Which Thorens?

[nu2toobs]

The Thorens TD-160 is the best Thorens for your budget and a nice performer. The TD-124 isn't rumble prone if in the correct plinth and in top mechanical condition. Back in the day, the top idler turntables were not in suitable plinth arrangements unless they lived their lives in broadcast studio furniture. And massive plinths were needed for the TD-124, Garrard 301 and 401, Rek-O-Kuts, and even the Lencos to perform at their best.

I agree with your concise and thoughtful exclamation on the proper setup of idler drive tt's.

 

[nu2toobs]

HI,
I'm glad you are happy. Nothing I say will change that nor do I want to. But, I will tell you that if you have a system with great (I mean great, not good, sub 20 Hz) bass response you will hear the rumble problems the TD 124 (idler drive) has. The TD 125 (belt drive) solved those problems. Just look at the specs. They tell the truth. So do our ears.

Additionally, the TD 124 Mk 1 could not be used with moving coil cartridges due to its steel platter. It was a MC killer. The Mk 2, much rarer, had an aluminum platter which solved that problem. Which one do you have?

I guess you agree about the Thorens arms. BTW, my Graham 2.2 Deluxe is also a $3000 arm. It's an excellent arm. But, neither your SME 345 arm, which I like, or my arms will solve the basic rumble problem with the TD 124. I can assure you that my system goes to below 20Hz with power and low distortion. Not a good home for a TD 124.

Sparky

Your correct, nothing you say will change my opinion I've used MC cartridges for years on my MC killer with no adverse effects.

My 124 is mounted on a CLD (controlled layered Damped) Plinth, which brings out the detail and SLAM that idlers are known for. I rebuilt the motor myself with close tolerances, allowing it to acquire speed within 2 seconds. The sintered bronze spindle bearings were machined smaller than tolerance, I then polished them on a lathe to + .002". My idler wheel is also machined to less than .005" variances, thus no audible rumble.

So what I'm saying is, the broad statement that idlers are rumbly compared to belts is exaggerated to say the least.

My stuff sounds great to me after 30++ years of tinkering, and no, my system doesn't go down in the 20 Hz. My home theater does though!!

My apologies for thread crapping, my opinion stands that the 160 is a very good choice for your budget.

 

[Karma16]

Your correct, nothing you say will change my opinion I've used MC cartridges for years on my MC killer with no adverse effects.

My 124 is mounted on a CLD (controlled layered Damped) Plinth, which brings out the detail and SLAM that idlers are known for. I rebuilt the motor myself with close tolerances, allowing it to acquire speed within 2 seconds. The sintered bronze spindle bearings were machined smaller than tolerance, I then polished them on a lathe to + .002". My idler wheel is also machined to less than .005" variances, thus no audible rumble.

So what I'm saying is, the broad statement that idlers are rumbly compared to belts is exaggerated to say the least.

My stuff sounds great to me after 30++ years of tinkering, and no, my system doesn't go down in the 20 Hz. My home theater does though!!

My apologies for thread crapping, my opinion stands that the 160 is a very good choice for your budget.

HI NU,
I don't see how you can say my comments are exagerated. You went to a lot of very impressive work to attain the performance you claim. My comments about problems are entirely confined to the stock units which apparently you confirm. If I bought a TD 124 I don't think I could duplicate the work you have done. I don't have the tools.

Are you saying that the system where your TD 124 is installed does not go to 20 Hz? If that is true, then you have not contradicted anything I said except the MC comment. Concerning that, I don't understand how you can get a MC to work on the TD 124. Personally, I never had the courage to try an MC on my TD 124 because they were famous for slamming the cantilevers flat. Which MC are you using that gets around this problem? They must have weak magnets or you are using a very thick platter mat.

Further, the MK 2 version eliminated the steel platter specifically because of the MC problem. It seems that Thorens thought the steel platter was a problem and their solution was more expensive than the original design.

It seems to me that you are just trying to make a case for an obsolete turntable that you significantly modified to get it to perform to a satisfactory
level in your system which does not have state of the art bass performance. Hmmmm!!

I'll stand by all of my original comments.

I will say that I'll bet you have a really good TD 124 that I would love to hear. As I said above, I love the TD 124 but I would never own another one considering the competion.

When I had my hi fi repair shop, I worked on TD 124's. This would have been around the year 2000. I had the chance to buy several at really good prices but I declined. This was before the prices went beyond stupid. I should have bought them strictly as an investment for resale. But, who could know?

If I really wanted a TD 124 I would get a TD 224 because they truly were unique (I rebuilt those too-very complicated, I've only seen two). Now, they are selling at prices far beyond anything that makes sense. But, if I could find one that needed a lot of work for a good price, I'd do it in a heartbeat. It would strictly be a museum piece. But what a nice one.

Sparky

 

[nu2toobs]

Well let's agree to disagree, no harm no fowl.

 

[nerdorama]

Sasha18,
If you will send me your email, I'll forward some pictures. I'm not sure the two-way with the private messages worked. Checked the motor and it runs ok but belt slips badly.
John

 

[Divotdog]

I think with your budget an 160 (or even a 160super) or with some luck a 125 would be the best choices. I never really cared for the 124, the 126 will be too expensive and the 14X and the 166 are (IMHO) of lesser quality then tyhe 160/125. Of those two, I rate the 125 a little bit higher. The exotic stuff like the Concrete or the Reference are way out of reach, although fun to dream about.

The 145 is simply a 160 with an auto lift.

 

[Karma16]

HI All,
You guy's have left another option completely out of this discussion. And it is an important option. You do NOT have to buy a Thorens turntable with a Thorens arm. While I love their turntables I have never been impressed with their tone arms.

I bought my TD 125 with a blank arm board and mounted a Graham 2.2 Deluxe unipivot arm. This makes for a very impressive combination. There are many arms out there that, I believe, are better than the Thorens arm. They should be checked out.

Sparky