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Cart the least important in vinyl replay chain, well according to Linn..

My descending order would be : Cartridge. Arm. Phono Stage. Table.

In my experience, the two components that have the greatest overall impact in dramatically impacting the sound are the cartridge and speakers.
 
Question, have a Mitsubishi dp ec8. I balanced the arm, set the weight and the anti skating. The arm slides across the record as if it's too light. When I set the anti s to 0, it plays just fine. What am I doing wrong? First time I've had this issue
 
Mike 13 said:
Question, have a Mitsubishi dp ec8. I balanced the arm, set the weight and the anti skating. The arm slides across the record as if it's too light. When I set the anti s to 0, it plays just fine. What am I doing wrong? First time I've had this issue
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Nice table.
 
cafe latte said:
This is something Linn used to say years ago which I never believed, but maybe there is truth in it after all..
Cant remember the order they used to put the components but Turntable was first and arm for sure was second, then I think it was phono preamp, then cables I think (this bit I dont believe but another topic) then last cartridge. I have as a few here know a lot of carts some quite expensive and I love their differences so for me this Linn thing putting cart last did not make sense, but think I am getting it.
Recently for fun been messing about with bottom feeder carts just for fun, the AT3600l which has been discussed a lot on the forum of late. Also a AT95e, a ATvm95c, AATvm95ml also the AT91 and a few sure carts, even a Trackmaster with a d71ee hifi stylus in it with plastic body removed. Results of testing are that all can sound great on a good turntable with a good arm and good amplification and speakers. Actually listening today to the AT95e on a few of my turntables using the DNM preamp and my homebrew 185wpc mosfet heavily biased into class A with ATC scm 100's the humble AT95e sounded fantastic. Do other carts sound better? Yes of course but nothing is a massive improvement, just a bit better in some areas.
The AT95e has been known for a long time as a good value cart, but I cant help thinking that most who use it probably fit it to very budget systems and it almost never gets fitted to higher end gear. IMO though from recent tests carts like these on decent gear can give quite shocking results. Maybe Linn had something when they made those claims all those years ago?
Chris
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'tis why I started with good equipment first, and then start going nuts on carts and styli. My wife still hates me.... ;)
 
Mike 13 said:
Question, have a Mitsubishi dp ec8. I balanced the arm, set the weight and the anti skating.

The arm slides across the record as if it's too light. When I set the anti s to 0, it plays just fine.

What am I doing wrong? First time I've had this issue
Click to expand...

Welcome to the AK turn table forum.

What VTF - verticle tracking force are you using ?

1.5 grams or lower ? :idea:
 
And Linn is now,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,down the road. Just couldn't keep up I guess, or refused to change.
 
slate1 said:
My descending order would be : Cartridge. Arm. Phono Stage. Table.

In my experience, the two components that have the greatest overall impact in dramatically impacting the sound are the cartridge and speakers.
Click to expand...
Linn was just talking about the vinyl replay part, but even with speakers they need to be a match for the amp.
I think what Linn were getting is true, putting a 1k cart on a cheap turntable with a rubbish arm and phono stage wont give you a good sound, in fact a far better sound can be had with a budget cart (Linn used basically AT95's rebadged) with a great turntable and a good arm with a decent phonostage. It makes sense if you think about it.. Nobody is saying that when everything else is right a better cart wont improve things, but Linn was saying the cart makes the least difference. I love all my carts and recently come full circle any just for fun started playing with cheaper carts and was shocked just how good they sound. Then read about the theory Linn had on carts and now my vinyl replay gear is good comparing my carts some up to 2k it is amazing how good the cheap ones perform.
Point is people dont put a 50 dollar cart on expensive turntables and arms with expensive phono stages. Most of us me included buy carts to match the gear. Taking a step backwards was an education for sure and really does point to Linn being correct.
Chris
 
Freddymac2 said:
I do not have a very good TT and I know it. The clear separation and placement of instruments/artists on a clearly defined stage is not heard on the lessor cartridges I have tried, and that makes a big difference to me.
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Point is getting a better turntable, arm and phonostage will make a far bigger difference than changing your cart.
Chris
 
Grenadeslio said:
I find it's about the synergy of the whole, why purchase a great table then hamper it with a budget cartridge? Or purchase an expensive cartridge to install on a bottom feeder table?
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I think though a cheap cart is hampering the good turntable less than you think. Linn at the time argued that bearing noise, room vibration, platter speed and arm quality with vibtational nodes etc all hinder the cart more than the cart hinders a good turntable. I have gone up the cart ladder but keeping all the carts I buy and retipping if needed, this step back was really an education.
Chris
 
Chubba said:
I can sure tell the difference between my Ortofon 2m Blue and my Dynavector 20x2L.
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I can hear the difference between my Grado and my Decca, this is not my point nor Linn, we all know carts types and brands can sound very different. Point is put a 2k cart on an entry level turntable with a cheap arm and phonostage is pointless. Put a decent 50 dollar cart on a very decent turntable with a decent arm and phonostage will sound better for sure a lot better, this is the point. Then see how different the good cart sounds, wont be as much as you think IMO.
Chris
 
We can have different approach to obtaining better sound with our limited resource.

For example, the basic entry level Audio Technica AT 95 or AT 3600 cartridge with the conical stylus is quite inexpensive.

My first AT 95 E came with a bent stylus, an upgrade HE- hyper elliptical stylus was available for almost double the price of an entire new AT 95 cartridge.

The HE was choose as the replacement stylus and the result was far better than one would imagine.

The real value is in the stylus and not the cartridge.

Audio Technica, Nagaoka, Ortofon and other companies have place more value in the different stylus and not so much in the cartridge bodies. :)
 
Balifly said:
We can have different approach to obtaining better sound with our limited resource.

For example, the basic entry level Audio Technica AT 95 or AT 3600 cartridge with the conical stylus is quite inexpensive.

My first AT 95 E came with a bent stylus, an upgrade HE- hyper elliptical stylus was available for almost double the price of an entire new AT 95 cartridge.

The HE was choose as the replacement stylus and the result was far better than one would imagine.

The real value is in the stylus and not the cartridge.

Audio Technica, Nagaoka, Ortofon and other companies have place more value in the different stylus and not so much in the cartridge bodies. :)
Click to expand...
Off topic, just noticed you have Kef 104ab's, I had a pair probably 25 yers ago, I have very fond memories of them :)
Chris
 
cafe latte said:
I think though a cheap cart is hampering the good turntable less than you think. Linn at the time argued that bearing noise, room vibration, platter speed and arm quality with vibtational nodes etc all hinder the cart more than the cart hinders a good turntable. I have gone up the cart ladder but keeping all the carts I buy and retipping if needed, this step back was really an education.
Chris
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Not thinking, knowing.

It's your choice, put a $30 cartridge on your $3500 table, I choose not to.
 
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