighten lug nuts (a NASCAR favorite)?
 
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cq.ab0nf said:
I regularly see cars at the side of a major road, a wheel off, and not on a jack. Doesn't appear the axle broke, or anything serious like that. Bewildered drivers are next to it their phones. Today I saw this with a brand new Toyota truck. The lug posts were in tact and it was resting on the pavement on the brake rotor.

How does this happen? Are people changing tires without using a jack? Tire changers forget to tighten lug nuts (a NASCAR favorite)?
Click to expand...
Nuts come off.

I rotate my wheels myself and after every rotation I'll check the lug nuts after I drive a bit three times to be sure they're good. Yesterday I noticed a noise coming from the front right and figured it was time to change pads. I bought the pads a couple years ago so this morning I was set to change them out. Went to loosen the nuts only to find one missing. Went to the auto parts store, bought a new one and put it on. The noise is gone.
 
Especially with alloy wheels lig nut or bolt torque is critical. After wheel rotation or tire replacement they need to be retorqued at least once after a few miles.
With torquing I mean using a torque wrench and hand torquing.
Torque sticks are too unreliable with many variables and should not be used, at least not for the final torque.
 
A friend of mine had the wheel come off of his SUV while driving. Seems someone had attempted to steal his wheel and weren't able to complete the job. Only found one of his lug nuts from that tire, all the others were missing. Two of the other tires had some lug nuts which were loosened.
 
Back in the 70s, I was driving the family wagon and took a turn in a neighborhood, downhill, left 90° a bit faster than the right rear wheel wanted me to take the turn. Ripped the wheel off the car around the bolt circle. Told my passenger Scott to chase down the wheel as I started the process of installing the spare. I’m sure my brother and I weakened that wheel over time but geez, you just don’t expect that kind of failure. It was a Dodge product if that makes a difference.
 
I've had it happen twice, on the same car, and both times my fault. First was a crappy lug wrench that didn't engage properly and I didn't get them tight enough. A bunch of years later I had pulled the axles to inspect something and put it all back together. Torqued the wheel, but like an idiot I had not torqued the wheel spacer that was actually holding the wheel to the car. Ran the damn tire over as it exited from underneath and did a hell of a number on the quarter panel. Wheel and tire were perfectly fine, and are actually still on the car. I did replace the wheel spacer since it wallowed out the pockets that the lug nuts sit in.

Both times it was a rear wheel, not the same side, not the same wheels.
 
Bolts / lug posts length is different for steel and aluminum wheels. Chamfer angle is different. Aluminum wheels need re-tightening about a week after putting the wheel on.
 
cq.ab0nf said:
I regularly see cars at the side of a major road, a wheel off, and not on a jack. Doesn't appear the axle broke, or anything serious like that. Bewildered drivers are next to it their phones. Today I saw this with a brand new Toyota truck. The lug posts were in tact and it was resting on the pavement on the brake rotor.
Click to expand...
If the wheel bearing seizes and the cage assembly disintegrates, the wheel and rotor can snap off the axle.

This used to happen more often a long time ago, when the axle bearing grease wasn’t as good as today’s synthetic stuff.
 
These days with the steering knuckle made out of alloys (pot metal) it is not that uncommon to see cars disabled with broken knuckles. Makes for an interesting end to the car ride.
 
I did have one fall off on a friend's car. Not while moving, but while being loaded on the tow truck. Rear axle bearing failed and snapped the axle shaft where the flange is. The rear caliper basically held it on, but it mostly lost the fight when being hauled onto the flat bed. The wheel never came out from under the car but it was at a very obvious "something ain't right" angle. Of course that was the only part of the trip I drove.
 
broken rotor - honda s2000.jpg
There was a post on a Honda site where the rotor broke and split the calipers in half. There was damage on the entire wheel side where this happened, including strut damage.
 
Olle said:
Especially with alloy wheels lig nut or bolt torque is critical. After wheel rotation or tire replacement they need to be retorqued at least once after a few miles.
With torquing I mean using a torque wrench and hand torquing.
Torque sticks are too unreliable with many variables and should not be used, at least not for the final torque.
Click to expand...

This. Cone type lug nuts will back out if gripping surfaces on the nut and or wheel are worn.
 
Late Boomer said:
I would be interested to see a picture that shows how thick the rotor is.
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Think it is similar in width to this one.

qualitypro-br44624g-unn.jpg
 
Blue Shadow said:
Back in the 70s, I was driving the family wagon and took a turn in a neighborhood, downhill, left 90° a bit faster than the right rear wheel wanted me to take the turn. Ripped the wheel off the car around the bolt circle. Told my passenger Scott to chase down the wheel as I started the process of installing the spare. I’m sure my brother and I weakened that wheel over time but geez, you just don’t expect that kind of failure. It was a Dodge product if that makes a difference.
Click to expand...
Back in the day Mopar had left and right hand threads for opposite sides of the car (left hand threads on drivers side, regular threads on passenger side). They made them this way up until 1975 on drum brake cars (disc brake cars had all right hand threads). Many people had no clue about this dumb idea and so over tightened the lugs on the left side while trying to get them "loose", which eventually wallowed out the holes in the rim. Rotate the tires and put one with wallowed out holes on the right side and they would soon depart the vehicle. A friend had this happen to his 65' Coronet on the interstate at 60 mph: the right rear tire passed us as the axle was grinding away on the pavement !
 
Olle said:
These days with the steering knuckle made out of alloys (pot metal) it is not that uncommon to see cars disabled with broken knuckles. Makes for an interesting end to the car ride.
Click to expand...
All it takes is one good smack into a curb and those lightweight knuckles snap like toothpicks... not uncommon to see this happen on small economy cars and light weight SUVs.
 
At Mitsubishi a road tester was heading to the test track in a cheap Galant with steel wheels. As soon as he moved from the stop sign to turn onto the track a wheel came apart. The only thing the was holding that wheel together was friction and paint because it didn't have any spot welds. Scary thing was that car hit between 50-60 mph on roll test on the tester line that always had people walking around.
 
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