Yet another year of sales growth for the vinyl format (albeit a more modest one).
- Thread starter Taketheflame
- Start date
I stick by my post, zero gouging going on. And 10's of thousands is still a novelty item in the big scheme of things.
ra7c7er
Hoarding records since 1990
I'm actually amazedby the closing prices (eBay) of many of the new albums I've purchased over the last decade. Not sure anybody is getting gouged.
Ebay (and Amazon) are hardly indicative of the industry. Both of those are just races to the bottom.
ra7c7er
Hoarding records since 1990
And I stick by mine. And in the grand scheme of things everything is a novelty so what.
Not trying to change minds just calling out the fuzzy math some of you guys like to use while yelling at the clouds.
ra7c7er
Hoarding records since 1990
Fuzzy math? What fuzzy math? The numbers are out there for everyone to see. The average price of a single new LP release in 2010 was sub 15 bucks. Granted at that time the Majors still didn't think vinyl was going to be anything. Today the average price of a single LP is 33 bucks. It's not fuzzy math.
And that is in line with what they were in the "good ole" days". So still a good value for the $$ spent. If you have a hard time with it don't buy new
Frank Sol
Lunatic Member
FWIW: Aforementioned new LP I bought
https://audiokarma.org/forums/index...-more-modest-one.1018367/page-4#post-16111491
Bottom line from Amazon to my door = $22.62
https://audiokarma.org/forums/index...-more-modest-one.1018367/page-4#post-16111491
Bottom line from Amazon to my door = $22.62
ra7c7er
Hoarding records since 1990
My point exactly. How is it that the majors are saying they can't do a release for less then 33 bucks but other labels are doing stuff for way less and giving the consumer more. It's gouging.
And that is in line with what they were in the "good ole" days". So still a good value for the $$ spent. If you have a hard time with it don't buy new
As I stated I'm not talking long term. I'm talking short term.
Do you not think Taylor Swifts Midnights cassette at 18.99 isn't gouging? When all the other new releases from that label had cassettes at 11.99?
No, they probably have a lot more invested in that release. And why are you flipping the script to tapes?
Bottom line for me is IMO all the bitching about new vinyls pricing is gaslighting
Cheers Peace Out
richamor
amateur house husband
All I can add is that my purchases over the past few years have been from less than major labels. The latest was Brothertigers "Out of Touch" that cost me a whopping $28.12. And $8.10 of that was tax and shipping. The LP itself was $20.02. That's more than reasonable in todays economy for something that will outlive me.
If I remember right, which is debatable, I was paying 3 of 4 bucks an album in 1970ish. And those would have been recent releases from the major producers. Using the attached inflation calculator that translates to $23 to $30 bucks. So no I wouldn't say that there's pervasive price gouging relative to past prices. However I would say that quality has diminished.
And no way wold I EVER pay $18.99 for anything from Taylor Swift. But that's just me
https://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflation/1970?amount=5
If I remember right, which is debatable, I was paying 3 of 4 bucks an album in 1970ish. And those would have been recent releases from the major producers. Using the attached inflation calculator that translates to $23 to $30 bucks. So no I wouldn't say that there's pervasive price gouging relative to past prices. However I would say that quality has diminished.
And no way wold I EVER pay $18.99 for anything from Taylor Swift. But that's just me
https://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflation/1970?amount=5
ra7c7er
Hoarding records since 1990
No, they probably have a lot more invested in that release. And why are you flipping the script to tapes?
Bottom line for me is IMO all the bitching about new vinyls pricing is gaslighting
You mentioned novelty so I threw a cassette in. You're right they did have more invested all their other releases came with a DL code.... oh wait they took that away for the Midnights release. Charge more give less.
I wish I was in your shoes. I don't make enough to not care that Sony and Universals new prices sheets are showing 30-50% increases.
Bottom line for me is that records are getting to expensive to enjoy but it's ok people like you can continue to try and gaslight me and others into believing things have always been this way. Maybe at some point I'll forget my own experience and believe you.
ra7c7er
Hoarding records since 1990
All I can add is that my purchases over the past few years have been from less than major labels. The latest was Brothertigers "Out of Touch" that cost me a whopping $28.12. And $8.10 of that was tax and shipping. The LP itself was $20.02. That's more than reasonable in todays economy for something that will outlive me.
If I remember right, which is debatable, I was paying 3 of 4 bucks an album in 1970ish. And those would have been recent releases from the major producers. Using the attached inflation calculator that translates to $23 to $30 bucks. So no I wouldn't say that there's pervasive price gouging relative to past prices. However I would say that quality has diminished.
And no way wold I EVER pay $18.99 for anything from Taylor Swift. But that's just me
https://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflation/1970?amount=5
The majority of my purchases too and I too have noticed a marked decline in quality. I reluctantly attribute it to production right now focusing on quantity massively over quality. Hopefully that gets a bit better soon. I expect indie releases to be cheaper but the difference in price between indie releases and majors have grown so much with majors taking away features has me question why. When indie stuff is still coming out between 20-24 bucks but the majors are 35+ something doesn't add up. Again I get some difference but 30% seems off.
As I said before I'm talking short term prices. 3 years ago record prices were vastly under inflation. Inflation isn't as good a calculator as people claim to to be. You an use it to go back to any time to fit whatever you want. I don't care about the price today vs. 1970. I care about the difference in price today to last year and the future. Price increases from majors over the last year don't add up when the rest of the industry isn't following.
ra7c7er
Hoarding records since 1990
At the end of the day myself and many others will happily plop down the $35 + the 30% if it happens, or we won't. Like most things here no one's mind will be changed and life will go on.
I do think you are right on that. I have a strong feeling the reason US price sheets are delayed but Canadian price sheets are out is because the majors are wanting to see what kind of push back they get and how bad it is. I also believe the small October price increase in the US was a way to get a bit of the 2023 increase out of the way so the number when the price sheets do come out they don't look as bad. Majors had 3 price increases in 2022 it'd be nice if they laid off a bit for 2023 but if the Canadian price sheets are any indication they aren't.
I do think Jack White is right. Majors need their own pressing plants ASAP. But they won't because they don't see vinyl as a real long term investment.
intro6
Well-Known Member
Good old supply & demand will eventually resolve this issue. It can sometimes take some time though. If prices seem higher than they should be, it's only because the music industries offering the products think that the current demand supports it. There was a similar effect with CDs in the 1980s where the price was significantly higher than preexisting formats (which were by and large cassette at that time). Even though the CD didn't cost any more to make than the cassette, the music industry was able to get away with the higher prices for the CD versions for some time because demand supported it, since CDs were the hot, new music technology that people desired. At a certain point though, the supply side kicked in and the prices were forced to come down.
I believe that a somewhat similar trend will play out with vinyl in these current times, albeit at a significantly smaller scale. On the one side, demand is definitely there, which the music companies are most definitely aware of, and therefore have adjusted their prices accordingly. Although the number of buyers is significantly smaller than the old days, their desire for the product seem to be just as intense. What's different than CDs in the 1980s is the supply side situation. It is most definitely lagging due to reliance on just a few existing pressing plants which are being strained to capacity by this demand. Now that it looks like the vinyl trend is not just a "flash in the pan" trend, I think that a certain number of new pressing plants will be built in order to meet current and future projected demand. Once this happens, the point of equilibrium will be reached as economists say, and the overall price and availability situation should normalize. It may take a while though.
intro6
Well-Known Member
The majors have the big names. That's how they can get away with it. These are the artists that are desired by the big majority of vinyl purchasers, so the big music companies know the demand is there. Unfortunately though, this also affects the lower selling artists who have also signed to the major labels, since these majors use a similar pricing strategy for those artists too, thinking that those artists also have their dedicated fans who will still fork over the money, even if it's in a begrudging fashion ... and they're probably right.
RunOutGroove
Addicted Member
It does seem like prices on LPs have moved faster than inflation has. Even with the resurgence in the format though and the relatively larger runs that have been happening, it's still a very small amount compared with the past and maybe that combined with relatively higher costs for the materials and manufacture is the reason for the high prices... and not just speculation. Not that I'm very sure of any of this, just thinking out loud...
Odd and sad to me that the quality these days seems to be so off, particularly since vinyl has been marketed as some kind of real connoisseur type item. Back in the late 80s - early 90s when the industry was all about pushing the new format, CDs it seemed like the stuff that still was available on vinyl was a bit of an afterthought and I notice from records that I bought that the quality was pretty bad. You could get a brand new album that had all kinds of clicks and pops as if it was worn out and the vinyl itself was often far thinner and prone to warping. These days though it seems that there's not as good an excuse for that kind of thing.
Late Boomer
Super Member
I would agree with them on that. Streaming is growing faster than physical media is rebounding, and all sorts of digital occupy comfortable 90% market share. With streaming and downloads, there is no need to make physical product, no need to transport and stock it, no need to hire salespeople. Physical product is a hassle. Majors are not stupid. If people with masochistic tendencies want to bother with physical media and even want to pay for it dearly, then the majors would be foolish not to charge through the nose for the "experience of physical media".
It is funny to observe how twenty years ago people flocked to iTunes and such, downloading music $1 a song, because it was safe and legal and inexpensive, and one did not have to pay for all the other crud on an album. This was the time when people cared about music, not about how they want it to be packaged or whether AAC @ 160 Kbit/s was true CD quality or whether vinyl offered something that digital could not.
Today, those who buy vinyl pay for having their music packaged in a certain way, for having a tactile and visual experience besides simply having unrestricted access to their favorite songs. In other words, a rather bourgeois desire of those having extra cash to spend. Labels would be foolish to miss such an opportunity to get these customers back onto the "full album experience" train. But will they be able to bring everyone back? I don't think so. Physical media will remain a niche thing, and as such will be expensive. I would stock up on cheap CDs from thrifts, but browsing through bins I don't see much of interest for me. In fact, there was more interesting stuff on cassettes than on CDs, when I frequented my nearby LP/CD/DVD/VHS/cassette warehouse. The owner has died, and the remaining stock has been sold wholesale, the warehouse closed. It was fun buying cassettes for 50 cents while it lasted.