Yamaha CR-1020 replacement relay question.

[Robisme]

I have a bad relay in my CR-1020. Well, it was bad. I cleaned and adjusted the contacts.

I have it out and hate to put it back in, though I have tested it repeatedly with a supply and meter, and it tests fine now.

The closest replacement I can find is an Omron LY2-0-DC12.

My question is, has anyone used this relay in a CR-1020, and if so, was a circuit board mod necessary for the coil pins?
It looks like they are orientated differently than the stock one.

If there is a better choice, please let me know.

Thanks,
Rob

 

[ryuuoh]

If that relay is electrically compatible, the pins are the thing. I just bought a relay for my L-80V, and the pins are for socket, I.E.too wide. I opened up the holes in the pcb to get it in. If your pins are 90 degrees off, you need to saw some holes, or find the proper relay.

 

[Detailman]

Rob
You probably have done this already but from what I have read it's usually the driving transistors in the circuit that fail.
There was a similar post not long ago but can't seem to find it now.
Don't know for sure but think all the xx20 series used the same or similar circuit.

 

[ecluser]

I have no particular experience with the 1020, but I know for sure that the relays are different in the 420 (24V) and the 620 (12V).

In the past, I experimented bad contact problems with the relay in one 420, and one 620 that I own. My numerous attempts to restore the contacts were unsuccessful, I had to restore the contacts again after a few months. The problem was that when I was listening music with my electret headphones (very low current), the sound was badly distorted. As soon as I connected the speakers, the sound was improved as if the high current to the speakers helped to "weld" momentarily the contacts inside the relay.

Finally I replaced the original relay (HC2a-P-DC12V) in the 620 by a Aromat RC2-H-AC12V. The Aromat has exactly the same current rating and the same pin-out, but the pins are larger and I had to enlarge the holes. Unlike the picture posted by avionic, the coil's pins have the same orientation as the contact's pins in the Aromat relay that I used. I don't know how are the pins in the 1020's relay.

I have the peace now, and since this bad experience I never restored the contacts inside the relays. I prefer to replace them with new ones, it takes less time and the fixing lasts longer.

 

[Dr. Ear]

Finder® (e.g. @ Farnell) makes suitable relays for almost all Yamaha amps with pcb pins, 12 and 24 Volts. No need to drill larger holes. The only modification that is sometimes necessary is to clip off two unused pins when there is only a 6-pole layout. The only exception I had was in a B-6 "Pyramid", where the Finder relay was a bit too high so I used a model from Tyco.

 

[merrylander]

When you remove a relay to clean the comntacts you should only use a burnisher, never a file. The other thing that you need to do is check the contact position, when the moving contact hits the fixed contact it must do so slightly before the armature hits the pole piece. This gives the contacts a slight wiping action that goes a long way toward keeping them clean. Thirteen years of adjusting relays in telephone plant tuaght me that much.

 

[Robisme]

Rob
You probably have done this already but from what I have read it's usually the driving transistors in the circuit that fail.
There was a similar post not long ago but can't seem to find it now.
Don't know for sure but think all the xx20 series used the same or similar circuit.

It was the relay contacts. They had over 100 ohms across them. And that was with the relay pulled.:yes:

When you remove a relay to clean the contacts you should only use a burnisher, never a file. The other thing that you need to do is check the contact position, when the moving contact hits the fixed contact it must do so slightly before the armature hits the pole piece. This gives the contacts a slight wiping action that goes a long way toward keeping them clean. Thirteen years of adjusting relays in telephone plant taught me that much.

I did have to adjust the contacts.:yes:

I stuck it back in (easy enough to get out again) and it works fine. I can wiggle the relay and tap it with no channel drop outs.

Before I pulled it it would pop and the left channel would come and go.

Rob

 

[Robisme]

Thanks for all the relay suggestions guys. I will look into them.

The CR-1020 uses a 12 volt. The coil pins are oriented like the contact pins.


Rob

 

[I_Wanna_Rock]

Hi Rob,
I was just wondering how you came out on your relay replacement. I'm waiting for my replacement to arrive. I inherited this Yamaha CR-1020 a little over a year ago, and have had intermittent relay issues with it ever since. Usually would "straighten out" and act right, but not this last time. I had this unit open a few times; one time to replace the tuner string and once just for a general cleaning/inspection. Any how, I just sunk a bundle into my TT for new arm, cart., etc..., and it decided to act up. So I've finally bit the bullet and have a replacement relay on the way. It won't be here for a few days. I'm tempted to pull it from it's place and check the solder joints but have no good place to "park" this monster interim. trying to get oriented before part arrives. thanks!
-John

 

[Robisme]

It was so long ago I don't remember. Sorry.

Rob

 

[I_Wanna_Rock]

Hi Rob,
I was just wondering how you came out on your relay replacement. I'm waiting for my replacement to arrive. I inherited this Yamaha CR-1020 a little over a year ago, and have had intermittent relay issues with it ever since. Usually would "straighten out" and act right, but not this last time. I had this unit open a few times; one time to replace the tuner string and once just for a general cleaning/inspection. Any how, I just sunk a bundle into my TT for new arm, cart., etc..., and it decided to act up. So I've finally bit the bullet and have a replacement relay on the way. I won't be here for a few days. I'm tempted to pull it from it's place and check the solder joints but have no good place to "park" this monster interim. trying to get oriented before part arrives. thanks!
-John

It was so long ago I don't remember. Sorry.
Well thanks for replying. I’ll be sure and post, (whatever happens) my endeavor!

Rob

 

[jayfree]

Only my opinion, but after dealing with several of these receivers over the years, both 1020 & 2020, the relay was never the problem.
It was either the circuit that drives the relay coil, due to age related failures, such as transistors going bad or heat damage to the board, or the circuit was doing what it is intended to do. If the relay is not clicking on, or it is clicking on and then clicking off, it is most likely working and is easy to test. If is is clicking on and remaining on, but no sound is coming from the speakers, it should be replaced.(MY2-02-DC12)

 

[I_Wanna_Rock]

Only my opinion, but after dealing with several of these receivers over the years, both 1020 & 2020, the relay was never the problem.
It was either the circuit that drives the relay coil, due to age related failures, such as transistors going bad or heat damage to the board, or the circuit was doing what it is intended to do. If the relay is not clicking on, or it is clicking on and then clicking off, it is most likely working and is easy to test. If is is clicking on and remaining on, but no sound is coming from the speakers, it should be replaced.(MY2-02-DC12)

Yes, I’m afraid you’re probably right. Trying to prepare for my next “bootcamp stereo 101”. I soldered new RCA inputs on my Denon turntable a while back, that’s about the extent of my soldering, at least concerning electronics…, Been trying to brush up on what I need to check. Have my trusty Fluke voltmeter at my side. I’m looking for some of those tiny little grip probes I will be placing black tape on the tips of my existing probes. I need to learn how to test resistors and capacitors I know the theory of capacitors, somewhat of resistors, not so sure how to do it with parts on the board still though? If I can find a table where this thing can live for a while, I will have half the battle won!
Every time it’s powered on and the relay engages, it works normally, but when it goes “out”, (during play) I will power off and back on but don’t hear the relay click. Other times I’ve left the unit powered on and after five or 10 minutes the relay will click in and unit will start working. In the beginning it was intermittent enough that I hoped it was just contacts needing to, “get used!”. The problem is becoming more frequent when the relay arrives I’m going to check as much as I can visually I’ve seen a few YouTube videos and have a general idea of where to start.

 

[jayfree]

Here are the probes you are looking for Link, but I'm not sure you can test the relay on board, or many other things for that matter, without at least removing one side.

 

[I_Wanna_Rock]

Here are the probes you are looking for Link, but I'm not sure you can test the relay on board, or many other things for that matter, without at least removing one side.

Yes that’s what I I figured also. My experience electrically was primarily heating and air-conditioning so I have soldered and I’ve checked plenty of capacitors; my experience working on tiny electronics, (at least to me it seems tiny) Is very limited. But the good thing is this is a hobby and I don’t have anybody looking over my shoulder. And I have my AudioKarma family! thank you for the link!!