Tin Bird
Active Member
My TEAC has smoothed out after a few weeks of use. No more brightness at all..just simply sounds great. 
If it had just a tick more low end, I might prefer it to the Onkyo. The Onkyo does sound a bit more veiled overall...less detail...I still prefer it to the TEAC, but it's close.
If it had just a tick more low end, I might prefer it to the Onkyo. The Onkyo does sound a bit more veiled overall...less detail...I still prefer it to the TEAC, but it's close.Interpolated "guesses" are not the same as actual data.
Click here for John Atkinson's take.
"The data on the CD are described as 16-bit words, which covers 65,536 signal levels. Any time you apply processing to a digital datatstream, you increase the length of the words. In the case of the DAC chip used by the Benchmark, it accepts 24-bit data, so I assume that the data coming from the sample-rate converter chip are 24-bit words, which can describe 16,777,216 signal levels.
Even so, the sample-rate conversion does not add resolution that wasn't preserved in the CD's data, only that the use of 24-bit data presented to the DAC chip maximizes the mathematical precision of the conversion."
Last edited:
Indeed. As for me, I find the power supply and analog output design and implementation makes a more significant audible difference than just considering the DAC chip or series of ladders implemented.
Your BAT is likely like my Audio Research DAC8 employing separate (and stiff) linear power supplies for the digital and analog sections. With each one using a low noise R-core transformer. The analog stages are balanced, zero feedback class A designs using discrete devices. While mine uses JFETs, Mr. Khomenko likes the 6H30 supertube.
Last edited:
Tin Bird
Active Member
Guys...quick question....I have been using my TEAC CD player in my bedroom system. It sounds great! However, last night while listening to it, it started skipping like crazy out of the blue. I assumed that the CD was dirty or had a scratch on it so I took it out and wiped it down with a cloth. Upon putting the CD back in, the player immediately began skipping like crazy again. I took that CD out and put in a different CD that I had listened to the other day (and had played perfectly..which every CD had done up until this point) and it too skipped and then the CD player read no disc and I could not eject the disc. I tried ejecting over and over and nothing happened. I got the manual out and it said that if the CD player malfunctions it could be due to interference from other electronics and to unplug it and wait a while. I did this and it then worked fine. I had placed the CD player on the top of my Sony micro system...I have now moved it off of there and placed it on the top of the dresser. I did notice that the top of the Sony was warm when I removed the CD player. What do you guys think...interference, overheating, or malfunctioning unit? I have only had the thing for a month and it literally has worked 100% perfectly until now.
Last edited:
Tin Bird
Active Member
Recently purchased a Pro-Ject CD Box DS CD player. This little guy is a very charming sounding player. Very detailed, very nice separation of instruments, adequate bass, pretty good soundstage... I am smitten with this thing. It uses the same DAC as the much vaunted TEAC PD-H600...the Burr Brown PCM1796. It was actually an eBay purchase. Guy said he had bought it for a second system, but never used it. Not a single scratch on the thing. The display still had the tape over it. Got a deal at $250. Very, very pleased with this unit. I now have/use the TEAC in my bedroom system and have now replaced my Onkyo C7030 with the Pro-Ject.
62vauxhall
Addicted Member
And then there's 1 bit. There are two that I listen to periodically (HK HD7600 & NAD 502) that sound damn good to me.
Lavane
Lunatic Member
I have a factory refurbed, (looked brand new to me) so called pro model CD player with the big dumb spead wheel on it. It was cheap and low profile, perfect for use at my bench. The thing has a 4, 8 and 16 % selector button. Its been a perfect fit for my bench, but the manual was very limited and didn't really explain the
% button. Default is 8%. I really don't notice a difference in postitions.
% button. Default is 8%. I really don't notice a difference in postitions.
ev13wt
Super Member
There are two different truths out there.
Objective: Make no difference, and high res in general is nothing that anyone can actually hear. Google Nyquist. Done) Yea ok, headroom in studio recording might be a small advantage, one less headroom thing to worry about. Yes we can supply data or setup blind listening tests to prove you can't hear it.
Subjective: Makes a ton of difference, not everything is measurable and some thing only manifest themselves after enough time / listening / burn in. More bits mean a finely chopped up wave = more samples to playback the audio complex waveform moar betterer. Blind tests are irrelevant, because audio hearing is close to something spiritual (and you can't measure everything)
Choose your poison.
Objective: Make no difference, and high res in general is nothing that anyone can actually hear. Google Nyquist. Done) Yea ok, headroom in studio recording might be a small advantage, one less headroom thing to worry about. Yes we can supply data or setup blind listening tests to prove you can't hear it.
Subjective: Makes a ton of difference, not everything is measurable and some thing only manifest themselves after enough time / listening / burn in. More bits mean a finely chopped up wave = more samples to playback the audio complex waveform moar betterer. Blind tests are irrelevant, because audio hearing is close to something spiritual (and you can't measure everything)
Choose your poison.
Tin Bird
Active Member
I will go on record and say without equivocation that the Pro-Ject CD Box DS has MUCH more clarity than the Onkyo C7030. It's like night and day difference...even my kids can hear a significant difference. Whether it's the DAC or analog filters (or both), there is a big time difference. Hearing things in songs I've listened to for years that I never heard before and everything is so well balanced and clearly presented. really amazing. I am really over the moon with this little CD player. To be honest, I am surprised...with all of the love that the C7030 has been getting...the Pro-Ject really does make the Onkyo sound like the budget player that it is. Now, whether or not going up to thousands of dollars for a CD player continues to make this much difference or not...I do not know. I know if I was a rich man I would be looking at the Hegel Mohican CD player though...
Djcoolray
Addicted Member
I think that how well the Onkyo C-7030 sounds depends on too many things. If the amp being used has the same technical specifications of sensitivity, dampening and distortion the detail and soundstage will be more omni present. I was actually looking at the more expensive CD players when I read the reviews on the player and noticed that the specs were almost exactly the same as my amp and EQ. I tried all the CD players from BB, The Guitar Store and the PX on base and nothing compared to the 7030. Now if I had a different amp with different capabilities it would not sound the same. So truthfully, the only way to judge this CD player is by only using the front panel headphone jack and a pair of Sennheizer 650's which I did and the only player that sounded better was the Marantz SA-14S1 and not by much. When I put the SA-14S1 into my system it lacked soundstage compared to the 7030. So a review of sound is dependent on all the equipment involved and not just the capabilities of the one piece....a super expensive unit just might not sound any better than what you have right now.
EyeGee
Big Ears
I picked up an Assemblage DAC which has the HDCD capability. Have amassed about 20 HDCDs and I have to say I find the audio quality a significant improvement, at least on my system. However I have noticed a lot of variation amongst the different CDs. For example, an 8 Bold Souls CD has a great deal more clarity, presence and instrument separation/definition via the HDCD circuit. However, a Thad Jones big band HDCD does not really present those same qualities. the lone Duke Ellington HDCD, "Blues in Orbit" really sounds fantastic via HDCD, as does the Art Ensemble's "Fanfare for the Warriors". But a Paquito de Rivera HDCD release, "100 Years of Latin Love Songs" does not really distinguish itself in the same manner as those two.
the entire Roxy Music catalog is available on HDCD but again, I've found that the Bryan Ferry HDCD solo recordings push their qualities a bit further than the Roxy HDCDs.
Mostly I'm frustrated by the scant choices for HDCDs. As I'm not a Grateful Dead or Neil Young fan, that removes a lot of possibilities.
Tin Bird
Active Member
Yes, the other equipment matters...certainly amp/speakers...etc. Don't get me wrong, I am not bad mouthing the 7030 at all. For $139 it is a terrific CD player. To my ears, it has a very balanced, slightly warm sound to it that i think appeals to a lot of people (including me). The Pro-Ject is quite a bit more detailed, airy, concise.. everything is presented in a crystal clear manner. I literally did a A/B comparison with my same equipment going back and forth several times between the two to make sure I was hearing what I was hearing and the Pro-Ject simply brings the music to life that much more. The 7030 sounds slightly veiled and ever so bass bloated in comparison. Of course if you are buying the Pro-Ject brand new, you are talking $800 vs $139, so the Pro-Ject SHOULD sound significantly better.
Djcoolray
Addicted Member
But, I can't say the same about the Pro-Ject CD Box in my system. I went on base and got the Pro-Ject at the PX (military mall) on sale and listened to it individually and in my system A-2-B comparison. The C-7030 sounded better in my system due to the technical similarities shared between my receiver, EQ and the C-7030. The Pro-Ject probably shared more technical similarities with your system. A result of a complete system can not be defined by one component. I used the headphone output to initially to analyze the sound after a two week period of each player I tested because I didn't have anything better to do at that time. The Pro-Ject had less body and a lesser amount tonal qualities, like something was missing. But, hey if you liked it.....that's all that matters. What I was getting at was that I could not conceive that a C-7030 would sound good in every system. Sound is a match between the source, the amp and the speakers.... I think someone called it synergy! I don't think that the C-7030 is the best player, but if your amp has real low THD and high S/N this player is gonna sound great.
PD-301 uses PCM5142DAC it accepts 32 bits data stream. This player does NOT play high-res files.
Features
- Programmable miniDSP
- Market-Leading Low Out-of-Band Noise
- Selectable Digital-Filter Latency and Performance
- No DC Blocking Capacitors Required
- Integrated Negative Charge Pump
- Intelligent Muting System; Soft Up or Down Ramp
and Analog Mute For 120-dB Mute SNR - Integrated High-Performance Audio PLL with
BCK Reference To Generate SCK Internally - Accepts 16-, 20-, 24-, And 32-Bit Audio Data
- PCM Data Formats: I2S, Left-Justified, Right-
Justified, TDM / DSP - SPI or I2C Control
- Software or Hardware Configuration
- Automatic Power-Save Mode When LRCK And
BCK Are Deactivated - 1.8-V or 3.3-V Fail-Safe LVCMOS Digital Inputs
- Single Supply Operation:
3.3-V Analog, 1.8-V or 3.3-V Digital - Integrated Power-On Reset
- Small 28-pin TSSOP Package
ev13wt
Super Member
We really need engineers to check the work of engineers. If 16 bit sounds different than 24 bit, one or both devices have been poorly engineered, or some marketing dudes told them to create some EQing into it - aka "house sound". Which of course happens in the real world.If one sounds analytical, then someone added eq. If it sounds warm, same thing. Its design.
But don't reduce the differences to bits. They have absolutely nothing to do with it.
But don't reduce the differences to bits. They have absolutely nothing to do with it.