buying a vintage turntable, plesase help:)

[mjpliska]

Hello,
I am an absolute newbie trying to buy some budget friendly yet decent turntable, so I went for a vintage one. I have these three options:

- Onkyo CP-1026A Direct Drive, Reject / Autoreturn
- Dual CS-607 Direct Drive, Autoreturn
- Telefunken S-800 Direct Drive, Manual

Onkyo has a 'new original Audio Technica cartridge', stylus is not mentioned. 'new original' sounds weird, but it may be just a bad formulation.
Dual has an 'original Dual cartridge' and a 'new eliptic stylus'.
Telefunken has a 'perfect Ortofon F-15E cartridge' and also a 'new eliptic stylus'.

Prices all pretty much the same, about 90 eur / 100 usd.

Is anybody here able to help me with choosing? Should I go for a manual turntable (is it hard to place the stylus right?)?

Thank you very much for answers,
MP

 

[audio-ed]

Look up all 3 turntables on google. A lot of the info will be from audio karma .If you go with vintage you may need to find someone local a tech or maybe a member here to help if you have a problem. Not knowing much about turntables early on never stopped me. Now we have the internet and youtube.Let us know your location there could be someone down the street. Welcome to Audio karma.

 

[avionic]

Vinylengine.com

https://www.vinylengine.com/library.shtml

 

[avionic]

Welcome aboard mjp..

 

[mjpliska]

Thanks,
that is the problem - I haven't found much, as technical info doesn't speak to me really (yet ). But I googled them now again and I found out that Onkyo is actually belt driven... my bad.
I live in Prague, cz

 

[Trekkie4]

Voted Telefunken... I know my reasons for picking Telefunken over the other two models, but that being said - I'm not sure how relevant these reasons would be to your doubts & your expectations since you are the one buying the turntable and not one of us, voting to your poll.

 

[mjpliska]

Voted Telefunken... I know my reasons for picking Telefunken over the other two models, but that being said - I'm not sure how relevant these reasons would be to your doubts & your expectations since you are the one buying the turntable and not one of us, voting to your poll.

Thank you for your vote, the poll maybe isn't too relevant here, I was just playing around with the options of threads...
May I ask you what some of those reasons are?

 

[BillWojo]

Best advice I can give you is not to be in a hurry. None of those tables would get me excited, they are all lower end units. Take the time to research them, learn the specification language and what the specs actually mean. Keep doing that with other tables, even ones a bit out of your price range and try and educate yourself. We are always here to help you, ask questions but take your time.
Learn to use the database on Vinyl Engine, it's a free forum but you need to join. Google everything you see for sale.
I'm not sure what the market is in your country but check thrift shops, boot sales, where ever used goods are sold. That will also help you to find some albums as your looking.
Sooner or later something much nicer will come along at a price you can afford.

BillWojo

 

[beatcomber]

I live in Prague, cz

Great city, I visited there two years ago.

I went to the big flea market, and found some cool Czech records, including this one:

 

[mjpliska]

Best advice I can give you is not to be in a hurry. None of those tables would get me excited, they are all lower end units. Take the time to research them, learn the specification language and what the specs actually mean. Keep doing that with other tables, even ones a bit out of your price range and try and educate yourself. We are always here to help you, ask questions but take your time.
Learn to use the database on Vinyl Engine, it's a free forum but you need to join. Google everything you see for sale.
I'm not sure what the market is in your country but check thrift shops, boot sales, where ever used goods are sold. That will also help you to find some albums as your looking.
Sooner or later something much nicer will come along at a price you can afford.

BillWojo

I just can't wait to get a turntable! But you are right, of course, these just seemed good enough for me...
As far as I have already discovered, flea markets are a great place for vinyl hunting, unfortunately not so much for getting a turntable. Czech online market places offer a lot of turntables, but 90% of them are of soviet or socialistic manufacturing (not good), or just the cheapest models without any possibility of modifying pressure and stuff. But I keep looking

 

[mjpliska]

Great city, I visited there two years ago.

I went to the big flea market, and found some cool Czech records, including this one:

It sure is!
The record is nice, I see some great names

 

[beatcomber]

It sure is!
The record is nice, I see some great names

Yeah, it's pretty cool!
We never get to hear this kind of stuff in the USA.

Looking for old records in the Czech Republic was very challenging. In most countries I visit, there are enough visual cues on the covers to help me make an informed guess about the music. As I'm sure you know, in the old Czechoslovakia there were (I think) only two state-run record companies, and they used generic sleeve designs for almost everything, with the titles over-printed. The Czech language has very little in common with English, so I had no idea what I was looking at most of the time.

If I ever get to go back, I will have to do some research about what to look for before I go!

 

[T68]

Of those three turntables I would probably go whith the telefunken. It looks suspiciously similar to those TT:s CEC in Japan made for other brands and that is not at all a bad thing.

 

[Trekkie4]

Thank you for your vote, the poll maybe isn't too relevant here, I was just playing around with the options of threads...
May I ask you what some of those reasons are?

Sure thing... I picked the Telefunken because it's the only turntable out of the 3 choices which has a standard S-shaped tonearm with the SME connector. And for me personally, it is all about being able to swap the headshells (and therefore cartridges) on the fly, without having to unscrew & calibrate them over & over again.

Onkyo of course has a straight tonearm & despite having a removable (ADC, apparently) headshell, it's not as convenient as S-shaped arm in my personal opinion. You could, of course buy additional ADC shells & be able to swap the entire assemblies on the fly, but finding ADC headshells can be be difficult depending on your location & they are usually far more expensive than standard, "Technics" type SME ones.

Dual is a weird one. It doesn't appear to accept standard 1/2" mount cartridges (the original cartridge looks weird & unusual), although I've seen the pictures online of other people mounting & using standard cartridges on their CS-607. However, to use the standard 1/2" cartridge you apparently need to have additional parts, some sort of mounting adapter. IDK, hopefully someone who is more experienced with Duals will explain this &/or prove me wrong. But even with the mounting adapter, it doesn't seem to have a removable headshell, which makes the cartridge installation very tricky & quite difficult.

So the only remaining choice is going to be that Telefunken... S-shaped arm, which you can easily configure the way you want it... But again - this is just me & my personal choice, it all comes down to what you want & expect

 

[Blue Shadow]

The Onkyo uses specific headshells. the Dual is even worse for that specificity.

The Tele uses a standard headshell and that might be a good thing. The cartridge on it is fine, too.

These are entry level tables and more looking might help but if you have to have a table soon...

 

[mjpliska]

So, in general, you all think that Telefunken is probably the best one of these three, but I should keep looking for a better offer?

 

[Blue Shadow]

Yes.

Keep looking...how soon MUST you have a table? How many tables show up in your price range?

I only buy when it is a deal and it is a good unit. I'm not without an item and in need and I'm not collecting even though it looks like I am.

 

[Trekkie4]

So, in general, you all think that Telefunken is probably the best one of these three, but I should keep looking for a better offer?

One thing I would like to point out however ... and this is where I don't expect most of the others to agree with me (but it is a fact, nevertheless).

Couple of years ago, I was in the market for a new turntable, myself. And I remember posting a very similar thread asking for the opinion. I knew what I wanted (SL-1200 or the look-alike), and I also knew which technical attributes I wanted to see (Direct drive, S-shaped tonearm, etc), and so one of the most commonly seen & heard recommendations which kept showing around was Audio Technica LP-120.

However, people kept telling me to wait ... because "sooner or later there's going to be a real Technics on sale somewhere, so why bother with the clones when I can buy the real deal, for the same price". In reality however, this NEVER happened. And just to clarify, it's been over 2, closer to 3 years now so you'd expect something to show up during all this time. In fact, it happened just the opposite really - prices went up & through the roof!

Thing is, that the situation in one country differs from other one. So, to someone in United States it is almost impossible to know & predict what's the situation going to be like in Prague, without actually living there & knowing the facts. Also, you need to take into consideration the economy - people losing their jobs & money will result with the increase of sale prices & their decision to maintain the impossible value, rather than what the item is actually worth. And this isn't just for turntables, the same rule applies to just about anything... I keep seeing SL-1200 on sale all the time, all of them locally available. However, the average price for a preserved unit is around 530 & goes all the way up to 900€. Where on the other hand, that same turntable might only be worth 400€ (or less) in the States. Or another example, the famous Audio Technica AT-3600L cartridge, which can be bought from China for around $10 - it's being sold locally for "just" 40$. Why? Because it was removed from a Dual-branded turntable & therefore labeled as "genuine Audio Technica for Dual", even though it doesn't have ANY connections to Dual turntables.

That being said, I don't want to discourage you from waiting & taking a look at the other models. See what else is being offered, check out all the local ads & portals which might have used used HiFi & electronics - but in the end be prepared to go with one of these three turntables IF you can't find anything better &/or to afford higher budget.

 

[Grenadeslio]

One thing I would like to point out however ... and this is where I don't expect most of the others to agree with me (but it is a fact, nevertheless).

Couple of years ago, I was in the market for a new turntable, myself. And I remember posting a very similar thread asking for the opinion. I knew what I wanted (SL-1200 or the look-alike), and I also knew which technical attributes I wanted to see (Direct drive, S-shaped tonearm, etc), and so one of the most commonly seen & heard recommendations which kept showing around was Audio Technica LP-120.

However, people kept telling me to wait ... because "sooner or later there's going to be a real Technics on sale somewhere, so why bother with the clones when I can buy the real deal, for the same price". In reality however, this NEVER happened. And just to clarify, it's been over 2, closer to 3 years now so you'd expect something to show up during all this time. In fact, it happened just the opposite really - prices went up & through the roof!

Thing is, that the situation in one country differs from other one. So, to someone in United States it is almost impossible to know & predict what's the situation going to be like in Prague, without actually living there & knowing the facts. Also, you need to take into consideration the economy - people losing their jobs & money will result with the increase of sale prices & their decision to maintain the impossible value, rather than what the item is actually worth. And this isn't just for turntables, the same rule applies to just about anything... I keep seeing SL-1200 on sale all the time, all of them locally available. However, the average price for a preserved unit is around 530 & goes all the way up to 900€. Where on the other hand, that same turntable might only be worth 400€ (or less) in the States. Or another example, the famous Audio Technica AT-3600L cartridge, which can be bought from China for around $10 - it's being sold locally for "just" 40$. Why? Because it was removed from a Dual-branded turntable & therefore labeled as "genuine Audio Technica for Dual", even though it doesn't have ANY connections to Dual turntables.

That being said, I don't want to discourage you from waiting & taking a look at the other models. See what else is being offered, check out all the local ads & portals which might have used used HiFi & electronics - but in the end be prepared to go with one of these three turntables IF you can't find anything better &/or to afford higher budget.

Did you put a search in on eBay, or just your local Craigs list? Purchased a pristine SL1200MKII through eBay for a young friend just starting out about 2yrs ago so about the same time frame. Paid $300 and it came with a cartridge and new replacement stylus, pictures below.






Did I mention it also came in the original box with the owners manual included?

 

[Trekkie4]

Did you put a search in on eBay, or just your local Craigs list? Purchased a pristine SL1200MKII through eBay for a young friend just starting out about 2yrs ago so about the same time frame. Paid $300 and it came with a cartridge and new replacement stylus, pictures below.

View attachment 1958103
View attachment 1958104
View attachment 1958107
View attachment 1958106

Did I mention it also came in the original box with the owners manual included?

No, in my particular case neither Craigs List (not available in my country) or eBay (delivery fees) were possible. I mean sure - you can have it delivered (and/or imported), but it's obviously going to increase the fees, so you might as well buy it locally then (at this point it would cost you roughly the same, depending on a location & asking price)