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Accuphase E305 amp sound : not impressed!

B

bennybee

Active Member
My Accuphase E305 integrated amp is a bit of a disappointment : it does reveal more detail and sounds more precise than my Sony TA-FA50ES integrated, but that's about it. The bass is perhaps a tad tighter but less deep than the Sony. Right after powering up the Accuphase the sound is extremely bright : I need to turn the treble all the way down. Only after about half an hour, when the unit has warmed up, I can turn the treble back to neutral.
I even prefer the sound of my Quad 303 over the Accuphase (see my today's post in the AK thread 'What's British in your system')
OK, the Accuphase is built like a luxury tank and is very nice to look at. That's why I wanted one. And it sounded nice in the second hand audio shop where I bought it. However, back home it fails to make me tap my feet.
The set-up for testing : Sony CDP-XA50ES / Denon DCD1400 cd players and Advent Heritage speakers.
I was on the lookout for a matching Accuphase DP-60 or DP-70 CD player (also said to be both 'extremely good'), but I'm rather hesitant now.
Anyone else here underwhelmed by the famous Accuphase sound?
 
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What was different in the set-up of the shop where you bought it? Maybe the component synergy is completely different (speakers, source etc.), or the room size, placement & sonic colorings.
 
Of course everything was different. I don't remember exactly what speakers were used, but they were TOTL Heco or Elac bookshelf speakers. The CD player was a Revox H2.
I drove 350 kilometers to pick up the amp I had 'won' on evilbay and did not bring my own speakers or my Sony amp to compare with. I did bring a couple of CD's that I know well enough though, but obviously there were no other reference points. The Accuphase had obviously been running warm till I arrived and my son and I could immediately tell from memory that there was more detail and precise positioning of the voices and instruments.
Back home, what is missing is the engagement, the foot-tapping enjoyment that I had expected from an Accuphase. Mind you, the Sony does not always deliver that either... The Quad 303 OTOH did strike me as coming closer to it... occasionally.
Maybe it's the combination of the Accupahse with the Advent speakers that is not right. I am however rather inclined to think that the Accuphase sound is hyped up. Maybe I'm just expecting too much?
 
the only Accuphase i have owned was the c-200 pre and the p-300 power amp and although i thought the preamp was very good the combo was not good enough to unseat my pioneer spec gear i owned at the time

it is safe to say i was underwhelmed with those two but i have no experience with your model , i do think the Sony es gear was underrated in its sound quality and not a bit surprised it does well in comparison to Accuphase
 
I too have not heard the E-305. I owned a E-202 from new in 1977 to 1985. In it's era, the E 202 had few peers. Sound was full, deep, fast, and smooth. It leaned towards the warm side mid & highs. I have a friend who has the E-303, and he says that it very detailed and extended on both top and bottom. He describes it as very neutral and clear, neither warm nor bright. He has B&W Nautilus 805 speakers.

I will say that I found the Denon DCD 1400 CDP a bit bright sounding. Any chance a friend has some decent brand speakers you can try with the E-305?
 
If you have to turn the treble control all the way down and after half an hour back again to neutral, there is only one conclusion: there must be something defective.
 
I was already afraid that the amp may need a recap or overhaul, and that this could have been the reason why the first owner wanted to sell it. When I opened the amp the first day I got it I cleaned and checked it : no visible issues with any parts and no signs of tampering or repairs.
I read in the Accuphase SM that there are test points and a trimmer for the bias current on both power amp boards. Should I check if those currents are correct and equal on both channels? Can that influence the sound as described above?
Is it normal for a transistor integrated to need half an hour of warming up before it sounds good?
If the Denon DCD1400 is known to sound bright, I will start with swapping it with my Sony XA50ES, which is currently hooked up in my main system in the living room. Maybe that will clarify things a bit.
 
bennybee:

I had the Denon DCD1400 loaned to me by a friend while I was having a vintage Kyocera DA-910 CD player being repaired. I had it in my system for about 2 weeks. At that time I had B&W P5 speakers that had a pretty laid back tweeter and the Denon sounded bright. Others here may have a different take. I am also surprised about the treble needing to be turned down on the E-305. I would tend to agree with gslikker on his post that something may be defective or in need of adjustment. :scratch2:
 
Thanks gslikker and Amphead.
Looks like it's time to swap the DCD1400 with the Sony player and see how the E305 sounds with that one.
I also have to add that last year I upgraded the crossovers on the Advent speakers : I replaced the old electrolytic caps by Solen caps. Since then they also sound a little brighter than before, which would add up to the Denon's brightness of course. But the Sony amp didn't seem to mind too much.
Will let you know what the result is. Thanks all !
 
I would certainly check the bias and offset. No concrete way to assess the amp without eliminating that variable.
 
I was just saying something must be wrong/defective. However, I never encountered a situation having tweaking down the brightness and the need to tweak it up after some time.
I also cannot think of any fault that could cause such a thing, if the sound is otherwise good exept of this tone control issue. main amp offset and bias would not be involved, for a problem like this
 
Well lets not forget the jerks tweaking the orig. cuts on fm and all thinking they are 'dub masters'.

Not my stuff that doesn't reproduce. media that sucks.
 
gslikker, I understand what you're saying. If this particular brand/model of amplifier is supposed to sound good right after switching it on and mine needs 30min. to get there, then indeed maybe something is wrong with it. Probably ageing components somewhere but I'm no technician and won't start replacing caps or anything.
The only thing I may try myself is turning a trim potmeter till my DMM reads 10mV on both channels. But only IF you guys think that the issue on hand might come from a bias current deviation over time.

I've been thinking : if the Denon DCD1400 player is known to sound bright and the Accuphase amplifier reveals this better than my other amps, then perhaps the sound improvement after 30min. (less 'trebly') could be due to the Denon warming up - not the Accuphase warming up ??
 
gslikker said:
I was just saying something must be wrong/defective. However, I never encountered a situation having tweaking down the brightness and the need to tweak it up after some time.
I also cannot think of any fault that could cause such a thing, if the sound is otherwise good exept of this tone control issue. main amp offset and bias would not be involved, for a problem like this
Click to expand...
Hi....did you ever solve the issue with your E305.....I too have heard many good things about this amp....and am going to go see one in a couple weeks.....would like to know if you ever became happy with yours?

Cheers
 
I had a fully reconditioned C200 and P300 amplifier combo.

I ended up selling them. Perhaps an advantage they had over other gear was "transparency" but that just wasnt enough to choose them over more engaging, or just more fun-sounding gear.
 
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bennybee said:
My Accuphase E305 integrated amp is a bit of a disappointment : it does reveal more detail and sounds more precise than my Sony TA-FA50ES integrated, but that's about it. The bass is perhaps a tad tighter but less deep than the Sony. Right after powering up the Accuphase the sound is extremely bright : I need to turn the treble all the way down. Only after about half an hour, when the unit has warmed up, I can turn the treble back to neutral.
I even prefer the sound of my Quad 303 over the Accuphase (see my today's post in the AK thread 'What's British in your system')
OK, the Accuphase is built like a luxury tank and is very nice to look at. That's why I wanted one. And it sounded nice in the second hand audio shop where I bought it. However, back home it fails to make me tap my feet.
The set-up for testing : Sony CDP-XA50ES / Denon DCD1400 cd players and Advent Heritage speakers.
I was on the lookout for a matching Accuphase DP-60 or DP-70 CD player (also said to be both 'extremely good'), but I'm rather hesitant now.
Anyone else here underwhelmed by the famous Accuphase sound?
Click to expand...

Wait.. Your amp needs to warm up? Like an automobile? Why?
And you detect a discernible difference in sound quality after letting the amp warm up?
Ive never heard of this before. Are you sure there isnt something wrong with it?

Edit*
Perhaps i should read through the entire thread before opening my mouth.
 
I recently purchased an E305...it had seen little and very light use over the last 25 years. Switched it on at home and it good but not great...a little grainy in upper bass and dull on the high end. A friend who heard it on day one was not impressed and thought me mad for getting it....I left the amp on continuously and each day it seemed to be improving in sound quality...4 days later that same friend came by again....and said...now I know why you got it...it sounds great. I leave this amp on all the time...and it bests my Luxman separates, my Rotel and Marantz pieces etc. Just paired it with a Accuphase DP75v with xlrs and this pairing is simply magical...it is now in a class of very hifi. I hope BennyB that you have been able to sort yours out. I watched a short video from Accuphase...an engineer was talking about one of their newer amps and said do not do any critical listening for at least one week of running....never would have believed it myself had I not gone through it myself.2BDB336F-7612-4C05-9C16-944C6A8D8B5E.jpeg
 
PROJECT 2501 said:
Wait.. Your amp needs to warm up? Like an automobile? Why?
And you detect a discernible difference in sound quality after letting the amp warm up?
I've never heard of this before. Are you sure there isn't something wrong with it?
Click to expand...

A lot of people have experienced this; all equipment has an operating temperature that is higher than when off.
I can't say I have noticed this on every piece that I have owned, but it is definitely true for many of them.
Tube equipment IME seems to get to the "sounds better" point quicker than solid state and as mentioned above I have had solid state that sounded much better when left on.
 
opnly bafld said:
A lot of people have experienced this; all equipment has an operating temperature that is higher than when off.
I can't say I have noticed this on every piece that I have owned, but it is definitely true for many of them.
Tube equipment IME seems to get to the "sounds better" point quicker than solid state and as mentioned above I have had solid state that sounded much better when left on.
Click to expand...

This is all new to me. Which i find strange since im not exactly young and have been around audio equipment most of my life.
Is there an official explanation for this?
 
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