Sure isn't how I listen to music.
Anti-vibration obsession - why amps?
- Thread starter johnnm
- Start date
Sure isn't how I listen to music.
Tangent
Sweet nightmares!
Makes it hard to turn on the stereo system, too.
I have found that long term listening is the best for me. Do whatever changes you need to. Listen for a few days or weeks. Switch back.
Difference = better? Difference = worse? Difference = so slight that it's simply not worth the cost? Difference = zero?
Now you have your answer.
JonL
Lunatic Member
Makes it hard to turn on the stereo system, too.
I have found that long term listening is the best for me. Do whatever changes you need to. Listen for a few days or weeks. Switch back.
Difference = better? Difference = worse? Difference = so slight that it's simply not worth the cost? Difference = zero?
Now you have your answer.
Me too. I like the idea of double-blind testing in principle, but I think it is hard to apply to audio. It would be interesting to use a combination of double blind and long term listening. Have a disinterested party replace some component, not tell you with what, and let you listen for a week or so. Repeat as necessary.
Art K.
The Voodoo You Do!
Mr. Lin
Lunatic Member
That's highly debatable in audio, as we've discussed here before.
Agreed 100%
wajobu
Boing Boom Tschak
Exactly.
Tangent
Sweet nightmares!
Speaking of doubles...
Seriously, though:
Some days I have not really been "in the mood" to listen to music. Didn't sound satisfying or whatever - I just could not get into it. Upset? Dissatisfied with my job? Whatever.
Then other days I just could not turn off the stereo! I was wishing that I did not have to work the next day.
The human condition/mind set can be very powerful!
Seriously, though:
Some days I have not really been "in the mood" to listen to music. Didn't sound satisfying or whatever - I just could not get into it. Upset? Dissatisfied with my job? Whatever.
Then other days I just could not turn off the stereo! I was wishing that I did not have to work the next day.
The human condition/mind set can be very powerful!
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Mr. Lin
Lunatic Member
Speaking of doubles...
Seriously, though:
Some days I have not really been "in the mood" to listen to music. Didn't sound satisfying or whatever - I just could not get into it. Upset? Dissatisfied with my job? Whatever.
Then other days I just could not turn off the stereo! I was wishing that I did not have to work the next day.
The human condition/mind set can be very powerful!
So true, I had one of those days yesterday, my day off. I was all excited to spend the day listening to music, but I just couldn't get into it. Today however...
Herr Eickhorn
Born again Alien
I believe the Russians were using tubes in their airplanes while the US had moved on.
However in the event of a nuclear war, tubes would still function (the 'plane will still fly) while US airplanes would be grounded.
Word is that the Russians and Chinese still use tubes in their critical military equipment to protect against EMP.
EMP = electro magnetic pulse. Its what every smart missile officer wants and desires.
In a "first strike" nuclear attack, conventional military strategy is to detonate the first wave of the ICBM's in the atmosphere to generate the desired EMP burst. This will burn out all the solid state electronics in the enemy's command and control systems. The second wave of ICBM's will hit everything else.
But there really is nothing to worry about. Rest assured, that in a nuclear holocaust, your tube HI FI equipment will keep playing!
Mr. Lin
Lunatic Member
Aside from proper vibration control, this is all that really matters. :thmbsp:
any place that sells hydraulic seals. take a tube with you and ask them to find a high temp o-ring that fits it snugly.
oops!
did i just unleash a trade secret thus making many audio boutiques upset?!?:scratch2:
"ItsTooLoud"
Metal Mind
Apparantly Marantz decided in the 1980's that vibration control for amplifiers matters:
"The PM-94 and PM-94 Limited differ somewhat very little: gold looks, wooden sideburns, a special compound added to the four feet for better vibration damping, better caps, phono stage componentry and an added top aluminium plate make the PM-94 Limited."
http://www.thevintageknob.org/MARANTZ/PM94/PM94.html
There is a small pic of the feet that shows the white vibration damping material. The feet on my plain 94 doesn't have this stuff.
"The PM-94 and PM-94 Limited differ somewhat very little: gold looks, wooden sideburns, a special compound added to the four feet for better vibration damping, better caps, phono stage componentry and an added top aluminium plate make the PM-94 Limited."
http://www.thevintageknob.org/MARANTZ/PM94/PM94.html
There is a small pic of the feet that shows the white vibration damping material. The feet on my plain 94 doesn't have this stuff.
Nice find, an a VERY nice amp!
Bennyboy71
Member
if you vibrate at the same speed as the amp, would that cancel out the need for damping?
Perhaps hi-end manufacturers should do a synergistic deal with these guys?
http://www.vibration-plates.com/
ARE YOU AND YOUR HI-FI BOTH FEELING A BIT HEAVY ON THE BOTTOM END? FOR JUST £25000, OUR REVOLUTIONARY 'PHAT LOSER' SYSTEM WILL TRIM THOSE EXCESS POUNDS IN MORE WAYS THAN ONE. BANISH THOSE TONE PROBLEMS WITH THE ONLY DEVICE THAT TRULY RENDERS YOUR FLABBY MIDS WOBBLE-FREE. WATCH AS THOSE MICROPHONIC STRETCH MARKS VANISH BEFORE YOUR VERY EYES/EARS. AMP UP THOSE ABS AND BANISH THOSE MARITAL BLUES - WITHIN MINUTES YOU'LL HAVE HER INDOORS MOANING ABOUT YOUR SIX PACK, NOT YOUR THICK STAX. OR YOUR MONEY BACK.
Perhaps hi-end manufacturers should do a synergistic deal with these guys?
http://www.vibration-plates.com/
ARE YOU AND YOUR HI-FI BOTH FEELING A BIT HEAVY ON THE BOTTOM END? FOR JUST £25000, OUR REVOLUTIONARY 'PHAT LOSER' SYSTEM WILL TRIM THOSE EXCESS POUNDS IN MORE WAYS THAN ONE. BANISH THOSE TONE PROBLEMS WITH THE ONLY DEVICE THAT TRULY RENDERS YOUR FLABBY MIDS WOBBLE-FREE. WATCH AS THOSE MICROPHONIC STRETCH MARKS VANISH BEFORE YOUR VERY EYES/EARS. AMP UP THOSE ABS AND BANISH THOSE MARITAL BLUES - WITHIN MINUTES YOU'LL HAVE HER INDOORS MOANING ABOUT YOUR SIX PACK, NOT YOUR THICK STAX. OR YOUR MONEY BACK.
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Tangent
Sweet nightmares!
Yea, good luck with that.
The first vibration "experiment" I did was with bubble wrap from a package that someone sent me. Much to my surprise, I heard a tonal difference.
"ItsTooLoud"
Metal Mind
Yea, good luck with that.
The first vibration "experiment" I did was with bubble wrap from a package that someone sent me. Much to my surprise, I heard a tonal difference.
Did you wrap your head or your torso?
Tangent
Sweet nightmares!
That's over at the weight loss forum.
This is a music/stereo forum. Are you lost?
Put the bubble wrap under the amp. Tell yourself that it won't affect anything and you'll be proven right.
Put the bubble wrap under the amp and tell yourself that it'll change the sound and you'll be proven right.
Put the bubble wrap under the amp with no preconceived notions and listen to see if 1) there is a difference, 2) if there is a difference determine if it's good or bad and 3) be assured that no matter what your results are, the results for others will be different.
There may even be different results for different systems that you have.
beerdraft
Active Member
Bubble Wrap?? that is just to weird. You guys talk about SNAKE OIL? If it were that easy to get vibration control everybody would be doing it. I don't think such a cheap test of this nature should prove or disprove anything. Everyone must live with there system, so in that regard good luck and happy listening. Don't close your mind to things you can't explain though. I think vibration tweaks are good but they do have different affects on different pieces. Get some racks maybe that take care of the problem and be done with the tweaking. By the way I would think the air inside bubble wrap would send off vibrations to some extent when music is playing. Thats just me.
sheltie dave
Addicted Member
Beerdraft, it is hard to grasp, but every material we touch has a damping ratio. Nothing is a 100% energy/vibration transmitter.
The key is to lessen the degree of vibration/oscillation to where it does not interfere with your system.
For the DIY approach, if $5 of bubble wrap works, why pitch it under the bus? I know my Marantz 8B recently made it home via UPS, packed in a new $20 box, lined with three inches of double sealed foam insulation, wrapped in small cell bubble wrap, and more cardboard and peanuts to boot. In this case, it made it without a scratch - UPS only managed to put a three inch gash in the double thickness box, and thus ended four inches short of the intended target.
If something works, it can be effective from the get go and be cheap. There is no monopoly associated with effective quality, if you understand the dynamic of the problem, and apply the right approach.
The key is to lessen the degree of vibration/oscillation to where it does not interfere with your system.
For the DIY approach, if $5 of bubble wrap works, why pitch it under the bus? I know my Marantz 8B recently made it home via UPS, packed in a new $20 box, lined with three inches of double sealed foam insulation, wrapped in small cell bubble wrap, and more cardboard and peanuts to boot. In this case, it made it without a scratch - UPS only managed to put a three inch gash in the double thickness box, and thus ended four inches short of the intended target.
If something works, it can be effective from the get go and be cheap. There is no monopoly associated with effective quality, if you understand the dynamic of the problem, and apply the right approach.
beerdraft
Active Member
Good point Dave, I would just hate to see someone try bubble wrap and stop at that if it don't work. It don't seem to me it would supply a consistent form of rigidness for anything to sit on. Vibration I can say I believe to be important but rigid and consistent seems also as important. The Cerapuc was something I tried with success and its a rigid surface of some type of hard rubber or something on a heavy duty Stainless Steel puck. This worked great on everything but my esoteric cdp and actually worked well on another cdp.