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Altec 19's

I use Model 19 components, the same ones that you have, in custom MLTL cabinets with the 811 in their own supports. I've moved them forward and backward and really can't tell much of a difference with driver offset. The build thread is here if you want to take a look.

If you want to experiment with mateials for edge diffraction and the 811, foam pipe insulation is cheap and sold at the big-box stores. I didn't find any improvement by using it but my horn sleds don't have the hard edge of the Model 19 cabs or yours.

By all means, protect the woofers from damage, they are getting scarce in good condition and will be difficult to replace. I like your cabinets, getting the woofer and the horn into a higher aspect just improved an already worthy speaker, IMO. :thmbsp:
 
Thanks Westend. I found the thread on your speaker build interesting and informative. You did a great job on your build. I read every post, except a couple about the weather. Wish I lived closer, I would love to hear them.

I will look into the foam pipe insulation.
 
After living with my Altec's for a few months I still really enjoy them. One thing I noticed, there is quite a difference between the woofers. One has less bass and more treble. I think it's caused by a repair for a small tear in the cone, the surround appears to have an additional coating. I was able to balance out the difference between them with the Z-19 crossovers. To my ears they now sound the same or very close to each other.

I made a pair of speaker grills to protect the woofers, they fit nice and snug so nothing additional was needed to hold them in place.

With my daughters help I added lettering to the speakers that closely duplicated the font used by Altec in an ad for the model 19's. I was trying to make the cabinets look like something Altec might have done had they made the cabinets.
 

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Looks cool! I might be looking at some 416 woofers and beat up 7 cabinets soon.

Are there major differences between the 416-8A and B woofers except for production dates?
 
Dukiedook said:
Looks cool! I might be looking at some 416 woofers and beat up 7 cabinets soon.

Are there major differences between the 416-8A and B woofers except for production dates?
Click to expand...

I'm not an expert by any stretch as I'm new to Altec's, but I'll take a stab at it.

The 416-A has a smaller frame so the opening should be smaller than with a 416-B. The 416-B can be front mounted or rear mounted, the 416-A is rear mount only. I believe most 416-A's are 16 ohm, and 416-B is 8 ohm. There is a 8 ohm version of the 416-A but I read they are rare. I believe the 416-B has better bass.
 
GTOJim said:
I'm not an expert by any stretch as I'm new to Altec's, but I'll take a stab at it.

The 416-A has a smaller frame so the opening should be smaller than with a 416-B. The 416-B can be front mounted or rear mounted, the 416-A is rear mount only. I believe most 416-A's are 16 ohm, and 416-B is 8 ohm. There is a 8 ohm version of the 416-A but I read they are rare. I believe the 416-B has better bass.
Click to expand...

I know that you were trying to be helpful, so don't take this as a slap:

The question was about the difference between the 416-8A and the 416-8B. The 416-A is a different driver to the 416-8A. The 416-A was 16ohm. The 416-8A was 8 ohm.
 
theophile said:
I know that you were trying to be helpful, so don't take this as a slap:

The question was about the difference between the 416-8A and the 416-8B. The 416-A is a different driver to the 416-8A. The 416-A was 16ohm. The 416-8A was 8 ohm.
Click to expand...

Sorry I stand corrected I left off the 8's in my post. I meant the 416-8A verses 416-8B. The frames are different, 416-8A is a smaller frame than the 416-8B. The 416-8A is rear mounting, 416-8B mounting is either front or rear.

Thought I read the 416-8A was usually 16ohm but I stand corrected. Sorry for my error and omission of the 8's in my post above
 
GTOJim said:
Sorry I stand corrected I left off the 8's in my post. I meant the 416-8A verses 416-8B. The frames are different, 416-8A is a smaller frame than the 416-8B. The 416-8A is rear mounting, 416-8B mounting is either front or rear.

Thought I read the 416-8A was usually 16ohm but I stand corrected. Sorry for my error and omission of the 8's in my post above
Click to expand...
416-8A can be found in either the old style 15 inch or new style 16 inch frame.
 
GTOJim said:
My cabinets are not as wide as factory so they won't fit, there is very little space between the edge of the horn and the lip of the cabinet.
Click to expand...

If the price is reasonable, couldn't you simply trim them down to fit the width of your cabinets?
 
Sam Cogley said:
If the price is reasonable, couldn't you simply trim them down to fit the width of your cabinets?
Click to expand...

I've considered it, I think I would basically end up cutting the ends off or very come very close to removing the ends. If this is the case I would really only end up with the top and bottom pieces.

I did add deadening material to the horn that's hidden inside the cabinet. Tapping on the horn it has a very slight ring with a hard tap, with a light tap I'm not detecting any ring. I tried wedging a dreading material along the top and bottom edges of the horn and honestly I didn't notice any difference with or with out it. Since I've had the speakers for a few months maybe it wouldn't hurt to try it again as I've gotten used to how they sound, I might notice slight changes I didn't detect before.

i added a couple of thin cork strips along the inside edges of the lip of the cabinet that are very close to the edges of the horn to possibly help with reflections. At the time I didn't detect a difference, maybe I'll put more cork over what is already there as it's pretty thin. I like the cork as it blends with the color of the cabinets, it's not noticeable with normal room lighting. Not sure how well cork works on cutting down reflections.

Thank you for your suggestion, someday I might try ordering the foam and cut it down but right now I'm afraid it would be a waste of money. Maybe after tinkering with them I'll change my mind.
 
bowtie427ss said:
416-8A can be found in either the old style 15 inch or new style 16 inch frame.
Click to expand...

I stand corrected again. Think I better stick with listening/enjoying my 19's as I do not want to give incorrect information or advice.

Kind of like the old saying "I know just enough to be dangerous".

I assembled my 19's without ever hearing a pair, these are the first and only 19's I've had the pleasure of listening to and it was not a disappointment.
I'll keep enjoying my Altec's and let the experts give advice.
 
After several months the Altec's are my favorite. Below I listed a few other pairs of speakers that I have owned for awhile. Although I haven't listened to the L200's for quite awhile, there is something about them I like. I liked them when I first heard them in a listening room in 1971. Told my dad about them and he purchased a pair. When my dad retired 30 years ago I purchased his pair and have had them ever since. Speakers listed below are all very good but I like the sound of the Altec's best. I know the Rogers have a great reputation but they do not have the big sound that big speakers can provide.

La Scala's
Cornwalls
Rogers 3/5a's
JBL L200's
 
There is something about a good pair of Altecs which makes all of their flaws insignificant. They move one towards the satisfaction of listening to music and away from all of the audiophile trivia.

I've heard my Altecs sound superb with stock power cords, el-cheapo interconnects and hardware store bought speaker wire. Conversely, I've heard big name current well reviewed gear with multi thousand dollar power cords, multi thousand dollar interconnects, and multi thousand dollar speaker cables in multi thousand dollar treated rooms sound lifeless and utterly uninteresting. That's not a criticism of expensive cabling and an endorsement of el-cheapo cabling. More an indication that all of the peripherals are like make-up.

You can take a gorgeous woman, and she will remain gorgeous without a scrap of makeup on. No amount of makeup will enhance a vulture. The Altecs just shine because of their inherent qualities. Some other gear only seems to sound good in the system of a reviewer who gives it gushing praise.

I do enhance my Altecs, and my other gear. A little makeup on a gorgeous woman can be very appealing. :D
 
GTOJim said:
I stand corrected again. Think I better stick with listening/enjoying my 19's as I do not want to give incorrect information or advice.

Kind of like the old saying "I know just enough to be dangerous".

I assembled my 19's without ever hearing a pair, these are the first and only 19's I've had the pleasure of listening to and it was not a disappointment.
I'll keep enjoying my Altec's and let the experts give advice.
Click to expand...
It's like an unwritten rule with Altec, much is not quite as simple as it first seems, and there's at least one exception for nearly every rule. They made it very difficult to accurately use the words "always" and "never" when describing their products.

In the case of the 416-8A a lot has to do with the vintage/timing. Altec began introduction of the 16 inch frame in about 1972-73. At that time there was probably still a pretty hefty supply of the old style frames on hand. So, if you bought a factory system between 1973 and late 1975 that used a 416 or 420 it wouldn't be surprising to find either style frame on the woofer, or even one of each in some cases.

Are there major differences between the 416-8A and B woofers except for production dates?
Click to expand...
The "B" version 416 is the only alnico 416 that uses a one piece cast magnetic return pot. The rest of the alnico 416's use steel pipe and plate welded together to form the magnetic return circuit(pot). While the differences are not huge, it sounds and specs differently from the others. Then again, maybe that is a huge difference.:scratch2:
 
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GTOJim said:
My cabinets are not as wide as factory so they won't fit, there is very little space between the edge of the horn and the lip of the cabinet.
Click to expand...

Jim, do you happen to know the internal volume of those cabinets?
They look great, btw! Nice job on your project...
 
Alien_Shore said:
Jim, do you happen to know the internal volume of those cabinets?
They look great, btw! Nice job on your project...
Click to expand...

Sorry I do not know the internal volume. The person who made the cabinets said the internal volume is the same as the original. The outside dimension is roughly 21 X 21 X 51 if this helps.
 
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