Yamaha C-80 puts out anemic signal??

[Autobot]

After using too many graphic EQ's in my life, I assumed the loudness control boosted highs and lows as opposed to dumping mids as it does. They of course are synced as they should be and I have proven for 756,452 2nd time the adage " If you assume you make an ---------------" My DOA was a C70
will I like it better if I am able to fix it (in your opinion). Thanks again, Zangsax

I have been thinking...

...The C-70 is worthy of repair and if you did get it fixed you would be able to compare the two and post a review which would BTW be totally off the hook, dude.

 

[Autobot]

Varigain

A little funny; first they say how fantastic this new volume control is, then they say that the 4-gang volume of the C-50 takes care of the conventional problems. Hmm...

The varigain way of doing things also persent a problem, any amp has a sweet spot where it creats a minimum of distortion. So for optimal sound it's all about getting as close to this a possible, if you take a look at some of the Yamaha pro amp manuals you will find a curve showing the distortion at different levels. The same is going on in a pre amp and low levels of sound signal is not easy to deal with, just think of the phono stage. So not just good things in the varigain volume, Yamaha also left the design with bough the C-2x and C-80.

Not saying the varigain is bad, just that it presents new problems.

yeah I don't know if I had it right on how Varigain actually works what it is though is remarkable.
I tried searching for information on it, and it looks like the only system currently employing the Vaigain is Accuphase C-2400 http://www.accuphase.com/cat/c-2400_e.pdf
they are calling it revolutionary but we all know now that Yamaha did it too in the C-70 so I question their claims.

I found one post sort of explaining the Varigain
http://www.echoloft.com/hifi-forum/index.php?topic=18473.msg216811#msg216811
"In short, it doesn't use resistors to control the volume hence no change in impedance, no degraded S/N ratio and frequency response. Very linear progression up or down volume. Although its call analog, it works like a digital volume control where you can adjust till 0.1 increments. Hence more precise and accurate with no degradation as time goes on when in other preamps, the conventional resistor has already aged"

 

[zangsax]

Comparison revue

I will try to get the C70 working. Nothing comes out of one side-its input independent even tape loop and independent of tone controls in or out so it's definitely output but the parametric eq doesn't seem to be working on the good channel so that's suspicious. I was a theory guy when I studied physics but as electronic tech I'm a minus 9 out of ten. I have never seen anything like this- It.s got A LOT more parts and boards than my SX1050 or SX1080 and the're receivers. I'll look for some one It's Maui after all. Shipping it in and out is about $80 ( It's alot heavier than the c-80) PS I'm liking this the sound of this Yamaha better than the Carver C-1 that I got to be a potential front end of my system. Next I need to find a clean ,warm sounding power amp that has much more power than my carver TFM 15 CB . Refurbishing one of those would also be a bad way to try to learn.electronics If the C-70 gets up and running I'll definitely do a comparison. I'm a pretty critical listener more than a numbers guy. ZANGSAX

 

[the-real-mandak]

well warm sounding kind of disqualifies Yamaha, only a few models gets remotly close to this with the MX-2000 (130W) first coming to my mind. The B-2x (170W) might also be an option, but I don't think any described it as realy warm in the sound and they are bough quite a step up from the C/M-70 setup.

It depends on you're speakers and the room.

 

[zangsax]

Great dynaudio contour 1.8 MK II speakers

My speakers are fabulous for my kind of listening. I had them in a less lively room with pioneer SX1080 and Beogram TX2 turntablei n Colorado I have the speakers and turntable and now a nice C-80 preamp here on Maui, but I need more power. My Carver TFM-15CB sound a bit thin. Does anyone think it would make sense to use 2 affordable hafflers for mono blocks. I wouldn,t bridge them because my speakers are nominal 4 ohms. You can get them from 200-375 a pair for DH 200 or DH 220. I would match them and put them right at the speakers using one side and connect to preamp with decent quality long or subwoofer cables. I'm new-I will try to be more thread conscious with my posts. Zangsax

 

[whoaru99]

My speakers are fabulous for my kind of listening. I had them in a less lively room with pioneer SX1080 and Beogram TX2 turntablei n Colorado I have the speakers and turntable and now a nice C-80 preamp here on Maui, but I need more power. My Carver TFM-15CB sound a bit thin. Does anyone think it would make sense to use 2 affordable hafflers for mono blocks. I wouldn,t bridge them because my speakers are nominal 4 ohms. You can get them from 200-375 a pair for DH 200 or DH 220. I would match them and put them right at the speakers using one side and connect to preamp with decent quality long or subwoofer cables. I'm new-I will try to be more thread conscious with my posts. Zangsax

Unless you're cranking the system hard all the time, and even then I'm not sure it would be a worthy endeavor, I don't think you'll get much value from using just one channel of a stereo amp.

While a different amp may somewhat alter the system performance if your speakers have difficult impedances, and the different amp is better at coping with them, the sheer power difference between the Hafler and Carver is essentially none (at least at 8 ohms, anyway).

 

[zangsax]

Thanks,Carver amps run in mono make more current available to the operating channel as I understand it. I was wondering if Hafflers did the same Zangsax

 

[whoaru99]

I always say if you want more power then buy more power. Don't rely on incremental "tricks" in attempt to get where you think you want to be.