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Amp Killers!

They play so loud you that you won't be able to stay in the same room or even the house while they are playing, I tried it with two adcom GFA 565 monoblocks driving my K 9's and a bunch of my neighbors from blocks away came to my house because they were so loud, that was the only time I pushed my K 9's to see what they were capable of, it was loud.
In my 20s, we measured 126dB in my living room at 15feet playing APP The Gold Bug. Meters on my strapped MC2300s were buried. This capped off an alcohol fueled battle of the amps at my place. The next morning, one of the inductors in the xover was dead shorted ... Go figure.

Now-a-days, I listen at fractions of a Watt and enjoy it just as much. Would be fun to put the speaker killers to the test though!
 
Wow .. Very suprising "okie" ((((( 65 wpc and the k9 sounds great )))) ( At low ish volume )

Between that and the current Ren 90 thread with op running them with same amp I use on my K6.1 ( Adcom 545 ) and im really confused ( Head Scratch )
Then a pair of Rs 6bs Murders 4 amps ( And gets away with it ) LOL
BTW Bahamayellow .. Your K9s sound Great with that piece of music ! And I only heard through my laptop .. Have to play that through my K6.1 so I can hear what the K9 really sounds like !! Haa

Thanks listn. I also posted another video with vocals in the same thread. My K9s rarely go above 30 watts on the meters. I know meters can be off also. At 50 watts I start to fold time and space. Lol.

Signal chain is 2 carver Tfm-25s bi amped. Parasound Zpre amp, onkyo DV-501 CD player.

 
Surprised no one mentioned Polk SDA, instantly kill any amp that dual mono, instantly kill mono blocks aw well.
 
I love this thread, and especially the side conversation(s)


126 db is HUGE, for example we are db limited at EDC to 120 db at (I forget the distance, probably FOH) and 120, a true 120 db is knock you over loud. I mean your clothes are fluttering, and you are vibrating from the audio waves. When you speak, the spl causes cavitation in your speech. I've never measured anything over 110 in my home(s), I have been listening LOUD lately because I'm trying to track down, eliminate anything in my signal path causing noise or distortion, which requires a lot of loud music due to my finally aquiring of a pair of Magnplaner true ribbons

Loud as hell in my house is 86-94 db right now, multiple craptacular cell phone mics. My 'normal' listening volume is much lower, 65-75db on average.

I've been a crazy fan of The Alan Parsons Project since I picked up a spanish release of 'Tales of Imagination' on cassette when I was looking for the then current pop track'Eye in the Sky', but really for the opening, Sirius, although I didn't know it then. (I've been a fan of Poe since childhood, both his stories and especially his poetry, They were written as much for the 'feel' of the words as the intent of the words, iow very musical)
I carried around and listened to side one of that cassette everywhere, all the time. I'd owned it for over a year (this is my early teens) before I listened to side B. I was raised on classical music, and actually sort of expected to become a professional (Classical, of course) Pianist, so had no interest in hearing anything remotely classical sounding....
One night in our underground fortress, (we'd dug it six feet down in the desert, threw over a playwood flat someone scored, installed a couch, all the skin mags we could find in teh desert, etc, and it became a regular hang out. Anyway, that night we'd been drinking 'suicide' (iow a mixture from every liqour bottle in nicks grandparents house iirc) and I finally played side B all the way through as we burned a joint.

Talk about mind blown!

from that moment on I became a rabid fan, and early on acquired every studio album, and every subsequent album and have never since that day been without some version.
But Tales of Mystery and Imagination, I sought out original vinyl pressings to get the best sound quality I could, and longed for a cd release for years. Imagine my surprise, (and chagrin) to hear how he'd re-recorded and remixed what he didn't re-record and tore the 'heart' out of it......(I could pontificate for a very long time here on the different sound qualities of every pressing and since the digital revolution, every remaster, and every single cd release of this album, but I'll hold of for now.) suffice to say the MoFi release first on Vinyl, then Cd is THE one to own, no question about it.

So, I have used Alan Parsons Project tracks for demoing every speaker I've ever owned, or been around, and is one of the key ways I measure and value a system for its ability to reproduce... music.

Speaking of which, I do believe it's time to spin that entire album (digitally, of course) on my new speakers at average db of ~90 now.

...well, slap my heinie and call me sam, I've just clipped my Carver PM 350 for the first time, and I mean the clip light came on pretty much steady.... That's a first. These speakers are power hogs from hell! MG 2.5R and the Raven at ~85-90 average db.
I haven't sent it into protection, and I don't plan to, but damn! that was drawing solid 10 amp peaks from my power supply
I've only ever even seen that clip light blink at ultra high db levels with my Rens, and that was stupid loud, far louder then I listen.
I swapped from my PM 1.5 to the PM 350 because these ribbons let me hear some 'deficiencies' in the treble reproduction vs another amp I have in the system, with an A/B switch.

Now I'm going to have to bridge my two PM 350s and see what that results in.....(evil laughter and wringing of hands ensues)
 
Thanks listn. I also posted another video with vocals in the same thread. My K9s rarely go above 30 watts on the meters. I know meters can be off also. At 50 watts I start to fold time and space. Lol.

Signal chain is 2 carver Tfm-25s bi amped. Parasound Zpre amp, onkyo DV-501 CD player.


describe for me your bi-amp schematic, would you?

I also, on (for example) never saw more then 5-10 watt actual swings on my TFM-15cb, and on my M 1.5t (historically on all my other speakers)the led's rarely budged from their bottom (lowest power) led. unless I was really cranking it LOL.
on these 2.5R's at 'normal listening levels' the leds of my PM 1.5 was usually on the second or third from bottom led, and moving up and down in sequence to the peaks and valleys of the music, so they require a LOT more power, so I think I'm going to try biamping before bridgeing, as I've read (and heard) that carver amps lose some 'control' especially with regards to bass when bridged. I never saw the 1.5 clip, but I didn't listen this loud with it. I've got balanced pass through for signal on both PM 350's, so chaining the two amps so they both get the same signal is simple, but I'm unsure how I'll wire them,

Do you wire one amp to the highs and one amp to the lows on your speakers?


and in reply to a earlier post, I think the Adcom 54xx series are some of the best sounding amps I've ever used on any speakers. I've got a 5400 that continually amazes me how good it makes any speaker, from my rens to my maggies to my kappas to my crescendos to my ls50s to (etc, etc) sound. I think it's that whole series one of the great, Great amplifiers, only limited by ultimate power handling.
 
describe for me your bi-amp schematic, would you?

I also, on (for example) never saw more then 5-10 watt actual swings on my TFM-15cb, and on my M 1.5t (historically on all my other speakers)the led's rarely budged from their bottom (lowest power) led. unless I was really cranking it LOL.
on these 2.5R's at 'normal listening levels' the leds of my PM 1.5 was usually on the second or third from bottom led, and moving up and down in sequence to the peaks and valleys of the music, so they require a LOT more power, so I think I'm going to try biamping before bridgeing, as I've read (and heard) that carver amps lose some 'control' especially with regards to bass when bridged. I never saw the 1.5 clip, but I didn't listen this loud with it. I've got balanced pass through for signal on both PM 350's, so chaining the two amps so they both get the same signal is simple, but I'm unsure how I'll wire them,

Do you wire one amp to the highs and one amp to the lows on your speakers?


and in reply to a earlier post, I think the Adcom 54xx series are some of the best sounding amps I've ever used on any speakers. I've got a 5400 that continually amazes me how good it makes any speaker, from my rens to my maggies to my kappas to my crescendos to my ls50s to (etc, etc) sound. I think it's that whole series one of the great, Great amplifiers, only limited by ultimate power handling.


Hi jazz so my bi amp is pretty simple. I have 1 set of rca cables coming off the preamp. Off the Rca ends I have a splitter on each one. I use one amp in full stereo mode for each speaker. I use the left and right channels of each amp off the splitter. I use the left side stereo of amp for highs and right for the lows off one amp. Then use the other amp same way for the other speaker. Running amps full range. I tried mono and it doesn't have much control and doesn't sound very good.

If u have a better amp for the top u would have to run some longer rca off the splitter to use both left channels of each amp and the same for the right. Here is a diagram of my set up. It's crude. Let me know if it makes sense.

image.jpeg
 
Did you know:
hmmmm ... there was a thread on an audio board "How loud do you listen" I'm not going into detail but guys and girls actually brag about listening to 100-120DB+ music . An audiologist piped in with a large rant etc etc ... and posted pics. I just copied this one.
No wonder I have bad hearing... WHAT ??

Either there's alot BS going on here or science is wrong.
bs-meter2.jpeg


22852045_1713207748698529_3353030519626153071_n.jpg
 
I wouldn't consider the RSIIIa/b speakers to be amp killers. I have driven mine with a 75 wpc tube amp, 100wpc Marantz 16 amp, Marantz PM8004 integrated 70wpc, and am currently using a Soundcraftsmen A5002 @ 250 wpc. The SC amp drives them best. They will and do like high current and will sound their best, but not necessary. But amp killer :no:
 
I tend towards viewing the Kappa 9 as a poorly designed speaker. No speaker should be released with seemingly benign specifications yet can only adequately be powered by a handful of consumer amplifiers. What's interesting is that some seem to think that the ability to kill an amp ought be a point of pride.

I'm glad somebody said this. That's what I was thinking too. Putting this much stress on an amplifier seems like a serious design flaw to me, but I guess that's another discussion

What if it was a lamp instead of an amp killed.

Yes, it is like stating a specifying a lamp for max 100 watts bulb, but in reality it is 25 watts if using safely.. You put in the 100watts bulb, and the plastic or wood outside catches fire and lamp burns itself (and maybe the house, too).

You Stupid Consumer, you should have known this 100 watts lamp is not to be used in conjunction with a 100 watts bulb.
Because although your lamp or house is burnt you should have consulted the lampophiles community first since it is a well known highly regarded designer super duper lamp.

Your sort of consumer should not be entitled to use this kind of lamp.
.
:thumbsup:

hilarious.

It is a hobby that plays on insider knowledge though, so things aren't a surprise. Kind of like how most hallmark audio gear (early marantz, dynaco, ortofon, thorens, mac, altec, etc) are worth an enormous amount of money... with the correct updates. everybody loves to be an insider
 
The graph below posted by AK'er 240 Volts in the thread Why 4 Ohm Loads Stress Your Amplifier is an excellent illustration of how much greater transistor dissipation (heat) is at 4 ohms vs 8 ohms for a typical class AB amplifier. You don't need to crank the volume to stress an amp that isn't designed to handle low impedance.

View attachment 1011457

Don't tell anyone, but I'm running a chromecast zone with a Yamaha receiver which has speaker outputs for two pairs. 8 ohms is specified if you're running two pairs. One of my pairs is 4-ohm rated. I keep checking for heat but haven't felt any. I'm figuring the amp is Class D (it's a R-S202). What's the worst I can expect to happen? You don't have to tell me this isn't recommended-- I already know that.

99% of the time, I'm listening to piano jazz at about 60dB I think ;) Let's say I want to test the system and play Zep at 100dB. Or let's say I already did, and there was trivial heat as a result. What's the worst that can happen? People say "you'll fry your amp" but 1) it hasn't happened and 2) the amp is cheap anyway. Is there some other specific risk?

PS: My Kappas are not in this particular mix :)
 
By putting the 4 and 8 ohm speakers together you get 2.67 ohm load on your amp, that's probably why they don't recommend it. Your amp could only put out so much. So when the peaks, especially at low freqs go above the rail voltage of the amp they clip. Which puts DC into your speakers for the amount of clipping time, the lower the frequency the warmer the amp gets and the speaker coils. So which ever side can't handle the overload for any extended period of time will probably go south. Doesn't matter how much DB it's the limits of the amp and how long the speaker can handle distortion.
My 0.02
John
 
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Thanks--this is very useful knowledge for me. Though I'm not sure I understand why the listening levels aren't a factor.

I do have good speakers in that zone and don't want to damage them. Perhaps I'll rig up a second amp for one of the pairs, though the limiting factor there is cabinet depth. Otherwise I'd have a much better amp there in the first place.
 
Went with a QSC GX-5, the first amp to really take control of those 8's and in a good way. Never had any problems other than the fan, which I installed my own switch for on and off voiding the warranty. It was the first time I felt the kappas really came to life

My oldest son now has the 8's and the amp still in use today and absolutely loves them.
Can I ask are you running a receiver with the QSC and if so, how did you go from unbalanced to balanced for the input side of the QSC? I have some RSIIIA’s that I’m looking at a pro amp for.
 
Can I ask are you running a receiver with the QSC and if so, how did you go from unbalanced to balanced for the input side of the QSC? I have some RSIIIA’s that I’m looking at a pro amp for.
It's pretty trivial to go from unbalanced to balanced; there are various diagrams online but basically you connect the center lead from the unbalanced output to the + or - pin of the balanced input, then the ground goes to the other two. If your output level isn't high enough then you can use a matching amp which are pretty cheap on eBay.
 
It’s easy, though I don’t have the QSC anymore, switched to Crown because the fans are so quite I never hear them.

Both have RCA connections on the back, along with the rest. If you search images on one you might be interested in, just look on the back at you’ll see if that model has them or not.
 
Both have RCA connections on the back, along with the rest. If you search images on one you might be interested in, just look on the back at you’ll see if that model has them or not.
RCA connectors aren't too common on pro amps, though (I have several amps from Crown, Rane and QSC, and none of them have RCAs), and manufacturers sometimes make several different versions of an amp, with different types of inputs and outputs, which may not be obvious from the model number stamped on the front. So a Google image search isn't a guarantee.
 
The RCA's on the back are one reason I chose to buy a Crown XLS amp.
Same for my ART HQ-231 equalizer, it has RCA's.


Is the consensus that the 4.5's are NOT amp killers?
AK'er MAVRICK is asking about that in the General Audio section.
 
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