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300B SET vs. PP EL84 sonics?

eickmewg

eickmewg

Well-Known Member
I've become interested in a 300B SET. I have a Magnavox 9300-series PP EL84/6BQ5 amp good for about 12 wpc. Seems 300B amps go 8-10 wpc. I am using POLK SRS SDA 2.3 92 dB efficiency speakers and the Magnavox does fine on them volume wise. I expect the 300B would also fit the speakers, my listening room, and my listening preferences. Not wanting to open a can or worms here, and understanding the subjectivity involved, what might I expect to be the major differences between these amp types? There seem to be many 300B SET amps of Chinese origin that would all run about the same price and would work for the budget. Which might be worth a serious consideration? I am quite satisfied with the Magnavox, but the grass is always greener, so to speak. I also have a Latino VTA ST-120 with KT 120 power tubes and a Yaqin MS30-L with KT 77 tubes that I rotate with the Magnavox. Thanks for your help.

Bill
 
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The hackneyed phrase "lifting a veil" applies, IMO and IME, to SE vs. PP amplifiers (in general* -- a sweeping statement!).
You might want to (first) compare a SE and PP EL84 amp (in the former case, native mode is OK, triode-wired is worth a listen, too).

IME one gets more flesh and blood real-ness from a good SE amp (and chances are anyone investing in 300B amplifier construction is probably using at least decent passive components and transformers) than almost any PP amp.

EDIT: this guy doesn't agree: http://audiokarma.org/forums/index....-triode-tube-amps.570028/page-2#post-12312441

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* and always remember, all generalizations are false, including this one.
 
eickmewg said:
I am using POLK SRS SDA 2.3 92 dB efficiency speakers
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The "92db" spec only tells half the story, the other half is the Polk's impedance. If it is fairly smooth, I think you will really like the 300b. If it varies a lot the PP might be the better choice.

Re sonics...I do like the el84 a lot but the 300b (with the right speaker) tugs at my heart the most.
 
I like to listen to my well detailed 300B sound sometimes, 1/4 of time, but when I do, I miss the EL84 PP sweetness and neutrality.

But, why I found my 300B less sweet and neutral, is that it uses 12AT7 + 6SN7 + 300B while my EL84 PP only uses 12AX7 + EL84 , very more direct circuit, less times amplified by diferent parts for the same watts, sounds more natural.

Choose the amp with the least tube complement, don't abuse of good things.
 
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My 300B has been getting a lot of use lately. It just sounds so damn real. Don't know how else to explain it. With some music the PP amp sounds better. But with vocals and acoustic music it really shines. Not that it won't do justice to some Psychobilly music or even some Zappa. :biggrin:
 
I am listening to my Elekit TU-8600 with the Lundahl OPT right now, it’s still breaking in, but it’s pretty amazing already with my DeVore the nines speakers, the 9w is plenty with volume never getting above 12 on the volume control. After a couple of weeks I will roll in some new 300b’s I think (perhaps going to gold lion px300b from the Shuguang I have in there now). Not quite the incisive bass (more “rounded” I’d say at least in these early stages) that my leben cs300xs has but I am liking what it does to the midrange and the overall relaxation of it.
 
I am sure it varies depending on the specific 300b s.e.t. amp vs. el-84 p/p amp, but here is my experience, I own both and connect them to some vintage Altec speakers. The el-84 sounds clear and without coloration, the 300b sounds fuller and richer and personally I prefer it for most of the music I currently listen to, primarily focused on vocals....
 
I'd go with the PP EL84 plus there are plenty of people still making these tubes for cheap and it gives you more speaker options.

300b tubes are crazy expensive.
 
With the right set of speakers, a well designed 300B amplifier yields a very effortless reproduction of recorded music, in a way that, to my ears, is singular in its sense of "beign there".

PS: most likely you would like the 300b better if you listen to acoustic instruments (classical and jazz, for example) where distortion is an important issue.
 
In fact I ended up getting an Elekit 8200 6L6GC single-ended amp kit. The 300b 8600 was too rich for the pocket book. I am using some Black Treasure KT88's and old Conn 12AU7 tubes in SEUL and it sounds very nice. Of course, how close it might be to the 300b sound I can't tell!
 
I’ve also been interested in 300b amps, the Elekit TU8600 specifically. The cost is a reality shock with the Lundahl xformer upgrade. I’ve also been mulling the Dynaco ST70 kits.

I’ve been restless and my choices have been all over the map. It seems when you have something very good then you are drawn to buy something even better, usually more expensive.

I built the DynaKit ST35. I purchased the tube cage which looked awesome. Of course it is a PP el84 amp. It was a fun build, sounded great but I sold it after 6 months. I don’t know why. It will likely drive your 92db easily and sound great. It’s a fine kit.

With SET amps, though, speaker selection is more critical. The low output of SET amps require efficient, well behaved speakers to get the most out of that amp. The Elekit TU8600 w/Lundahl upgrade is a serious investment. Do your homework is my advice.
 
Jim Creek said:
I’ve been restless and my choices have been all over the map. It seems when you have something very good then you are drawn to buy something even better, usually more expensive.
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Statement of the Decade!! How true is this. Im in the same boat, always searching for something better and not knowing which to get.
 
I use my 300B for mostly music with acoustic instruments and is great for vocals and piano. Over all though I think I prefer SEUL amps. Pentodes seem to be able to do it all pretty well. Triode mode, pentode and UL all at the flick of a switch if you want.
 
Lavane said:
I use my 300B for mostly music with acoustic instruments and is great for vocals and piano. Over all though I think I prefer SEUL amps. Pentodes seem to be able to do it all pretty well. Triode mode, pentode and UL all at the flick of a switch if you want.
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I agree with this practice 100%. After listening to my SET amp I turn on the ST35 and there’s that “ah that’s what I’m missing”! Then I go to the SET and there’s the sweetness of that offering. It’s all good just different is how I would describe it. It’s nice to have one of each.
 
playittwice said:
I agree with this practice 100%. After listening to my SET amp I turn on the ST35 and there’s that “ah that’s what I’m missing”! Then I go to the SET and there’s the sweetness of that offering. It’s all good just different is how I would describe it. It’s nice to have one of each.
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Exactly how I feel.

For amps... I'll rotate around with a SET, el84, el34, kt88, PP300b for the tube flavor. I also have Pass XA.5's and a Bedini 45/45 that get air time once in awhile. I love the sound each of those bring to the table.
 
Now, my amp that have the most listening is my SE 6L6 / 6SL7 in triode mode.

Only one triode of the 6SL7 per channel.

My SE KT88 in triode mode use two 6SN7 triodes per channel, give more bass and punch, but not as natural.
 
mroboto said:
Now, my amp that have the most listening is my SE 6L6 / 6SL7 in triode mode.

Only one triode of the 6SL7 per channel.

My SE KT88 in triode mode use two 6SN7 triodes per channel, give more bass and punch, but not as natural.
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Those are my feelings about KT-88's in general. Very punchy, but sorta lacking in the midrange.
 
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