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Mac_n_cheese

New Member
First post!:D

I am seeking advice on where I should be spending my time and money. I have been slowly working on improving my system, and would greatly appreciate any advice and thoughts. Up until recently, I have been piecing things together from hand me downs. I am not trying to achieve a hifi audiophile sound, because I can not afford it. I currently have some limited speaker building and electronics skills, which I would love to improve and work on. The idea of building some of my own components is very appealing (and also overwhelming). A few months ago, I successfully put together a boombox based around the Sprite design, and I had a blast with the project.

Current system:
Room - living room with furniture, curtains, wall hangings. main wall = 14'6" side wall = 15'5"
Sources:
a)Project Debut Carbon DC
b)Raspberry Pi with RuneAudio running through Schiit Modi 2 Uber.
NAD 304 integrated amp
90s Advent floor-standing speakers (can update with exact model when I get home. But they are black with wooden tops and bottoms)

I feel confident in building things that I can buy in a kit. Speakers with a flat-pack or something like a amplifier with a PCB. I have spent a good bit of time reading about things, but I get pretty overwhelmed with the huge volume of often conflicting information available online. I feel like I should start with my speakers, and wouldn't mind moving to something a little smaller on stands. I feel like my room is not that big.

I do have the option to pick up some new KEF Q100 speakers for $300.00 from a friend. But I am not sure if that is the best idea.

Thanks in advance!
 
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Mac: I think you are right to focus on the speakers. I like some Advents (I own sets of 5002s, Baby IIs, others) but they are generally just "OK" IMO. A lot of options there with your room size. I don't know what the NAD puts out power-wise but I'm guessing you are fine there. Will your friend let you try the KEFs with your system before deciding? You have lots of options in that $100 - 300 speaker cost range, some with more bass than the Q100s. I am not a fan of big bass or subs, but if you like the mids and highs of the KEFs, you could always add a sub to round out the bottom end. Good luck!
 
Can't stop without a plug for ADS vintage speakers. I have two-way L520s, they cost $80 on CL and are my current favorite speakers. If you ever get the chance to take a listen or test any, do.
 
Thanks for the feedback! Unfortunately, I can't try out the Q100 speakers. My friend had purchased them to give as a gift, but is no longer gifting them. So they either want to return the unopened box, or just sell it to me for the price they paid.

I have trouble figuring out what size of speaker I need for my room. I feel like it is a relatively small room.
 
It is a fairly small room. You don't need anything very large, that's for sure. So many variables depending on your type of music etc. Depending on where you are and what comes up locally on CL or the 'bay, you could probably get something good for less than the KEFs - if you are willing to wait and pounce. Or, do you have a higher end audio store that has a used or resale section?

For build your own option - the single-driver type Fostex units I hear are pretty great...and there are cabinet kits.
 
It's tough to advise on speakers over the interweb. Or, it's easy to tell you what each of us likes, but hard for you to know how those are going to sound, eh?

Best thing is to listen to a lot of speakers. What city/state are you located in? AKers get together in various places and listen to gear, so maybe there is a regional gathering near you.

As for me, I really like my Klipsch kg4.2's with crossovers recapped and Crites titanium tweeter diaphragms. Really sweet. 10" woofer and 10" passive, so not a huge speaker. You can find em on the used market for $100-$250 and it doesn't cost that much to do the upgrades.
 
I live in Raleigh, North Carolina. I will keep my eyes open for different events happening. I check the local CL once and a while, but I have trouble distinguishing between good and bad when it comes to used speakers just cause there are so many different models. I would like to try to move to a smaller speaker with a stand, just so they take up a little less space.

After some research online, I am pretty sure my speakers are the Advent Legacy. I am the third or fourth owner of them.

I often hear about Overnight Sensations being solid, and know companies make build kits for them. The DIY route is appealing because I enjoy putting together things, and figured I could save some money by assembling myself.

Thanks for the feedback so far! I realized the issues when it comes to asking for speaker recommendations over the internet. I spend most of my time listening to most spectrums of rock, folk, with a little bit of jazz and classical (once and a while).
 
If you hang around the speaker forum long enough you start to get a feel for good speakers vs. garden variety vs. complete crap. You can tell right away by looking at most of them which class they are likely to be in, and the ones you can't are easy to look up.
 
The first question is this. Is there anything about the sound that is sub standard now? How is the system set up in the room, can you give us a diagram or picture? Also what kind of music do you listen to?

Your room is not really small, more on the medium side, and will easily support a good floor standing speaker.

Given the equipment you have, I would be looking to change speakers and cartridge. They are the two ends of the chain, and each component has the most "character" of our audio gear. So you will affect the greatest changes at these places.

To get a bit more thoughtful recommendation let us know what types of music you like, what areas of music reproduction you value the most and will not compromise, and which areas are less important. And give us a budget to work with.

Now assembling a speaker kit will give you a lot of value for the money, but you won't realize that when you go to sell. So if they are long term keepers then you do well. The used market will give you a better value, but selling used speakers can be problematic if you don't have boxes for them, or they are too large to ship easily.

If you can give us a bit more info, I think you can get some solid recommendations. This site has a strong vintage history, so you are going to get a lot of recommendations that way. But there have been a lot of advances in medium priced speakers, so perhaps a modern offering would offer more value. There are no easy solutions, and you will have to make a decision on which suggestions have the most merit.

Regards
Mister Pig
 
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I have attached a rough sketch of the layout of the living room. I am young and am living in an apartment. Realistically, I will not be living in the same apartment in 2-3 years. Music is played fairly loud often. My apartment is in a hundred year old house that was divided into multiple units. The very think plaster walls seem to do a great job at sound proofing the room, because sound traveling to the other apartments is not a problem. Having cool younger neighbors also helps.

I spend the most time listening to music that falls into the rock bucket. I do some dance electronic tracks, along with jazz and a little classical. Hiphop will get played. But I would say about 85% of the time it is rock. I also use my system with my TV, but all things video are kinda an after thought. We don’t use the screen very much, so its not a priority. We have it mounted in the corner just to keep it out of the way. There is also no desire to move to a 5.1 setup.

For speakers, I would put my budget around $500, but I would be happy to pay less. Both used and DIY routes are appealing. Resale value isn’t that important to me, as I normally am pretty bad at spending the time to sell things for what they are worth. I generally rather sell to friends/family at a good price.

I would prefer a non floor standing speaker. Something that would work on speaker stands, but this isn’t crucial. Later this winter, I would like to try my hand at some chip amps. Mostly for the fun experience, and I plan to start with LM1875 designs.
 
Ok. Great start. How about a description of how the system sounds now, and what you want to improve? Or what is the systems limitations, and what parts concern you the most?

Do you want dynamic scale and volume? Do you prefer vocals to be eerily real? Do you want a huge image and sound stage? What do you need?

Regards
Mister Pig
 
Some ADS speakers would be on my radar, like the L810's or 710's or 1290's. I haven't heard your advents but the ADS
Speakers are really nice.
 
So I am a very inexperienced listener, with even less experience in describing what I hear in words. I haven't had the opportunity to really listen to any hifi systems, and the only decent system I have spent any considerable amount of time listening to is my own. I can also assume I have very average hearing ability for my age (mid twenties). Is there any standard books or lectures on the description of sounds that I could read up on? I did some searching but was having trouble finding stuff.

When I listen to my system, it often seems narrow in frequencies. As if everything gets kinda squished. There are some tones(frequencies) that sound very pleasant, but I feel like the majority do not sound special.

I am not super familiar with the different trade offs when it comes to sound, but based on the Mister Pig's questions:
- Dynamic scale over volume. I wont ever need to set up a concert hall in my apartment. Sheer high volume is not my goal
- A larger sound stage is preferred, I would want to feel like I am at the live show
- Having a system be very transparent and analytical is not very important to me. I am fine with a system having its own unique flavor
- No problem saying that aesthetics do matter. If I am between a few models, I would pick the one that looks better. My roommate (girlfriend) surely will not mind furniture that sounds good.

Additional ideas:
- My goal is to also be very realistic
- In the future I do not see myself ever having a pure listening room. I won't ever be buying acoustic foam for the walls.
- In the long term, I only want to strive for the minimal best sound. Once I get to the point of diminishing returns, I don't need to keep upgrading.

Again thanks for all the time everyone has spent on my post! Really neat to be new to a community and receive this warm welcome. Its not the most common thing on the internet haha.
 
Well depending on budget, and whether you want to go used or not, or you want a vintage speaker....there are tons of options.

Now the NAD 304 is a modest sized amp in terms of power output, so you don't want a speaker that is terribly inefficient.

I would also say that a good quality small floor standing speaker is more cost efficient than a stand mount speaker, and will typically offer a deeper bass response due to larger cabinet size. But that is only a generalization, there are always exceptions.

Also, you state a goal of being realistic, yet you don't mind a speaker having its own unique flavor. Those two points are diametrically opposed, and I imagine you want to be on a continuum of a high level of realism without breaking the bank.

One option for new speakers is to look at the factory direct lines that provide an excellent value for a decent price. Two that come to mind are SVS Audio and Ascend Audio. They both build high quality speakers, and the sound is verry very good for the dollar spent.

If you go to the used market, there are some stalwarts to consider. ADS, KEF, Boston Acousitcs, Vienna Acousitcs, Mordaunt Short, Castle, MB Quart, Dahlquist, PSB, Paradigm....these come to mind. All of them have their strengths, and you are going to have to give them a listen to decide if they are worth owning. Of course price, location, and condition all factor in to the price.

Hope this helps, or at least give you a start.

If I were to buy new, the SVS Prime floor stander would get a long hard look.

If I were buying used I would consider the Paradigm, KEF, or Dahlquist.

Regards
Mister Pig
 
Thanks Mister Pig!

The brands mention will help me get started with more research. Just to clarify, would you recommendations include adding subwoofers to the system?

Since I still have speakers that work, I think I will opt into taking the time to try and hunt down a good pair of used speakers. Based on my room, a stand mount speaker would still be ideal (space-wise and look-wise). Perhaps trying to keep stand mount as a requirement will help me narrow down the options.
 
Mac_n_cheese said:
Thanks Mister Pig!

The brands mention will help me get started with more research. Just to clarify, would you recommendations include adding subwoofers to the system?

Since I still have speakers that work, I think I will opt into taking the time to try and hunt down a good pair of used speakers. Based on my room, a stand mount speaker would still be ideal (space-wise and look-wise). Perhaps trying to keep stand mount as a requirement will help me narrow down the options.
Click to expand...

Whether or not to add subs is dependent on what the main speakers can do. Now since the NAD doesn't have a ton of power, it does make sense to have a powered sub as it takes the strain on off the NAD. Music in the lower registers requires more power to get right, so a powered sub is not a bad choice. But it takes work to integrate it with the main speaker and get the crossover point to be seamless, and sub/satellite combos occupy more floor space than a floor stander. Because a stand mount speaker takes up exactly the same amount of room as a floor stander, but then you have to add an extra box to get the bass response. So there are trade offs, there are no free lunches in audio. And then add in the cost of a good quality pair of stands, which is usually at least $120, if not more.

But there are advantages to stand mounts also. The cabinets are smaller, and they are easier to make stiff and non-resonant. So they tend to color the sound less. They are easier to ship, so you can go to the internet used market and have a lot more choice. They are lighter, and with a sub there are more pieces, so they are easier to move around. Or ship if you sell them.

Have fun.

Regards
Mister Pig
 
So I decided to pass on the KEFs, and take a little more time to learn about speakers. I think I have settled on going for a used set of speakers, and I am looking to spend around $300 (+/- 150). Looking at both ebay and audiogon, it seems like I can pick up a pretty decent set of stand mount speakers for that amount. I am having some trouble sorting through available speakers to determine what will be a good match for my NAD 304. From my understanding, I will want an efficient speaker, but I am not exactly sure what efficient means when it comes to the speakers specs.

Thanks!
 
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